RCBS Pro2000 VS Hornady LNL AP

[GW Staar]

I probably would just set up a progressive for the most used ammo like 9mm a 45 ACP, 223 and continue to load the rest on the Turret

And that's perfectly fine. But I wouldn't be surprised if you start adding to the progressive setups, as you get comfortable changing calibers on your press.

Here's the thing with rifle: the hard part is done by the time you get to the priming/charging stage. You've cleaned 'em, sized 'em, prepped primer pockets, and trimmed/chamfered/deburred. Your Turret or single stage may always be the best tool for that, along with your favorite trimmer and pocket prep methods.

But once the brass is ready, then you have to decide whether you have to have perfection for the hardest competition, or just sub MOA using a powder measure. If the latter, then pumping out a round for each pull of the press handle will win you over. Takes time to wring out the details, but I usually add a caliber anytime I start getting impatient with cranking 3 or 4 strokes to finish each round. As I get older the body get's more irritated with that. My press is so easy to add calibers to.....it's just a no brainer to add $32 for a new shell plate (if necessary) and I keep extra $19 die plates on hand for if I get the urge.

 

[Edster12]

RCBS --- very easy to change out. I currently have more caliber changes then I have shelf for. Material for a second shelf is waiting for assembly.

 

[fiftybmg]

fiftybmg, you are certainly entitled to your opinion......even if it doesn't agree with Dillon's or the many small commercial ammo manufacturers who buy them for commercial production. Like anything else there are levels. Smaller manufacturers can't afford the high production machines you listed, so they buy several Dillon 1050's. Dillon's year guarantee, a big departure from their lifetime guarantee, reflects the hard use commercial presses are subjected to. I've heard that they need to be overhauled yearly in that use.....but then so do large 30 thousand dollar high production machines.

Also this is off topic. How about starting new thread on the subject.

You are completely correct. Dillon machines are widely used for commercial ammo production, and there are many 1050's out there doing just that, but they are still automated hobby presses.

I'm not questioning the quality of a Dillon press, or it's suitablility for any purpose, the point I'm trying to be clear on is that there are hobby presses and then there are commercial reloaders, and the distinction is clear.

You get the same accessories for Hornady LnL, you can use it the same way, and it's still a hobby press.

 

[Rule3]

Why is it that any thread on presses either here or any other forum can not go on without Dillon being shoved in your face??

I specifically asked for no Blue Kool Aid Drinkers.

Dillon is great It,s wonderful, the best press in the whole wide world. OK??

Yes, I can afford one, No i do not want one.

Thanks to the other members who posted replies to my questions.

 

[cfullgraf]

Why is it that any thread on presses either here or any other forum can not go on without Dillon being shoved in your face??

What man do you know reads directions.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

The other Pro2000 owners have chimed in a bit more. We can all spend time talking about pros/cons but the reality is what Dave said about. They are all good, they are all bad. You just have to figure it out.

I have somewhat given up on the trying to convince folks to see the advantages of the Pro2000. There are a lot of blue and red fans that seem to feel that no other press can come close. Ok, so be it. I tried Blue, Red was not available (good red that is) so I went green back in 2000 after I got a bonus from Russia work. No regrets 14 years later.

I do both small runs of say a few hundred rounds or even 50/100 if testing. Most of my production runs are in the thousands. It is not uncommon for me to run off 3 to 5000 rounds per production run. I say this because I have yet to see the advantage of a bullet or case feeder. I like feeling each case as I can flex it to see if it is cracked. I like to glance at it as I see it looking for oddities. I like to handle each bullet and set it to avoid any bullet base nicks or errors. If I were doing say 10,000 round runs, then maybe these features would help but today it is still less than that.

My normal routine is say 4 to 800 rounds per day. Maybe a 1000 if I am in the groove, but normally less than that. The pro2000 works great for those levels.

I can tell you that there are now 5 friends in my local area all running pro2000's. We all like them and actually found each other through various posts or knew each other from the range. The pro guys tend to hang together, share resources and knowledge and help each other out. I hope you can have the same experience.

