proof testing

[moharrow]

this is the test stand to support the barrels during proof firing. you cannot do ths in a gun stock. and as we found out wooden test stands tend to not hold up. the barrel being tested is clamped into the stand and electricly fired
hope that helps

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Also, thanks for obtaining the percentages each proof house in those countries that you list use for the amount the maximum load is exceeded. I had not realized there was such a wide range, though I knew each house has its own muzzleloading standard.

You saved me some money as I have obtained two Italian barrels to compare to two Indian barrels (just as a comparison - not intending on making any "overall" or "difinitive conclusions"), and had I applied the UK standard to the Italian barrels I might have blown them up needlessly, and proved nothing.

LD

 

[moharrow]

glad the information was helpful. and now the finished proofrack

 

[moharrow]

took proof frame to the range today and used it to proof 10 pistol barrels.
it worked extremely well. video will be up soon

 

[Jim K]

I am under the impression that India has a proof law requiring 100% proof of all firearms made in or imported into the country (not counting proof of military firearms, which is a different proposition). Does that not apply to BP guns? If it does, why is there concern about the quality of Indian barrels?

While your work is good, it obviously can be only a sampling and proves only that the barrels you tested did not fail. It does not prove that no Indian barrels can or did fail.

Jim

 

[moharrow]

that law only applies to guns sold in India not to exports. and as India is not a member of CIP ( the International proof testing agreement) their proofs would not be accepted in most European countries.

as for our testing. we are simply trying to determine if there is a widespread problems with Indian barrels and to assure any gun we sell is safe. as I have stated before, any barrel you plan on using should be proofed. but that is just my opinion

 

[mykeal]

it obviously can be only a sampling and proves only that the barrels you tested did not fail. It does not prove that no Indian barrels can or did fail.

Sample proof testing results do have valid meaning for a population. Obviously the larger the sample size the more valid the results are, but it's incorrect to conclude that they apply only to the tested samples. Sample proof testing is used daily by thousands of manufacturers and is widely considered an acceptable method of proving integrity.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Plus if you review post #21 you will see that for muzzleloading barrels the standards are set by each proof house. There are no set standards as there are in barrels that fire modern, fixed ammunition. So if India accepted the CIP and started proofing their muzzleloader barrels, it would still be their standard. Add to that the primary competitor to the Indian barrels are the Italian muskets..., with the lowest of the proofing standards at 140% over max load with a single projectile. The Spaniards are higher in at 200% but they only test samples, not each barrel. The highest is the British at 250% and double weight projectile with every barrel tested..., yet all the countries of the CIP accept each other's proof marks, but clearly the Italian barrel is not expected to survive a British proof load, but it's still considered "safe".

LD

 

[hawkeye74]

I am under the impression that India has a proof law requiring 100% proof of all firearms made in or imported into the country (not counting proof of military firearms, which is a different proposition). Does that not apply to BP guns? If it does, why is there concern about the quality of Indian barrels?

The problem has been that these Indian made pieces have been shipped to the US as decorations, not firearms , vents undrilled, so that they cannot be fired. The vents are then drilled and used as firearms. There have been some spectacular failures and a few injuries.

I am glad to see this testing done. I hope (and it appears so, so far) it is done properly. If a random and fair sampling proof testing is done by a neutral party(no $$$ interest) that shows these things are safe, okay. I probably still will be cautious around them. The ones I have seen don't feel right.

 

[hawkeye74]

clearly the Italian barrel is not expected to survive a British proof load, but it's still considered "safe".

Actually, you don't know if the Italian proofed barrel will survive the British Test. I actually expect it to pass most of the time. But I would expect more failures.

I just know I feel safer with a proofed barrel.

 

[Ryden]

How do they fit a proof load in a bp revolver?

I found that info years ago and printed it out, but I can't find it!

Anyway, the way the London proof house did it was that they loaded the cylinder to max. and put it on an vertical arbor without caps. On top of this they put a weight of X lbs, depending on caliber, and then lit it up by a pile of BP around the base of the cylinder.

That's one heck of a chainfire!