Proper use of a Colt DA trigger

[tiders]

I currently own a Colt Python and I truly enjoy shooting it SA. But my DA targets aren’t as impressive.

Could someone show me a video or give a detailed description of how to do an optimal DA trigger pull on a Colt Python? I’ve seen the Miculeck S&W videos, and have picket up some tips on grips, sights and such. But when he talks of stacking the trigger that’s when I drop of…

I’ve read that back in the day S&W were preferred for DA work and Colts for SA. Getting a new gun however is not an option.

Thanks!

 

[David E]

Four main things:

Put the trigger into the first joint of the trigger finger.

Grip the gun HARDER with the support hand.

Watch the front sight and make sure it stays steady.

Dryfire. A LOT.

.

 

[Old Fuff]

Many old-time Colt shooters would stage the trigger. You pull it backwards until you feel (and sometimes hear) the cylinder bolt release and pop up. At this point you get your final sight alignment as you finish the remaining trigger pull.

Some owners complain about the trigger pull stacking at the end. This is caused by both of the “V" mainspring’s two-leafs coming together to soon and binding the action causing it to suddenly become very heavy. I wouldn't expect this on a Python, but it isn't uncommon on smaller D-frame revolvers. If you have this problem a trip to the factory or a gunsmith with a Colt specialty, can usually fix it in short order.

Warning: If you have an older Colt, made before or shortly after World War Two, do not try to bend and reform the mainspring. Doing so will likely break the spring, and newer mainsprings do not interchange. Finding a older one is both dificult and usually expensive.

 

[saltydog452]

No video or detailed description.

I do have a couple of thoughts. Understand though, that one of them will not make sense.

Colt or Smith, the lower you place your finger on the trigger face, the more the mechanical advantage. You don't wanna 'pinch' and get blood blisters on the trigger finger though. There is a limit as to how low you can go.

This is the one that doesn't make logical sense. Think 'follow through' on the trigger stroke. The front sight 'bobble' seems to go away. I dunno how to explain it.

Give it a whirl...see what happens. Maybe you can get a grip it it and expain what is going on.

salty

 

[goodtime]

As David E said, dry fire a lot. It's a great training tool. BUT, use snap caps with your python! Repeated dry firing a python might break the firing pin. Pardon me if you already knew that.

 

[dfariswheel]

Its a technique that is difficult to describe, but DA revolver triggers should be "rolled" instead of jerked or just pulled.

As best I can, the idea is to ROLL the trigger not pull it straight back like its a 1911 straight trigger.
The revolver trigger pivots on a pin and you want to work with that rotating motion.

In addition this prevents damaging revolvers by jerking the trigger.
Once learned, you can roll a Python trigger very fast without battering the action like untrained people do when they jerk the trigger as fast as they can.

 

[9mmepiphany]

a good DA trigger stroke is simple to describe, it's a bit harder, takes more practice, to get your sights aligned on the target when the hammer is ready to fall.

1. use less finger on the trigger. old wisdom says to put the trigger in the first joint, modern technique places the trigger more toward the middle of the pad
2. the trigger is rolled back in one continuous stroke. don't hesitate/pause/stage/stop the trigger movement to "refine" your sight picture.
3. accept the sight wobble on the target, but maintain sight alignment. don't pull faster when your sights "look good", just keep the trigger moving at a constant speed.

 

[tiders]

Thank you all for chiming in, I appreciate it. The people I shoot with all have tuned S&W 686’s and more experience but I’m gaining fast…

David; I suppose the tip about dry firing is what it comes down to.

Old fluff; that staging bit sounds like what I’m looking for. I must have mixed up with stacking because the process here is smooth and does not get heavier at the end. Btw it’s a late 1970’s Python so the springs should be ok.

Salty; it’s a Zen thing I suppose and not meant to be understood but experienced… I’ll pay attention

Dfariswheel: let me know when you post the video then… And my other gun is a Walther P88C so no help in the 1911 comparison. Still, the rotating motion point seems like a good one.

9mmepiphany, controlled consistency, I get it.

Btw, in the video I’m thinking of, Miculeck pulls the trigger really fast to fully rotate the cylinder and then slowly finish the trigger pull. Am I right in believing that this is difficult to accomplish or undesired on a Python? To me it looks like the cylinder does not always fully lock when I try this, but that could be ascribed to lack of consistency I suppose.

Here are the videos.
http://www.myoutdoortv.com/pdk/web/smith.html?feedPID=00zG15zm84msK0GbWemanhJ0KNWQYqM4

 

[9mmepiphany]

i just took a look at the videos and you'll notice that Jerry does show different way of stroking the trigger.

staging the trigger...rotate and then finish...is a precision technique and an advanced one at that. i used it when i shot PPC and actually found it easier with the Python's longer trigger pull. it's advanced because you need to first learn how far to pull the trigger to properly "stage". staging too soon defeats the purpose...your finger needs to just know when you're there.

