Remingtons Question for loads.

[Ratdog68]

Greetings. I'm a bit new to reloading... so, lookin' to pick yer brains.

Background: Using a Lee 4-turret loading press, already have the Forster case trimmer. Using an RCBS (inside) case reaming tool. Have a case lube pad, have/use a Lee powder scale. Have and use the factory crimp die too.

Not wanting to reinvent the wheel here... hoping to get some input on favorite recipes for a couple of rifles to try out and fine tune to the rifles being used.

Remington 700 ADL in .30-06 with a Leupold VariXII 2x-7x scope. Already have the scope dialed in pretty well, just did a thorough bore cleaning on it to ensure I don't have any lead/copper fouling in it.

Remington 742 in .30-06 with a low dollar ("vintage") K-Mart scope on it in 3x-9x. This belongs to a buddy of mine and it's going to get a thorough bore cleaning and I'm going to double check his scope with my bore sighter before we head out to the range next time.

I wasn't getting the tight groupings I should be... but, I'm out of practice and hadn't done the thorough bore cleaning. This is the first time I've fired this gun since getting it back from my father after his passing a couple of years ago and want to get it squared away. I don't think he'd ever cleaned it.

At present, I'm loading some Winchester 147 gr. FMJBT bullets with 62 grs. of Reloader 22 and some CCI primers. We didn't crimp them as tight as we probably will in the future... they weren't bad, but before I make any more changes, want to try 'em again now that my bore is CLEAN. I'm also trying out some hunting loads of Barnes TripleX 168gr. match bullets with 60 grs. of Reloader 22 and the same CCI primers. They were better, gonna see how those are with the CLEAN barrel.

My buddy wasn't aware of ensuring there's NO lead/copper fouling in the bore... and he wasn't seeing to it that the gun was propped UP to him, but was scrunching DOWN to the rifle at the bench... and his scope's view wasn't the best... so, he started monkeying with the adjustments. By the end of the day, he was ready to just give up on his scope/rifle. I'm getting him settled down and we're going to work on ruling out a fouled barrel... then bore sight his scope and ensure he's comfortable while at the bench to see how his 742 is shooting... THEN we'll go from there.

Not after "the hottest" loads out there... just a good recipe for accurate loads for these two models of Remingtons.

Appreciate it.

Charles

 

[rg1]

Your choice of powder for the Remington 742 in particular is not good for the 147 gr. load and will be hard on the semi-auto's bolt and action. Reloder 22 is much too slow for the 742's action. It will beat the locking lugs and receiver to death. A faster powder from IMR or H 4895 up to IMR 4320 would be more appropriate. I have a 742 that does not have a high round count but I shot some loads using IMR 4831 and have used mostly IMR 4350 with 150 grain bullets. The action has seen some battering. That's what kills the 742 is the battering of the locking lugs in the back of the receiver.
Reloder 22 is also very very slow burning for 147-150 grain bullets in a bolt action rifle. It's really a magnum rifle powder best used for heavy for caliber bullets. It also probably needs a magnum primer.
For your Win 147 fmj bullets in either 30-06 I'd recommend 46-49 grains of IMR 4895 or IMR 4064 powder. The very slowest powder I'd use in a Rem 742 would be Winchester 760. Just a warning about your 742 as I've done some damage to mine shooting slow rifle powders in it. Sorry for being so negative about your choice of powder but just trying to give sound advice to a new reloader.

 

[fprefect]

Producing tight groups with any rifle and load requires only one basic thing.

Consistency. Consistency on the part of the shooter, and consistency when preparing a batch of ammunition that you have found works well in your rifle.

How do find such a load? By trying as many different combinations of bullet, powder, quantities of powder, depth of bullet seating which effect the overall cartridge length, and even the brand of primer can make a difference in the performance of a load. Of course cleaning is necessary, but don't overdue it, particularly if you don't have a one piece steel cleaning rod with a rotating handle and a cleaning rod guide that slides in the action with the bolt removed to keep the cleaning rod from rubbing against the rifling at the end of the throat.

Any reloading manual whether published by a bullet maker or a powder manufacturer will give you an abundance of loads to work with. ALWAYS begin with the powder charge weights near the middle or low end of their recommendations and if you are working up a hunting load with as much velocity and accuracy as possible, increase powder weights slowing and fire at least 3 or preferably 5 rounds of each load to get an idea of how well it groups. After each increase in powder charge check for signs of excessive pressure. A good reloading manual will give you a good idea what to look for. Maximum loads will vary from one manual to another, and you are not "bound" by any of these figures. Your fired cartridges will tell you when you have reach what should be a maximum load. When looking for a lower velocity accuracy load, the same 3 to 5 shot routine also applies. This sounds like a lot of shooting and it is, but to get the best performance out of your rifle, the more testing and recording of results you can do, the tighter your groups will be.

