Retaining a lawyer?

[srv656s]

I don't really know anything about legal stuff. A friend suggested that before I get my CCW I might want to retain a lawyer in case I ever have to use the gun. You see people all the time on TV say they won't do something or another until they consult with their lawyer.

I don't have one. My parents don't either. I know I'd want one that is versed in conceal carry type issues, but how would I "retain" one? Do I have to go to his office and say "Will you be my lawyer?" Like I'm asking him out on a date? I don't really have any idea how this works.

Any help is appreciated...

Shawn

 

[Trebor]

If you take the NRA Personal Protection in the Home class, the legal portion has to be taught by either an attorney or a certified police officer. If it's an attorney, ask him for his card at the break and ask if he's familiar enough with criminal defense for you to contact him if needed. He may or may not practice in that area, but he might also be able to reccomend someone else for you.

If a cop teaches the class, ask who he'd call if he needs to be reprsented or who the local police union uses.

I believe the NRA also has an attorney referal service, but I don't know much about it.

I'm sure there will be some other suggestions here as well.

 

[RatFink]

For a long time I've been saying that some wise lawyer should set up and Gun Owners Legal Defense insurance program. With the number of people carrying on the rise a Law firm could charge just a small amount monthly and the group buy power would be more than enough to cover the costs of defending those that justifiable use a weapon in self defense and still still plenty of cash for a tidy profit.

It seems to me that the minute you draw your gun and consider pulling the trigger you are deciding on how much of your life you will lose, will you lose it all by being killed, or just lose $45,000 of it, your job and your family after going through a drawn out legal battle proving that it was a good shoot?

 

[geekWithA.45]

Once you find a good lawyer, tape his number to the back of your permit, and to the front of your safe(s).

 

[moa]

The NRA does have a lawyer referral service. I have used it. I called their HQ in Virginia.

 

[Logan5]

Retaining a lawyer basically entails contracting with him/her for future services. You'd definitely have to meet them and probably pay an advance fee, but it might be a good idea depending on what kind of rate you're able to negotiate. It's also nice to know you won't have to go lawyer shopping after something bad has already happened, you just call and they run to the batcave, since all the paymet details have already been negotiated.
Either way it's nice to know who you'd call in advance, but most people probably don't put attorneys on retainer for CCW purposes.

 

[mvpel]

When I retained Penny Dean to handle my situation with the Manchester Police (they grabbed me while I was carrying partially concealed, which is entirely legal in New Hampshire), she asked for a $500 payment against which her services would be billed. That $500 is called the "retainer." Each lawyer will likely have different requirements depending on his or her, or his or her firm's, policies.

 

[braindead0]

For a long time I've been saying that some wise lawyer should set up and Gun Owners Legal Defense insurance program. With the number of people carrying on the rise a Law firm could charge just a small amount monthly and the group buy power would be more than enough to cover the costs of defending those that justifiable use a weapon in self defense and still still plenty of cash for a tidy profit.

That scam is called 'pre-paid legal services'. You're better off negotiating a retainer (and future fees), rather than pouring money into somebody else'e pocket and receiving no service for it (necessarily).

Now, if it was a bunch of gun-owners jointly negotiating a retainer deal with a lawfirm, that'd be good I think.

 

[Jay Kominek]

That scam is called 'pre-paid legal services'. You're better off negotiating a retainer (and future fees), rather than pouring money into somebody else'e pocket and receiving no service for it (necessarily).

It isn't any different from car insurance, assuming the pre-paid legal services group is reputable.
(I suppose, though, if you're calling all insurance policies a scam, then, ok, fair enough.)

 

[braindead0]

(I suppose, though, if you're calling all insurance policies a scam, then, ok, fair enough.)

Odds of anyone getting their monies worth on any insurance are very small, if you did the insurance companies wouldn't make any money. That puts it into the Scam category, similar to most taxes as well.

 

[Dex Sinister]

Odds of anyone getting their monies worth on any insurance are very small, if you did the insurance companies wouldn't make any money.

Hence the historic origins of "Mutual Insurance" companies, which - at least when they originated - were simply groups who pooled resources to deal with certain defined types of risks.

Dex }:>=-

 

[Jay Kominek]

Odds of anyone getting their monies worth on any insurance are very small, if you did the insurance companies wouldn't make any money.

The point isn't to get your money's worth, the point is to convert an otherwise unquantifiable risk into a simple payment.
But, obviously you're rather set on things, which is OK; I have no interest in whether or not you like insurance. However it confuses things when you label things "scams" when they're equivalent to generally (if perhaps unwisely) accepted financial practices.
I was just trying to clear up the confusion for everyone else.

 

[El Tejon]

srv, well, it depends.

"Retaining" a lawyer just means you hire one. Because of the flexibility of private contract that could be many things to many different people (check your state's Supreme Court's guidelines). As well, there are different types of lawyers, just like doctors or construction professionals.

When working for businesses, such as FFLs, I usually ask for several hours worth of work and then bill against that. Sometimes if I go way back with a guy, he just calls, sets up a time and we start in on it, no money needed to start.

