Rcbs dies

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WhiteShark

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Hi there, so a common complaint that I've been hearing about when reloading is that a lot of commercial die sets will size down the neck too much, then the expander ball comes back up and expands the neck back out overworking the brass. I've heard ways around this are using bushing die sets, and or splitting up the D capping, sizing and neck sizing into separate steps.

So my real question is, will my standard RCBS 2 die set( used for AR15 reloads) leave my case neck too small/overworked? If I take out the decapping pin/expander ball will that still undersize my case neck? Also, I do not want to crimp but get proper neck tension. I'm new to this so drop that knowledge on me please.
 
Well? If you take out the decapping pin w/expander ball, you won't have anything to bring the neck back to it's proper size.

Generally, with bolt guns and single shot rifles, you can get away with neck sizing only, done with the proper die. However, with loading for a semi-auto, you'll want to FL resize every time, to ensure proper cycling.

Every time you resize the brass, you work the brass. Eventually the brass will become work hardened and one of two things will happen. Either you'll see necks start cracking or your brass will become unusable and you'll see signs of case head separation (checked every time with either a paperclip or dental pick) looming.

With semi-auto, between FL resizing and trimming (done every time), you'll get 2 maybe 3 reloads out of your brass.

Neck splits can be avoided by annealing the case necks, but I wouldn't worry about that because you probably won't be able to get enough firings out of the brass.

Using a FL resizing die (you may need a small base die) properly, and setup properly, you should get plenty of neck tension to hold the bullet without messing with the expander ball.
 
Your standard RCBS dies will size your brass just fine. You got some good advice in Post #2. Don't worry so much, reloading is supposed to be fun, it is for me...
 
Many re-loaders use standard dies with satisfied results.

I would think you could measure the inside of the mouth on a sized (and chamfered) case
with the expander assembly removed and then compare it to the expander ball measurement
if you believe the die might be defective.

You might also do some measuring and comparing on your fired cases from the AR - Match grade chamber and barrel? -
to determine just how much you want to spend on it first.

As to bushings, neck sizing, separate de-capping dies, etc.
Your time and accuracy requirements will best determine this.

Some on the site here would never shoot a case that has not been weighed, neck turned,
checked for concentricity, and has not had the primer pocket squared and the flash hole reamed.
Re-loading is done on hand tools, not a press.

Other shooters just pick up their fired cases and re-load them, following only the basic safety steps as to case prepaation.
Both groups of re-loaders and all between seem to have a good time.

Re-loading is a hobby of sorts, so decide how involved you want to get.

JT
 
I used a Wilson gauge to set up my standard RCBS .223 sizer using the expander ball, although I did replace it with a carbide button, and during load development etc with small lots of brass I was getting 8 to 12 firings from brass before the primer pockets loosen up and I have to scrap the brass. Sometimes you will get a split neck as well, but that isn't so much from over working the brass as just something that happens with brass IMO. You'll get a split neck once in a while, just scrap it and go on.

If you use a standard steel expander ball/button, you'll need to very lightly lube the inside of the necks. This will greatly improve stress on the brass.

I also have a full length Redding bushing type .223 sizer which I use when loading for accuracy. I don't know that case life is any better, I would have to use both side by side a lot to find out.
 
if you were running something really exotic that brass was expensive for I might worry some about overworking the brass, but 223 is thick on the ground. don't sweat wearing it out.
 
Jwrowland thanks for that. What do you think would be the advantages of using a small bass die versus a full length. I currently reload for 223 in the AR.
 
It (small base die) just ensures reliable cycling.

If you're using once fired brass, a small base die may be the only way to size the whole piece of brass back down to specs for reliable cycling.

As someone else suggested, can't remember who, get a case gauge to check round after completing. You may be just fine with a regular FL resizing die.

Here's a good thread here on THR about small base dies.

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-328800.html
 
Dang, I got a lot of useful info on this thread. Thanks everyone!

ArchAngel thanks for the vote of confidence on the rcbs. Reloading so far has been very exciting and the wealth of knowledge and the experiences to be explored are amazing to me. Thanks.

@JT-AR-MG42 Is it benchrest shooters who load by hand tools, no press? What would be the reason for not using a press do you think? Do they think they get better accuracy, or just more more personal oversight over the steps and process?

@walkalong Thanks for the tip, I like the idea of using a carbide button. What does the Wilson gauge do when setting up the die? How is it used?
 
Benchrest shooters do a great deal more than just use hand dies and arbor presses to load, and not every one does that, many also use threaded dies. Sure, you could buy some hand dies, but unless you did all the other stuff, those by themselves won't make much difference.

The quality of the action, barrel, and bullets far outweigh the dies, unless the dies are just crap and screw up the ammo. Too many people get the idea that if they buy the accuracy minded dies, their groups will magically be cut in half. That's not how it works.

I'll try to find some threads about the Wilson gauge. They are an interesting read/debate as well.
 
Walkalong said:
Benchrest shooters do a great deal more than just use hand dies and arbor presses to load, and not every one does that, many also use threaded dies. Sure, you could buy some hand dies, but unless you did all the other stuff, those by themselves won't make much difference.



The quality of the action, barrel, and bullets far outweigh the dies, unless the dies are just crap and screw up the ammo. Too many people get the idea that if they buy the accuracy minded dies, their groups will magically be cut in half. That's not how it works.



I'll try to find some threads about the Wilson gauge. They are an interesting read/debate as well.
Click to expand...


Amen to this. I couldn't begin to count how much time I spend on my match ammo. Using dies is a very minimal part of it.
 
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