Quick question: Does Glock have second strike setup??

[Tallbald]

OK OK. So I'm a Ruger and old Smith revolver man through and through. BUT, even though I will never abandon my revolver love, I'm not narrow minded enough to eliminate giving a well designed semi a chance. My adult son and I love shooting. He's a child of the 90's and his love is a good semi. I myself have Ruger semis in .22 (of course), and a beautiful CZ75B stainless has been known to grace my shooting bench at times.
Now, I'm seriously giving the "Baby" Glock 26 a look as another CCW possibility. I've always preached to my son that my view on revolvers is that a dud round can be cycled out of the way with another pull of the trigger (on a DA revolver). Given that in my experience a "dud" primer will often fire on a "second strike" I admire the feature in a semi too. I feel ignorant having to ask folks, but with a Glock, must I cycle the slide or can I give the trigger another pull to hopefully set the primer off (hopefully). Thanks for any tolerance of my ignorance folks. It's just that I have NEVER had any interest in Glocks until my loving son got me to pondering. Don

 

[C0untZer0]

You don't have to completely cycle the slide, just pull it back a little bit until the trigger resets.

Glocks do not have second-strike capability.

 

[pitime]

Glock's do not have second strike capability. Racking the slide will eject the dud round and put a new round in the chamber - assuming the magazine was not empty.

Personally, I do not worry about this when carrying high quality self defense ammunition.

Oh, cool,I just read the previous post and learned something. I just tried the "half rack" and it does work as long as you pull the slide back far enough but not so far that the round ejects. Interesting. I think with a dud round I will still stick with the proven drill of "tap, rack, boom". (Tap bottom of magazine to ensure it is seated, Rack the slide, pull the trigger when back on target)

 

[hentown]

Sounds to me as if the Glock DOES have a second strike capability. You don't have to retract the slide nearly enough to eject a live round, in order to reset the trigger.

 

[Sam1911]

No, it doesn't. Glocks are most primarily fighting guns (or for competition which emulates gun-fighting to some degree) and for those purposes the "second strike" effect is a moot point as neither someone struggling with a violent adversary, nor trying to achieve a winning score over a timed course of fire, would be fooling with multiple attempts to light off a round that has proved to be suspect.

Tap, rack, (reassess), Bang -- solves the greatest number of stoppages in the shortest time.

(I understand for a range gun it can be satisfying to get a dud round to pop. But on the square range you've got all the time in the world. Just rack the slide (or half-rack it with a Glock) and try again. Do it 100 times if you want. No biggie.)

 

[hentown]

Sam, I'm confused by your just-previous post. First, you say that "it doesn't." Then you go on to describe how to do it.

The OP's question, as I understand it, has nothing to do with gunfighting or competitive techniques, but rather, just whether Glocks have a second strike capability.

 

[AK103K]

Then you go on to describe how to do it.

Actually, he was describing the "proper" second strike "reaction" of every auto, including Glocks, and how and why its done.

I suppose you could say the resetting of the trigger by moving the slide slightly is a sort of second strike. No different really than thumbing back a hammer, pulling the trigger again.

It can also be a "first strike" if you load the gun without setting the trigger. Although theres really no point in that, other than maybe showing the nay sayers it can be done.

 

[Sam1911]

No, hentown. Regardless of , a second-strike capability is the ability to drop a hammer or striker repeatedly on a primer WITHOUT doing some other preparatory step. Just keep cranking the trigger and you'll keep striking away at the primer.

Yes, you can cock a 1911s hammer and strike again on the same primer.
Does that make it a "second-strike" capable gun? Of course not.

In the same vein, the fact that you can reset a Glock's striker and THEN pull the trigger again does not in any way make a Glock a "second-strike" gun.

If it does, then the term has no meaning at all.

 

[Skribs]

It's funny you mention second strike and quality, because the only striker-fired pistol that I'm aware of with Second Strike capability is made by Taurus.

Regarding revolver vs. Glock, I have to ask this question: which scenario is more likely:
A) You fire 3 shots and misfire, needing to tap-rack-bang with the Glock (which I've seen some people do in IDPA faster than I can get off a second shot shooting normally) or just pull the trigger on your revolver, or
B) You fire 5 shots into that determined meth-head and he's still coming after you, necessitating a reload with your revolver or 6 more shots from your Glock.

For the most part, the only semi-autos with second strike are DA/SA guns (like Beretta or some models of HK) or DAO pistols (like some models of Sig, most pocket pistols). That is because a pistol firing in DA will cock the hammer when you pull the trigger. Single-action pistols like 1911s or XDs, or 1.5-action pistols like a lightened DAO or most striker-fired pistols need to have the slide cycled to cock the hammer, which is where tap-rack-bang really helps (although I'd do that anyway with a DA pistol). I guess second-strike is easier in a 1911 if you really want it.

 

[Sam1911]

The problem with second-strike (or at least with training yourself to use it) is that there are lots of reasons you might have a failure to fire.

You COULD have a dud primer. If you have a dud primer, there's some non-zero chance that it will light off if you hit it again. There's also a much-greater-than-zero chance that it won't. There's also a very close to (but not quite) zero chance that it will light off on the 3rd strike...4th? 5th?

That's what a second-strike gun could remedy. That one condition of one type of malfunction.

But consider that you might have a real dud round. Second strike is just wasting your time.

You might have a failure to return to battery. Second strike is just wasting your time there, too.

You might not have seated the mag, leading to an empty chamber. Second strike? No help.

You might have a failure to eject of some type. Stovepipe? No savings from a second-strike.

And so forth.

All of those conditions lead to someone clicking away at a hopeless chance. Clicking when they should be rectifying the problem.