 

[cfullgraf]

Not a deal breaker between the L-N-L or the Pro2000 but my solution for die storage.

Dies with the L-N-L bushing on them can be stored in an RCBS storage box if you cut out one of the saddles besides the clasp.

I use the RCBS or Redding boxes for die storage. They fits my storage system but the Redding boxes will not accept the L-N-L bushings. So, I have Redding dies in RCBS boxes and vice versa with lots of P-touch labels on the boxes.

Folks have innovative of ways of storing the die plates loaded with dies. Really cool solutions but I have not warmed up to storing dies in the die plate yet. Eventually, when I load more than two cartridges on my Pro2000, I will figure out a way to store the loaded die plates that I like.

Like Mr. Eick, I am happy not using a case or bullet feeder for all the same reasons. I'm as likely to run 100 or so rounds at one time as a large production run.

But, I could see some folks would benefit from using a case and/or bullet feeder.

 

[GW Staar]

I was fine about loading without feeders.....for a while. But at my age I was having trouble remembering all the feed steps. I was new at it admittedly, but I decided a bullet feeder would give me one less thing to remember. My requirement tho was one that wouldn't interfere with fast caliber changes. The Hornady feeder fit the bill with a little help. Here's what I did (short vids)

As for storing my setups...(populated die plates and caliber-specific bullet feeder parts):

I found these dust free Sterlite boxes at Walmart that work great for me. Holds everything I need for a caliber....notice the pre-set long bullet feeder die below the feeder's springtube. Both calibers in the first picture use the same shellholder.....I ought to write a #3 on it. The .308 shellholder is "depopulated" at the moment, since I'm using the sizer on a RCBS Summit Press Review thread I'm working on.

 

[moonman16]

Rule3,

I don't have the RCBS press to comment, it's probably a very good product.

I do have a HORNADY LNL-AP, one WITH and one WITHOUT a Case Feeder.

The case feeder does require a LITTLE FIDDLING with when set up each time,

But live and learn, EVEN KEEP NOTES.

Presently mine is set up to JUST run 38 Special WITH THE FEEDER.



There are some GREAT videos on the LNL-AP.

Goggle "HORNADY LNL-AP SET UP HINTS AND TRICKS " by Bill Morgan

You can go to TheFirearmsForum also they are a STICKY over there in the RELOADING THREADS.

Really GOOD for saving yourself some HEADACHES.



Bill Morgan has reloading videos and set up videos on the Hornady LNL-AP up to 44 videos currently.

Some of them are setups for specific calibers others are for THE PRESS ONLY.

Mr Morgan also DOES NOT USE A CASE FEEDER, he says reloading is THERAPEUTIC for him and he's in no hurry.



If you have a SINGLE STAGE PRESS that has A REMOVABLE BUSHING as most do (larger thread into the press body, 7/8-14 standard thread for you dies.)

You can purchase a LNL CONVERSION BUSHING ($12) to screw in and the Quick CHANGE FUNCTION there also.

A VIDEO ON HOW TO "CALIBRATE THE HORNADY LNL-AP AND SINGLE STAGE CLASSIC" is at ULTIMATERELOADER OR GOOGLE IT TOO.

This video will show you how to calculate the WORKING HEIGHT DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE TWO PRESSES.

You then have to make and install a SPACER (Machinist work, needs to be accurate), so make or HAVE MADE FOR YOU.



With the CORRECTION MADE, you can swap the Hornady QUICK CHANGE BUSHING EQUIPPED DIES BETWEEN PRESSES WITHOUT ANY DIE ADJUSTMENTS.

THE SINGLE STAGE "DOES NOT HAVE TO BE A HORNADY PRESS", only the ability to HAVE A HORNADY CONVERSION BUSHING (THE SLOTTED ONE) SWAPPED INTO THE FRAME.


I really like MY LNL-AP PRESS, RULE3, I also have YOUR UNMENTIONABLE COLOR ONES TOO.

MOONMAN16

 

[Rule3]

Are you the same Mooney from the other forum? If not there is a lot of Moons in Ohio!

 

[moonman16]

Rule3,

That's me.

