Question on .45 LC smokeless powder

[Saddlebag Preacher]

I usually handload my .45 LC in BP with an old lee hand loader, but I just "rediscovered" a box of 100 Hornaday 250 Gr HP/XTP jacketed hollowpoints that my wife bought for me years ago. I never used them because I only reload lead bullits with the BP, so I put them in the closet.
Well with the price of factory 45 LC through the roof, especially for hollowpoint or defensive loads, I think now is a good time to use them. I have a good supply of unused Starline brass and CCI primers.

I have never reloaded smokeless and I know it goes by weight, not volume like BP. I need to know a good brand of Smokeless powder and what you might suggest for how much to use. They will be used here on the farm in a Ruger New Vaquero and a Rossi .45 92 carbine.

I don't have it with me right at this moment, but the lee loader came with a yellow dipper for powder, I'd have to see what it says on it.

And of course I absolve any liability to anyone who can give me suggestions.

Thanks

 

[ArchAngelCD]

There are many good powders for use in the .45 Colt. With a Jacketed bullet I like HS-6 best but Unique, Universal, AA#5, W231/HP-38 and others in the same burn rate range will also work just as well.

Load data is available at the Hodgdon Load Data Site. Additional data is on the Alliant Site, the Accurate Site and the Ramshot Site.

 

[Sport45]

Whan you're on that Hodgdon site ignore the loads that are specifically listed as .45 Colt (Ruger, Freedom Arms & T/C only) and select just .45 Colt instead. I don't think your new model Vaquero has the frame those "Ruger Only" loads were meant for.

 

[243winxb]

Lee Dipper Capacity Chart

the lee loader came with a yellow dipper for powder, I'd have to see what it says on it.

I seem to remember 2 different sets of dippers. Let us know what is marked on the one that came with the Classic "hammer" loader. This chart from lee does not say if old or new one? http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/Dippers.pdf

 

[Arkansas Paul]

Your standard 8.5 grain charge of Unique should work great. Seat to the cannalure and apply a slight roll crimp and you should be golden.

 

[zxcvbob]

You can use a dipper to load smokeless powder, you just need to know how many grains it throws of the powder you are using.

I like Herco for .45 Colt, but Unique and Universal and Green Dot and 231 are good too (and many others.) I've never shot jacketed bullets in my .45, but I have half a box of 300 grain JSP's somewhere that I need to try out with a full-tilt load of 296. I have a Blackhawk, but I usually prefer to shoot loads at the upper end or just beyond the "normal" .45 Colt load data instead of the rip-snorters in the "Ruger/Freedom Arms" column.

 

[ljnowell]

I have said many times that I do not like Unique, but in your case it may be a good choice. You certainly do not want to hot rod it in the new model vaquero, so Unique or AA#5 would work well. Be mindful in that great big ol' case of double charges and have at it.

 

[Owen Sparks]

Remember this, the .45 Colt case was designed for bulky black powder. Smokeless powder may not even fill the case half way. An accidental double charge means fireworks. BE CAREFULL!

I use 8.5 grains of Unique with 250 grain jacketed bullets. Unique is probably the most versitile powder made.

 

[zxcvbob]

You certainly do not want to hot rod it in the new model vaquero

That's true, but don't be bashful about loading at the top end of SAAMI load data, or even the higher CIP data. The new vaquero is a strong gun, it's just not a strong large-framed gun or a custom 5-shooter.

 

[ljnowell]

That's true, but don't be bashful about loading at the top end of SAAMI load data, or even the higher CIP data. The new vaquero is a strong gun, it's just not a strong large-framed gun or a custom 5-shooter.

I certainly would feel safe loading at 45acp levels without a worry.

 

[Saddlebag Preacher]

I finally went down to my building I reload in. The dipper from the lee loader says 7CC. Would I just use it for my powder charge and be correct?

 

[rcmodel]

You would use it with the powders listed on the die instruction insert sheet.

Looks like a 7CC dipper dips a starting charge of PB, SR7625, 700X, or Universal with a 250 Lead bullet.

If you mess around with dippers, you really need to buy a cheap powder scale to have any idea of what you are dipping, or how consistently you are dipping it.

But in the grand scheme of things, even an expensive powder scale is far cheaper then blowing up any .45 Colt revolver trying to save a few bucks.

rc

 

[zxcvbob]

I finally went down to my building I reload in. The dipper from the lee loader says 7CC. Would I just use it for my powder charge and be correct?