And while you're doing all this testing of loads is a great time to practice consistency on your part as the shooter. Try to get in the habit of going through the same pre-shot routine before squeezing the trigger as this will always help to improve accuracy and produce tighter groups.

But remember to have fun. I know it may sound like a lot of work, but in the long run you will be glad you took the time to do it right.

F. Prefect

 

[NCsmitty]

Rel-22 is a bit too slow burning for your 147gr fmj to be efficient.
Your choice of the fmj bullet will usually not group as well as a hpbt or a sp, as most bulk fmj's are open base style and often vary in weight.

There are several powders that will work well in the 30'06. Scan the links that I'm providing and make a better choice.

www.hodgdon.com

www.alliantpowder.com


NCsmitty

 

[Seedtick]

Hey Ratdog68, I've got an old 742 that my Daddy bought for me back in '81 and it's been a dandy. Mine is chambered in .243 Win. and I started loading for it not long after I got it. I don't know about the one you're gonna be loading for but I ended up having to get a set of small base dies for mine. Keep that in mind if you have trouble getting the bolt to close completely on your reloads. I think that's called 'into full battery'. I was still pretty much still a kid back then (18) and new to reloading and I had to enlist the help of a long time reloader cause I didn't have a clue what was wrong. Hopefully you won't have any trouble.

ST

 

[lt522]

I don't know how it will work in a remington , but this load works great in my marlin xl7. I use 54.0grs of IMR 4350 with a Fed 210 mag. primer , in remington cases , and a 165gr hornady SST. This load has produced a 1/4" group a 100 yards for me. I don't know about this load for the 742. Look in your manual the load for your 168gr'ers should give you some idea of where to start.

 

[Ol` Joe]

At present, I'm loading some Winchester 147 gr. FMJBT bullets with 62 grs. of Reloader 22 and some CCI primers. We didn't crimp them as tight as we probably will in the future... they weren't bad, but before I make any more changes, want to try 'em again now that my bore is CLEAN. I'm also trying out some hunting loads of Barnes TripleX 168gr. match bullets with 60 grs. of Reloader 22 and the same CCI primers.

You are working up to these max book loads?

You`ll likely find loads a bit under max work best as far as accuracy. A regular cup & core bullet like the Sierra 165/168gr SPBT or Hornadies version with IMR4895, or 4064 as rg1 suggested would be a good place to start IMO.

 

[Ratdog68]

rg1... thank you for your time and input...

Your choice of powder for the Remington 742 in particular is not good for the 147 gr. load and will be hard on the semi-auto's bolt and action. Reloder 22 is much too slow for the 742's action. It will beat the locking lugs and receiver to death. A faster powder from IMR or H 4895 up to IMR 4320 would be more appropriate. I have a 742 that does not have a high round count but I shot some loads using IMR 4831 and have used mostly IMR 4350 with 150 grain bullets. The action has seen some battering. That's what kills the 742 is the battering of the locking lugs in the back of the receiver.
Reloder 22 is also very very slow burning for 147-150 grain bullets in a bolt action rifle. It's really a magnum rifle powder best used for heavy for caliber bullets. It also probably needs a magnum primer.
For your Win 147 fmj bullets in either 30-06 I'd recommend 46-49 grains of IMR 4895 or IMR 4064 powder. The very slowest powder I'd use in a Rem 742 would be Winchester 760. Just a warning about your 742 as I've done some damage to mine shooting slow rifle powders in it. Sorry for being so negative about your choice of powder but just trying to give sound advice to a new reloader.

Not knowing where to begin, I went to a local shop and asked the store keeper for a good powder for the .30-06... he reached over to the shelf and handed me the Reloader22. To be honest... I'm really not too impressed with this load combo... part of the reason I decided to post an inquiry here. Appreciate your input on the recipe for the 46-49 grs of the IMR powders. I'll keep those in mind as I expand my powder inventory. Thank you for the remarks on the affects of the Reloader22 for the model 742. I've passed that along to my buddy for him to reference back to.

 

[Ratdog68]

fprefect... agreed, consistency is paramount...

Producing tight groups with any rifle and load requires only one basic thing.

Consistency. Consistency on the part of the shooter, and consistency when preparing a batch of ammunition that you have found works well in your rifle.

How do find such a load? By trying as many different combinations of bullet, powder, quantities of powder, depth of bullet seating which effect the overall cartridge length, and even the brand of primer can make a difference in the performance of a load. Of course cleaning is necessary, but don't overdue it, particularly if you don't have a one piece steel cleaning rod with a rotating handle and a cleaning rod guide that slides in the action with the bolt removed to keep the cleaning rod from rubbing against the rifling at the end of the throat.