YOU RUNNING YOUR POST COUNT UP HERE TOO?

 

[Rule3]

Rule3,

That's me.

YOU RUNNING YOUR POST COUNT UP HERE TOO?

Go polish some "surgical brass"

 

[Rule3]

So, just to clarify. I looked at prices at Sinclair (maybe there are less expensive but no matter right now)

I can get 10 LnL Bushings for around $40, that would be 3 caliber changes if using 3 dies. Shell plates are $40

The RCBS die plate is $20 for one caliber change, Shell Plates are $32

So doing the higher math it's pretty much a wash?

This is the main thing that has stopped me from a progressive. All the damn extras for caliber changes.

 

[GW Staar]

IME Grafs and Midway have better prices than Sinclair. When I put together the data when I was in the market, I came up with the same thing, pretty much, only I found that Grafs excels at saving money with big orders. It's their one size shipping cost.

Midway is a major source for me as well, but shipping for big heavy orders kills.

The other factor is with the current crappy state of the market (same as when I went progressive that bright and cheery January after Obama got elected the first time)? Where is it in stock!!!

I ended up buying the manual version of the Pro 2000 and the auto-advance kit rather than the Auto-Advance Pro 2000.....because I couldn't find one.

But that worked out great because by the time shipping was figured, Grafs sold me the press and the kit for the same price as Midway would sell me the Auto version....and way less than the manual version and kit.

It also worked nicely, because after spending an afternoon reloading manual-advance, I was ready to "automate" already!! Adding the kit allowed me to get to know the Pro 2000 innards better. The kit comes with a whole new shellplate holder assembly and jigs to sync the rotation. That "learned" me how hard it would be to EVER have it go out of sync. Just flat simple & bullet proof.

Also I broke something only dummies break (not following directions) and lo the extra unused assemby had one in it.

Either press you get.......do read the directions a half dozen times so you get the info you miss the first times through.

One more thing.....You are only going to start with a couple of calibers right? So why fret over $50 you're going to spend next summer or next Christmas! The expensive part (caseholders) stretch.....in that they work for several cartridges.

#27 for 10mm & .40 s&w
#3 for everything 06 and 08 as well as .45 ACP/Glock
#16 for 9mm
#2 for M1 Carbine
#18 for .44 mag and spl.
#10 for .223 and derivatives
#6 for .357/.38spl.
#2 for 30/30

But you did say that you were going to start with,

9mm a 45 ACP, 223 and continue to load the rest on the Turret

That's three shell plates! I suggest you start with what you can find in stock. The market will probably spread things out for you.

The nice thing in my case is I load .45, .308, .243, and .270......all that is loaded with a #3. I don't have to touch the shellplate or primer rod....just insert the proper primer strips as needed, change powder and change the P.M. mic settings.

 

[Rule3]

Thanks for your help! I just used Sinclair as a example.I usually do not buy there. Mostly Natchez, Midway for stuff and Windners for powder, primers.

Sinclair/Brownells I can always return it any time any reason, I am a malcontent and buy stuff all the time and decide I don't like it.

 

[Tom488]

On the topic of die storage for the Pro 2000 - I like having my die plates all visible. One, they're easy to get to and swap out, and two, I just think they look cool

Here's my die storage shelf I made... just some 1x3 pine, and a vertical shelf standard underneath for some structural support. Use an empty die plate to mark the locations for the holes, and drill them out on a drill press with a 3/4" Forstner bit. I drill through holes in station 1, so the decapping stem has a place to go.

If I were to do it over, I'd probably make the shelf an inch wider, and cut slots behind each die plate for the shell plate (couple of passes with a biscuit cutter would do nicely).

Like GW, I keep a couple of empty die plates hanging around for the occasional one-off task, effectively turning the Pro 2000 into a single-stage press (see the unlabeled die on the far right - I forget what I was doing with that).

 

[GW Staar]

Tom488, very nice....and I agree....unless you live in dusty New Mexico like I do. I have to cover everything or everything gets covered. But hey at least my boxes are clear and easy to get at....and they hold bullet feeder parts neatly and safely if one ever goes the bullet feed route.