Red dot sights and is something wrong with my eyes!?

[Onty]

I was yesterday at a local hunting show and was happy to see a dealer exhibiting red dot sights. I was interested into Aimpoint 9000L-2MOA and Hunter H30L-2 MOA. Since I didn't have a chance to examine those sights before, I took opportunity to see what Aimpoint offers. Since I am considering 9000L-2MOA, I took that one first. Well, I was bit disappointed with that "tunnel effect", but my biggest problem is that instead of red dot, I see something like this:



Of course, it is quite small in the sight, but I could clearly see it. Well, since I just turned 70, and I am farsighted (of course), I thought that there is something wrong with my eyes. I asked another person to check what he sees, and he told me that to him it looks like dot, but more likely some kind of blend between dot and curve, he wasn't sure. When looking through Hunter H30L, I could see the same.

Than, I took my phone and snapped the picture, and you can see red dot, not that strange red curve above:



When I had a chance years before to check some scopes with red dot, I could see full picture, no "tunnel effect", and red dot is a RED DOT.

Hope to visit some stores next days and compare Aimpoint with some other red dot sights and scopes with red dot.

Anybody has the same problem?

 

[Hookeye]

Astigmatism?

 

[Telekinesis]

That is usually caused by astigmatism. Most of the time it is described more as a starburst, but it can be pretty much any shape depending on your eye. Depending on the level of astigmatism it can be corrected with lenses.

Why are you looking at the 9000 L? I think it’s going to be difficult to have an optic that long to appear like it doesn’t have a bezel (that “tunnel effect” you mentioned). Also, try keeping both eyes open and focusing on the target. That usually helps the body of the optic disappear (at least for me).

 

[Onty]

I see this on low light settings. When light is cranked up like 5-6 or more, it glows like red dot, but with blurry edges, not that sharp edge as on scopes with red dot.

As for astigmatism, it could be, I am thinking about getting my eyes examined for new glasses. But second person is in his early forties, no glasses when reading what is on the box and, as I mentioned, he sees blend of red dot and curve. Next time I will try to turn sight to see has it same curve orientation in all positions.

 

[Onty]

Why are you looking at the 9000 L? I think it’s going to be difficult to have an optic that long to appear like it doesn’t have a bezel (that “tunnel effect” you mentioned). Also, try keeping both eyes open and focusing on the target. That usually helps the body of the optic disappear (at least for me).

I prefer 9000L since I can mount it in standard rings, I don't need Picatinny rail. Bit tricky to get one for M98 action.

As for shooting with both eyes open, I do that all the time, even when scope has magnification 3 or 4. I just concentrate on right eye. It took me some time to do that, but now is normal for me.

 

[Telekinesis]

But second person is in his early forties, no glasses when reading what is on the box and, as I mentioned, he sees blend of red dot and curve.

Hate to say it, but 40’s isn’t really “young” when it comes to eye sight, and astigmatism is both common and unlikely to be treated if there are no other vision issues. Sure, it’s remotely possible that there was a manufacturing defect, but it is much more likely that you just found two people with astigmatism.

 

[wanderinwalker]

First off, to the OP, you sir have an astigmatism. I've only recently learned some people see the red "dot" as a squiggly line. It's more commonly seen as a starburst, a comet or similar shape. Me, personally, I see my Aimpoint and Trijicon dots as having a rounded top, and then a kind of sun-burst scattering to the sides and bottom. And that's with my glasses. Without my glasses they tend to be just big bursts of starburst, hazy nebulas, or my green dot Trijicon actually resembles a freeze-frame of a firework going off if I turn up the brightness.

For what it's worth, I'm 40 and the optometrist just put me in bifocals for computer work.

 

[ExtremeSquared]

With astigmatism, the pattern is usually different per eye.

 

[usaral63]

cataract surgery solved my 'starburst' issue.

 

[conan32120]

I wear progressive lenses and parts of the lens see Starburst and part of my lenses see the red dot. Let your optometrist know and possibly he can help you out

 

[Jonesy814]

I have astigmatism that isn’t completely corrected with my glasses. I usually see a starburst. I recently bought a Swampfox Liberator and chose the green circle dot. I had read that circle dot reticals and green light work better than a red dot if you have astigmatism. I would have to agree. The green circle dot looks pretty darn crisp.
Just going to s green dot would make a difference too.

