Question for the 1911 gurus...

[freedomlover]

I've got a 1911 problem, maybe one of y'all can offer me some advice; my magazine is stuck in the magwell (fully inserted), the mag release button is partially depressed and locked into that position, slide fully retracted and the slide stop won't budge. The gun is "frozen" and I'm out of ideas. A trip to the gunsmith may be in order, but I'm hoping somebody here can help me out.

What would cause this to happen in the first place? The mag catch? And how can I remove the magazine and/or release the slide? I'm baffled! A friend of mine who is also into 1911s looked at the pistol and was stumped as well. Gun has about 1,000 rounds thru it with no weird problems before this. Any advice?

TIA,
freedomlover

 

[joegerardi]

Any chance the mag's follower is jammed into the slide stop preventing it from releasing? Try pulling th slide back and pushing down on the follower with an eraser or some such.

..Joe

 

[Sunray]

Can you take out or move anything? Does the bushing move? If it does take it out and release the spring. Take of the grips and remove the mainspring housing. I'm thinking the link is either broken or out of its place. I can't think of anything else that would freeze the whole gun. Even that shouldn't.
Re-post this to the Autoloaders forum. 1911Tuner can likely tell you what you need to do.

 

[1911Tuner]

Details Please

Howdy Freedomlover,

The details are a little sketchy. Need more info.

Which version of the 1911 is it? GM....Commander...Defender/OM?

Standard-length magazine or extended length? (GM magazine in an Officer's Model/10-round magazine in a GM/Commander)

What were you doing/what did you do when everything stopped?

Is the slide "fully rearward" against the impact usrface in the frame...or is the slidestop engaged in the notch in the slide...as if the side were locked on an empty magazine?

Is the magazine empty...or does it still have ammo in it?

If it's empty...can you depress the mag follower and get the slidestop to move?

I saw an Officer's Model hang up similar to yours once when a guy did a
speed reload with a standard magazine...Without a positive stop on the
mag tube, they'll become wedged into the magwell. The cut-out area of the
magazine on the left front jammed tightly against the slidestop, and the bottom of the catch slot was jammed against the underside of the catch shelf. The button moved about halfway and seized.

Without more detail...and without seeing the gun...I've got a suspicion that
this is what happened. It's about the only thing that I can see that would jam both the catch AND the slidestop.

Standin' by...

 

[Old Fuff]

I would start by turning the Magazine Catch Lock a quarter-turn going counter-clockwise. If the Magazine Catch is partially depressed the lock might turn and release any spring tension on the Catch. Remember the Lock looks like a screw but isn't one. If it doesn't want to turn, stop! and don't force it.

Also, if it's already partially turned to the left, turning it to the right may release the Magazine Catch.

After this, like Tuner says, more information is needed ...

 

[freedomlover]

Thanks for the replies, gentlemen! Here's the rest of the story:

Standard 5" GM, 10-rd. extended mag, mag hung up as I was reloading. Slide is retracted back with slidestop engaged in notch (I shouldn't have said it was "fully retracted," sorry about that) and the mag was full.

I unloaded the mag w/a small flathead screwdriver, carefully pushing the rounds up into the chamber and pulling them out. So mag is now empty, I can depress the follower but still no movement anywhere--slidestop won't release slide, mag catch button can be depressed but doesn't release mag, can't remove the bushing with slide in rearward position.

I've used this particular mag before (Mec-Gar) with no problems but I suspect that Tuner's theory is correct. I think the mag has jammed up against the slidestop, that would explain why I can't release the slide. Seems like a mag failure, not a broken gun part.

I've tried to release tension on the mag catch lock by turning the screw per Old Fuff's instructions, the screw will turn but the mag is still locked in the magwell. I've tried pulling on the mag body w/pliers and still no luck.

If I ever get this mag out, don't worry, I won't be using it again! But how do I get it out? Thanks for the help.

 

[1911Tuner]

Details!

Aha!

Try this just for kicks...

Lay the pistol on its right side, and use a wooden dowel or other suitable drift to bear against the mag catch button. Bump it lightly with a small hammer to see if the catch will move so you can get that tension off the mag. Use another long rod to press down on the mag follower while you pull hard on the mag tube. If you don't have enough hands, catch the bottom of the mag with a door by holding the door close don it with your foot while you pull on the gun and push on the mag follower. It'll be a trick
to get the gymastics worked out, but the mag should come out.