Tap-Rack-Bang solves the dud. Solves the unseated mag. Solves the failure to return to battery. Solves the stovepipe. Solves a whole lot of common problems in about one second.

There are some pretty serious malfunctions that the TRB doesn't solve (like a failure to extract leading to the mis-named "double-feed") but those problems certainly aren't made any better by second-striking, either.

So, from all practical viewpoints related to serious uses of defensive sidearms, you should NOT train yourself to second-strike an autoloading pistol.

Taurus is on a section of bad road with this one, but they do always seem to be looking for any angle to get market attention, so it isn't that surprising that they'd latch onto it.

 

[rockhopper46038]

^^^ Pretty much the definitive post.

 

[Skribs]

Say what you want about Taurus (I know I do), but you gotta give them one thing: they probably have a greater variety of models than anyone else.

 

[HellTrain]

Agree^^^^

 

[Sam1911]

Hey, yeah...there's that. Great! That's something.


Actually, when I looked through their display at the big show in Harrisburg a couple weeks ago I was literally amazed at how many different guns they had. Took me a while to find the little ... "gem"... I was looking for, among the sea of guns I didn't want to see.

 

[Skribs]

That's the thing, though! Whatever you want, they've got a cheap imitation of it. They're like the generic brand of firearms. An interesting business model, to be sure, and it seems to work for them.

To make this post on-topic: the other thing about revolvers "just pull the trigger" is that you're not hitting the same round again, whereas an auto with double strike you are. So that negates the situation Sam mentioned above regarding dud rounds or dud primers.

 

[tuj]

I've used the second-strike capability of my CZ P-07 before when shooting some CCI Blazer and I had a dud primer. I was doing speed drills, so I quickly reset the trigger and the round fired the second time.

I think the advantage of second-strike is that in a real fire-fight, with all the noise and adrenalin, you might not even realize that you *had* a dud; everything is going to be confusing after that first round and its subsequent blinding flash and noise. Well at least for most of us, that's the scenario. You just keep pulling the trigger. Its instinctual. At least with second-strike, you *might* accomplish something by doing that.

I agree with the idea that second-strike is of limited usefulness. Its not a feature I would seek out, nor would I fault a pistol for not having it.

 

[TAKtical]

Take a look at the M&P Shield if you want a nice reliable small gun for concealed carry. It has a really nice feeling grip even if you have big hands like me.

 

[Janos Dracwlya]

I have to agree with tuj on this one.

Based on all I have read, in a real fight there is a pretty good chance I am not going to notice that I had a misfire, so I will probably pull the trigger again - maybe more than once - before I realize. As almost all of the misfires I have ever had with modern, non-rimfire ammunition were resolved with a second strike, having a gun with second-strike capability seems like a good option to me.

 

[USAF_Vet]

I'm with Drac on this one. And not because I have a second strike capable Taurus, but because I've been in a gun fight (granted, it was with a rifle, not a pistol). In a low stress situation, on a safe, static range, a TRB drill is perfectly sufficient. But with adrenaline flowing, stress levels through the roof, as Drac said, you may not even notice a dud, and continue to pull the trigger. We can all claim to be perfectly in control, level headed under fire, but most likely we're not.

I didn't buy the Taurus for its second strike capability, but its not a feature I'd pass on.

 

[mgmorden]

It's funny you mention second strike and quality, because the only striker-fired pistol that I'm aware of with Second Strike capability is made by Taurus.

Walther P99AS will do it. Not that I think its a useful feature, but it will indeed do it.

 

[Deaf Smith]

Quick question: Does Glock have second strike setup??

Only if you throw it.

Deaf

 

[herrwalther]

Walther P99AS is the only striker fired pistol I know of that has second strike. I believe the PPQ does as well but haven't handled one to find out.

Second strike is a nice feature but little tactical use. As Sam covered, second strike will only be useful on light primer strikes or tough primers. There are many reasons why a round has a failure with second strike curing only a small fraction. Unless you are that short on rounds, pull the slide and get rid of the round.'

Now I will say second strike has one really useful feature: it makes dry fire practice easier not having to cycle the slide every time.

 

[gamestalker]

Many of my Taurus's and my SCCY's have that feature, and I'm fairly certain there are others with is as well. But so far as I know Glocks don't offer second strike.

GS

 

[stressed]

My smitty bodyguard 380 has the double strike feature. Used it once as well. Pulled the trigger to hear click. Said Hmm and pulled the trigger again to hear BANG. I bet that pig thought it was his luckiest day when he heard that click. But his luck ran out when I dropped the hammer again. Had it been a self defence scenario, the double strike would have probably saved my life. Sure tap and racking would allleviate, however thats precious time wasted when your opponent is armed as well.

 

[Sam1911]

But with adrenaline flowing, stress levels through the roof, as Drac said, you may not even notice a dud, and continue to pull the trigger. We can all claim to be perfectly in control, level headed under fire, but most likely we're not.

And you may go on "click, click, clicking" because your adrenaline is flowing and you aren't noticing. You may indeed notice when the trigger DOESN'T cycle and you do the TRB.

The TRB isn't a "range technique." That's backward thinking. It is the default, worn-in, thing you can't NOT do, because of practice. It is a survival skill. I once watched a near-80-year-old shooter in our PPC league have a jam with his Glock, and he TRB'd so fast I almost missed it. It was what he had taught himself to do, because he was a proficient shooter, and he reacted as he had established his reactions to do.

Sure tap and racking would allleviate, however thats precious time wasted when your opponent is armed as well.

Unless the odds are what the odds usually are and you're clicking away at a dud. You were fortunate, once. I wouldn't want to roll those dice when it mattered.