Pythons do lockup differently than the S&W...they lock up tighter. at the very end of the Python's trigger pull, the hand comes up and locks the cylinder up solid rather than depending solely on the bolt locking up in the notch. the action can actually be tuned to lock up earlier...old PPC trick

 

[rhtwist]

Always used staging the trigger when possible. It becomes easy and extremely repeatable. Just my 2 cents.
rhtwist

 

[tiders]

Thanks, I'll get a few sets of snap caps and wear them out...

 

[Old Fuff]

Another "trick" used by some takes a little experimenting. You use the second joint of the finger to pull the trigger, and extend the front of the finger backwards. Rotate the gun in your hand to the left or right (usually left for a right-handed person) until the tip of the finger just lightly touches the front edge of the stocks behind the trigger guard. Rapidly pull the trigger backwards until your finger touches the stocks, bring the sights into final alignment, and then finish the pull.

This method isn't particularly fast, but it was sometimes employed by bullseye target shooters during timed and rapid fire stages. Works for either Smith & Wesson or Colt revolvers.

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

I found the standard grip to be excessively large, crowd my ring and little fingers (that may seem to be contradictory, but it is due to the large "flare" at the bottom) and have excessively sharp checkering which abraded my hand. I shot it much better with a Hogue Monogrip which left the backstrap exposed.

 

[ArmedBear]

I just checked out the DA pull of a few Colt .44s at a shop (Anacondas and a Kodiak).

One had very pronounced "stacking." One felt a lot smoother. The third felt like butter.

I have no idea what 'smithing might have been done to them. However, it's safe to say that they can be made to feel really, really good.

 

[peacemaker45]

One trick with any double action shooting is to control the release of the trigger, at the same speed you pulled it to begin with. I don't know why this helps, but it does.

~~~Mat

 

[JImbothefiveth]

Dryfire. A LOT

Use snap caps!

 

[Jim K]

All Colt DA revolvers (modern type) stack. Period. It is the way the mechanism is made. Stacking can be alleviated by some careful work, but it can't, repeat, can't be eliminated, though some smiths will be glad to take your money to try to do so.

If anyone cares to examine the Colt trigger-hammer interface, they will find that there is a point where the flat of the trigger is parallel to the hammer strut; that is where the stacking occurs, not in the spring.

In an S&W, there is a second cam on the trigger which engages the hammer as the strut (S&W calls it a sear) releases. That provides a better mechanical advantage and prevents stacking.

Short of making a new hammer and trigger for the Colt to act like the S&W (I once knew a man who did just that), there is no real solution.

Jim

 

[hoptob]

Btw, in the video I’m thinking of, Miculeck pulls the trigger really fast to fully rotate the cylinder and then slowly finish the trigger pull. Am I right in believing that this is difficult to accomplish or undesired on a Python?

Tiders,

Staging trigger as shown in Jerry's video can be done on any revolver. S&W action stacks less than Colt's and Ruger's but note that Jerry uses S&W to demonstrate his trigger staging technique.

Every trigger is different and it takes some practice (sometimes a lot of practice) to learn it -- but it can be done. Best exercise to learn proper staging is to quickly roll the trigger back until the bolt locks, but not allowing the hammer to fall. Then return the trigger and do it again. The key here is to start the stroke forcefully, almost launching the cylinder into rotation, rather than pulling steadily through the stroke. When you learn to do this very quickly (2-4 pulls per second), dozens of times in a row, without ever dropping the hammer - that's when you mastered this powerful technique. Jerry briefly shows this exercise around 20th second of his trigger control video but he does not talk about it.

This is an awesome technique. If you put enough time into practicing it, you will eventually learn to stage your trigger while coming on to the first target or while recovering from recoil between the targets. When you're ready to line up your sightes, the hammer will be already fully cocked -- works as if it was autoloading revolver.

Good luck,

Mike

 

[tiders]

I'm continuing in this thread seeing as it is the same gun. The gun doctors here would probably want to see the entire history of the patient...

My shooting has improved since the last advice was written on this thread, but I have another problem...

Shooting DA, some times the primer is struck a bit of to the centre and the shell will not ignite. First I thought that it must be a problem with the timing and that the little hand that moves the cylinder might need to be looked at. Today I noticed that the ejector doesn't align it self up perfectly with the cylinder. As I ejected the brass I looked at the ejector and its of-set ever so slightly from the cylinder. Maybe a millimetre at the most. In my mind the ejector sounds like the likely cause of my DA misfire and a new one should improve the situation.

Does anyone disagree or come up with a different solution?

What is the best place to get these parts and is it a simple matter to install?

Picture one is of the cylinder, two and three of the little hand at hammer down and full cock.