 

[Onty]

Checked today one SiIGHTRON scope (with tax close to 2000 euros), I could see clearly this:



Friends are teasing me that I "just see too much". Hope to check few scopes in another store.

Whatever is my problem, looks like I should stick with conventional scopes, preferably with German #4 reticle:

 

[JeffG]

I gave up red dots for conventional crosshairs. Same sort of problem, and too much fading of the red dot in bright light.

 

[3Crows]

Red dot sights do not work for folks with astigmatism. It can be from tolerable to exceptionally useless. I fall somewhere in between .

 

[Charlie Martinez]

I too have astigmatism which according to my eye doc is pretty severe. However I have found that the red dot distortion varies with different red dot sights. I have two red dot sights a Vortex Sparc II and a Vortex Crossfire. The Sparc II is (for some unexplained reason) significantly brighter in the maximum setting than the Crossfire. In its brightest setting the Sparc II appears to me as the infamous "starburst" image. The Crossfire in maximum brightness setting is about as intense as the Sparc II is at 70% but although very small and not that easy to find the tiny red dot appears sharp and well defined. After noticing this I reduced the Sparc II brightness down to the bare minimum I could see and its usable.

I question whether or not red dots are suitable for me because it is my understanding that their advantage is quicker target acquisition. I have to turn the brightness down to where the red dot is not that easily located so I am probably giving up a lot of the benefits. I'm new to the red dot so Im going to give it a chance but I have a decent compact 1.5X scope sitting around that might end up on my AR.

 

[doubleh]

Astigmatism can be corrected with glasses. My daughter has a bad case in both eyes and can use a red dot. I don't know your age but cartaracts can cause you to see some strange things and cataracts have different shapes. One of mine was like a cloud, the other like a many pointed star. My red dot's had grown a tail in the lower right quadrant. When I got rid of the cataracts I got rid of the tail as well.

My advise would be to go to good a eye doctor. I would look the one's available in your area up on the internet and choose the one with the best rating. I have vision insurance and only one in my area accepts it. Luckily he is excellent.

 

[wanderinwalker]

@Charlie Martinez and @3Crows , I wonder if part of your issues with the red dot stem from trying to focus on the dot like it's the front sight. It's a difficult habit to break after a lifetime of being drilled "front sight, front sight, front sight", but red dots work best when you focus on the target. And I'm learning that means focusing on THE SPOT you want to hit. Please keep in mind this is something I've picked up from reading around about the next rabbit hole I plan to pursue (red dot pistol sights), but it applies to long guns as well. The fuzzing and blooming of the dot seems to minimize for me when I focus really hard on looking at the target. When I get tired and revert back to focusing on the image in the optic, the fuzzing becomes more noticeable. Just something cheap to try that might help if you haven't already.

 

[Onty]

@Charlie Martinez and @3Crows , I wonder if part of your issues with the red dot stem from trying to focus on the dot like it's the front sight. It's a difficult habit to break after a lifetime of being drilled "front sight, front sight, front sight", but red dots work best when you focus on the target. And I'm learning that means focusing on THE SPOT you want to hit. Please keep in mind this is something I've picked up from reading around about the next rabbit hole I plan to pursue (red dot pistol sights), but it applies to long guns as well. The fuzzing and blooming of the dot seems to minimize for me when I focus really hard on looking at the target. When I get tired and revert back to focusing on the image in the optic, the fuzzing becomes more noticeable. Just something cheap to try that might help if you haven't already.

I think you nailed it squarely! That explains why I could see those curves so clearly, very sharp, on lower light settings, no fuzziness or starburst as others reported!

 

[zeke]

Tried some red dots at store, and can't see the smaller ones at all. Any i could see were distorted. Like alot of people say, everyone is different.

 

[wesmonster]

Same, dealt with this for a long time and mine is getting worse even with glasses. I get starbursts.
Two things that minimize it are using the lowest power setting possible, and putting a peep sight between your eye and the red dot. Learned that from my old stargazing days, the peep sight blocks stray light and makes the dot appear darker & crisper. Scopes and etched reticles are my first choices but some rifles only have room for a red dot.
I've also found that even a blurred dot is useable, as the dot itself is still brighter than the starbursts.