Luck!

Tuner

 

[freedomlover]

Thanks, Tuner! I'm gonna enlist the wife's help for the 3-handed operation you described...sounds as if it may work.

Gotta go to Sunday Meetin' first though, I'll report back this afternoon...

 

[stans]

Mec-Gar extened mag, probably has two little tabs on the back wall of the mag to catch the bottom of the receiver and prevent over insertion. If your magwell is beveled and you slam one of the babies home, the little tabs will whiz past the bottom edge of the magwell and wedge into the well. The mag will be way over inserted and will jam the slide stop and break the nose off of an extended ejector. Hold in the mag release button and yank on the mag as hard as you can. Go ahead, ask me how I know all of this.

 

[Old Fuff]

I agree with Tuner, but first take off the Grips. There is a slim possibility that a too-long Grip Screw is binding the Magazine, and in any case you don't want to mess up the right grip panel while you are (lightly) pounding on the Magazine Catch.

I would also use that piece of wood dowel (or a small square block of wood it it's handy) to tap on the Slide Stop and move it downward. Be careful! If this works the Slide will slam into battery.

I know nothing about your extended 10-round magazine because I don't use them, but if the Magazine Base can be removed while the Body is still stuck in the magazine well I would remove the Base, and then the Spring and Follower. That way you won't have to deal with them.

Then I would (lightly) tap on the Slide Stop pin on the right side, and see if the Stop moved far enough out on the left (thumbpiece) side to let the Magazine Body go, although the Slide Stop shouldn't touch the Magazine Body.

If you are going to scrap the Magazine you might also try tapping on the magazine lips with the wood dowel after you use Tuner's trick to push out the Magazine Catch. Again be careful. If the Slide Stop drops down the Slide will slam into battery.

Edited to add: I think Stan may have the answer. Try his trick first.

 

[freedomlover]

Success!!

Y'all were right! stans, you've been there and done that, apparently; my problem was what you described. I tried Tuner's Super-Duper Mag Removal Technique combined with Old Fuff's advice about tapping on the feed lips with a dowel--mag popped right out on the second tap.

This mag has NEVER given me problems before, and there's nothing wrong with it that I can see, but I won't be using it in this particular 1911 anymore.

Thanks to all for the replies! The info & instructions saved me a trip to the gunsmith, no doubt. Do y'all accept payment in Shiner Bock?

 

[1911Tuner]

Pop goes the Magazine!

Ahhhh! Another satisfied THR customer...Make checks payable to
The "Tuffer 1911 Investment Fund".

The mag will probably be okay to use if ya just be real gentle when ya lock it in.

 

[stans]

stans, you've been there and done that, apparently;

Yep, in the middle of an IPSC match many moons ago. It was the first and last time I used Mec-Gar extended mags. After that fiasco, I bought a set of Wilson 10 round mags. These have a good sized tab welded on the front of the mag and catch the front portion of the mag well just like stock 7 rounders. No problems with these and I used them for several years.

 

[Old Fuff]

The Old Fuff admits to total ignorence when it comes to 10-round magazines in a single-stack 1911 pistol. Never used them and it's unlikely I will. This particular brand could get you killed. I love the advise about how to not slam them in ...

Anyway, what works ... works, and I complement Stans for coming up with the answer ... I'm just glad I didn't have to learn about it the way he did ...

Or worse ...

 

[stans]

Extended mags are purely range stuff, never carry them, very, very few people can conceal them. I recommend 7 round mags for carry in Commander and Government models, they are the most reliable and one extra round does little good if the first round fails to feed and ties up the gun.

 

[freedomlover]

Roger that, stans...I never use 10-rd. mags for a defensive pistol, range use ONLY.

In fact, I've started to shy away from my 8-rounders for defensive use due to some well-reasoned arguments here on THR. I've never had a problem with my 8-rounders, but as Tuner once said, why send Murphy an engraved invitation?

Right now my packin' 1911 has a 7-round Mec-Gar in it, plus one in the chamber...and if 8 rounds of .45ACP won't solve the problem (highly unlikely), that's what a spare mag is for.

Thanks again fellas!

 

[Dave Sample]

I think you should get some good CMC Power Mags and forget that other type. They obviously don't like your gun.