Actually, it depends on the powder: how fast it burns, how energetic, and how bulky. 7 sounds like a lot.

You need to borrow a powder scale from somebody. You can make a dipper out of a empty .40S&W cartridge (that you can pick up anywhere) and a piece of wire, and cut it down until it holds the desired amount of powder. Then you'll have a customer calibrated dipper for ONE specific powder load.

 

[buck460XVR]

Or you could use the smokeless BP substitute Trailboss. It too can be easily measured by volume and you can make your own dipper from an old case. It will not give you blazing velocity even @ 100% of case capacity, but would be similar to your BP velocities even with the jacketed bullets. Here is a link to IMR's recipe for developing your loads. As it says, this works with rifle and handguns using jacketed bullets. I suggest staying above 80% when using it in the carbine.

Trail-Boss-data

 

[Saddlebag Preacher]

OK, I have lots of used 40 S&W from shooting my Glock. I think I'll go to the gun shop and see if they have an inexpensive scale. I'd only use it on the .45 anyway. I just didn't want to use BP with the JHP's because of the lack of lube and I fugure the fouling and accuracy after the first shot would be awful.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

But in the grand scheme of things, even an expensive powder scale is far cheaper then blowing up any .45 Colt revolver trying to save a few bucks.

There he goes folks, making sense yet again.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

Or you could use the smokeless BP substitute Trailboss.

I love Trail Boss, but I don't think it's recommended for jacketed bullets. Even if it would work, there are at least a dozen that will do the job better.

 

[Uniquedot]

The dipper from the lee loader says 7CC.

That's pretty much an undercharge with most any powder suitable for that bullet and with a powder like Acc #5 it's actually a bit over max for the 250 xtp. You may be trying to get out as cheap as possible, but the two best things you can add to that Lee loader is a good powder measure and scale. Lee's perfect powder measure is inexpensive but extremely accurate and there are good bargains to be had on used scales though if you buy a used one make sure you have access to a check weight set.

 

[243winxb]

IMR 800X with a 250 gr Jacketed. The 7 dipper will measure 6.5gr of powder. Starting load is 6.0gr and maximum is 7.4 gr. Velocity should be around 700 fps, a guess. The 800X is a large flake powder. Not great for a powder measure, but fine for a dipper. http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp

 

[Saddlebag Preacher]

Thanks for the help, I knew I could count on ya'll. I might as well do this right and stop trying to cut corners. I just didn't want to spend money on a complete reloading outfit. I actually like setting at the bench and loading one shell at a time with that old loader and rubber mallet it's my stress reliever.

Besides. I can spend more time away from the honey do list.

 

[Uniquedot]

I didn't think about 800x, but the info 243winxb posted is for the exact bullet you have so i guess if you didn't want to spend money on anything other than powder all you need is a pound of 800x. The bullet isn't going to expand using it even with the max load though. I have used a good bit of it in 45 colt with lead bullets, but not since Hodgdon acquired IMR. Last time i used it in 45 colt was when it came in the same cans that blackpowder comes in and they would hold 8 ounces of it. Never used it for jacketed bullets though as it was mainly one of my 12 ga. turkey powders.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Looks like a 7CC dipper dips a starting charge of PB, SR7625, 700X, or Universal with a 250 Lead bullet.

Many reloaders consider Unique to be the best powder for the .45 Colt and Universal was designed specifically to mimic Unique but cleaner. If those powders are a good match for the 7CC dipper I would choose Universal.

 

[buck460XVR]

I love Trail Boss, but I don't think it's recommended for jacketed bullets. Even if it would work, there are at least a dozen that will do the job better.

If you follow the link I posted, you'll see IMR does recommend it for jacketed bullets........for reduced loads. I have used it in the .460 and .44 with good results with jacketed bullets. Are there better powders out there? Sure, but if one does not have an accurate scale and wants to safely load jacketed bullets with a smokeless powder using volume only, it's a good choice. Most of my .460 and .44 loads were just shy of 100% of case capacity and still were well within safe pressure. I basically marked where the bottom of the bullet set in the case and then trimmed a case just a tad shorter than that for a dipper. Pretty simple.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I basically marked where the bottom of the bullet set in the case and then trimmed a case just a tad shorter than that for a dipper. Pretty simple.

That's not a bad idea.