Any reloading manual whether published by a bullet maker or a powder manufacturer will give you an abundance of loads to work with. ALWAYS begin with the powder charge weights near the middle or low end of their recommendations and if you are working up a hunting load with as much velocity and accuracy as possible, increase powder weights slowing and fire at least 3 or preferably 5 rounds of each load to get an idea of how well it groups. After each increase in powder charge check for signs of excessive pressure. A good reloading manual will give you a good idea what to look for. Maximum loads will vary from one manual to another, and you are not "bound" by any of these figures. Your fired cartridges will tell you when you have reach what should be a maximum load. When looking for a lower velocity accuracy load, the same 3 to 5 shot routine also applies. This sounds like a lot of shooting and it is, but to get the best performance out of your rifle, the more testing and recording of results you can do, the tighter your groups will be. Little by little, I'll be getting back into my groove and am definately having fun working with this gun to bring it (and me) to a satisfying performance.

And while you're doing all this testing of loads is a great time to practice consistency on your part as the shooter. Try to get in the habit of going through the same pre-shot routine before squeezing the trigger as this will always help to improve accuracy and produce tighter groups.

But remember to have fun. I know it may sound like a lot of work, but in the long run you will be glad you took the time to do it right.

F. Prefect

I'm just getting started with this particular rifle. I'd purchased it for my late father. I doubt it'd EVER been cleaned before I got it back from him. LOL The view from the muzzle after a regular cleaning showed a tell tale copper fouling being present, as did the groups this rifle was puting up. I'm capable of 1 1/4" groups with factory ammo from a brand spanking new Remington 700, so, I know something is awry. The heavy cleaning of the barrel is one of the variables I'm taking care of... my bench time is rusty, so, I'm keeping that in mind as well. However... I'm puting decen groups with open sights from my .54 T/C Renegade, so, I'm not THAT rusty. The scope was grouping the shots... but a bit left. Before I begin tinkering with scope settings, I'm getting it CLEAN and gonna try some more shooting through it to get a better feel for where it's shooting with a CLEAN bore. I'm also keeping a log of what I shot, in which gun, how they were loaded, etc. I'm in no hurry, and as "bad" as it is shooting... it'll still put a killing shot on a deer at 100yds without any worry. It's just not shooting as well as I KNOW this gun CAN (at present).

And, yes... I use a bore guide with my cleaning rod for all my Remington 700s.

 

[Ratdog68]

NCsmitty? You happen to ride a Valkyrie M/C?

Rel-22 is a bit too slow burning for your 147gr fmj to be efficient.
Your choice of the fmj bullet will usually not group as well as a hpbt or a sp, as most bulk fmj's are open base style and often vary in weight.

There are several powders that will work well in the 30'06. Scan the links that I'm providing and make a better choice.

www.hodgdon.com

www.alliantpowder.com


NCsmitty

I know a "Smitty" in your neck of the country whom I haven't seen since a Valkyrie rally in Paducah, KY a few years back.

Hmmm... I'll keep the HPBTs in mind... these FMJBT is what was available to me when I was shopping for components to get started. Thanks.

 

[Ratdog68]

Seedtick... the 742 is my buddy's... it's a sweet one too.

Hey Ratdog68, I've got an old 742 that my Daddy bought for me back in '81 and it's been a dandy. Mine is chambered in .243 Win. and I started loading for it not long after I got it. I don't know about the one you're gonna be loading for but I ended up having to get a set of small base dies for mine. Keep that in mind if you have trouble getting the bolt to close completely on your reloads. I think that's called 'into full battery'. I was still pretty much still a kid back then (18) and new to reloading and I had to enlist the help of a long time reloader cause I didn't have a clue what was wrong. Hopefully you won't have any trouble.

ST

We're keeping an eye on how we do on getting the rounds into full battery. As I recall... we had to make an adjustment in seating height before crimping... seems to be feeding just fine for us.

 

[Ratdog68]

lt522, thanks for the input...

I don't know how it will work in a remington , but this load works great in my marlin xl7. I use 54.0grs of IMR 4350 with a Fed 210 mag. primer , in remington cases , and a 165gr hornady SST. This load has produced a 1/4" group a 100 yards for me. I don't know about this load for the 742. Look in your manual the load for your 168gr'ers should give you some idea of where to start.

I'll keep your input in mind as we refine our respective guns' recipe likings. We're sortin' the brass by manufacturer and keeping track of what's loaded in which too. The 1/4" @ 100yds is the neighborhood I'd like to move into with my Remington 700s.

 

[Ratdog68]

Ol' Joe... that load was what I found in a

You are working up to these max book loads?

You`ll likely find loads a bit under max work best as far as accuracy. A regular cup & core bullet like the Sierra 165/168gr SPBT or Hornadies version with IMR4895, or 4064 as rg1 suggested would be a good place to start IMO.

booklet I purchased with my initial component acquisition. I'm not striving for the hotest loads available, and understand the "less is more" approach. Don't live by, or even own a chronograph... what I'm striving towards is to be able to group tightly. Refining ME will be as much of the adventure as finding the load this rifle likes best. Thank you for taking the time to reply.