In the world of the very bad things, where the tilecrawlers live, you will most likely encounter a flat fee. A very bad thing happens, and the entire flat fee is delivered to retain the criminal defense attorney. This will not usually include expenses for various things like expert witnesses, forensic testing or depositions.

In my world, it would be "unusual" for something to give me money for something that has not happened and they purportedly do not wish to happen. Under my state Supreme Court guidelines, I would have to stick the money in the trust account and not touch it.

What you may want to do is just schedule an hour to talk to an attorney. Drop by your questions, and then go over them. I've done this before and think its very smart for all those who carry a pistol--where they can/cannot carry, definition of self-defense/lethal/non-lethal, explain the statutes, attitudes of potential jury pool, attitude of the Prosecuting Attorney, what to do after very bad things happen, etc., et al.

Just be aware that lawyers usually specialize, like docs. The guy who did your mother's will or does the taxes for Uncle Bill's plumbing supply company may or may not crawl on the tile and know the score in criminal court. Since the guys who come to see me are legal LTCHers (CCWers), they get sorted out in fairly short order and we spend a few minutes talking guns as well.

 

[Dave Markowitz]

The Shooters' Bar(SM)

This is my list of pro-RKBA attorneys:

http://www.building-tux.com/dsmjd/law/lawr_list.htm

 

[RatFink]

I do understand how insurance works, and the similarity to what I proposed, in both cases you are actually paying for services you hope you never need, but here's why I think it's a good idea;

I can afford a small monthly payment, I can't however see myself ever having $20,000-$40,000 in the bank to spend if I did happen to find my self confronted with the prospect of a lot of jail time and needing a lawyer just because some DA finds something about my righteous use of deadly force against someone trying to do me or a loved one harm. People in that position quite often loose everything, life savings, house, wife, business, retirement accounts in an attempt to defend themselves.

I find it an acceptable price to pay.

 

[patentnonsense]

You can assert your rights WITHOUT having previously hired a lawyer -
just say "I will not answer questions without my lawyer present."

That's if you're ever arrested or read your rights. (Many defense lawyers would say that if you hear the Miranda warning you MUST stop talking - at that point talking isn't likely to do you any good at all.) Short of that point, if you can point out facts to satisfy a cop assessing a situation, it might be reasonable to do so - Many cops are just honest stressed-out people who have to sort out god-awful messes. (However, you should never consent to any search of any kind.)

Note that the police WILL often try hard to make an arrested person talk despite the warning - one technique they use around here is to have multiple cops shouting at an arrested person, constantly interrupting him (even while he's actually asking for a lawyer), until he loses his temper and starts arguing with them.

I too think that a nationwide network of on-call defense lawyers would be a great idea - but it ain't here yet. And you can't insure against everything - life ain't that easy!

More experienced defense lawyers are welcome to comment, but that's my .02 - and no I'm not your lawyer, just commenting generally!

 

[einstein]

Shawn:

Within the first couple of months of buying my first gun here in CA I did just what you are talking about.

I got the name out of a magazine that CRPA puts out. CA Rifle and Pistol Assoc.

Maybe there's something like that in your area or state.

I chose the name of a guy who is actively pro-gun. Fights bad local laws, lectures, etc.

I met with him in his office. Asked some questions. Keep his card in my wallet. Send him a Xmas card every year. Email him a question every once in a while.

Ran into him 2-3 years ago at a small dinner. Forget the function. Re-introduced myself. "Met in your office a couple of years ago..." Took him a couple moments to remember me. Then he said, "You don't NEED to talk to me, do you?" We both laughed. I said I was just staying in touch.

I think it's a good idea. Hope this is helpful.

Frank

 

[Carlos]

Glad to see some Gunsnet boys running from the chaos.

Sean, just to ease your mind, call the Bar Association. Find out the lawyers who specialize in this niche.

Any lawyer worth his salt will consult for free. If you like him/her, tell them that you are worried about liability, you like them, and will most likely retain them if something were to rear its ugly head.

CHL is a state of mind. Develop it. Be lucid at all times. I know you have a brain.

Don't spend any unnecessary monies on retaining a lawyer for a contingency that hasn't happened. Just read up on the laws in your state.

Act accordingly.

 

[labgrade]

Get to know your local/state GOA affiliate - cultivate a relationship there.

Ask 'em who's a good one for your purposes - I wouldn't touch the Bar with a ten foot pole.

Contact the attorney, make an appointment - sometimes initial consultations are free & if not, a $50 charge for an hour's worth for pointed Q&As is worth the time - best to be pre-educated & as Carlos mentioned, always a real good idea to do some pre-research on your state laws so you can ask better questions.

& too, get a list of lawyers & interview them as you would for any other hired help - except youy're looking for a hired gun - don't just go to one & use 'em because you don't want to put in some legwork - you want a bulldog that has experience/proven record.

Too, never hurts to have pre-existing relationships with the higher up muckies in the Sheriff/po-po dept - can grease the skids some afterwards - if needed.

/random brain-dump. Pushing a year since my arrest for "legal carry" & about to let the hammer drop .... we'll see.