Retro-build M-16 clone

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mookiie

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I want to build a rifle in an M-16 like configuration circa the Vietnam era and was hopping some of you might know sources for parts? I was thinking of the carry handle upper receiver(single piece) with a 22" barrel, rifle length gas system with classic pinned gas block, and bakelite handguard? Would that be an accurate description of what the typical infantry man would have been armed with?

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Brownells has the upper receiver and they are getting their A1 barrels back in stock around October. Numerich has A1 stock sets.
 
replica

Bakelite furniture will be hard to find. Not really bakelite, more like wood chips. Bakelite is made from wood dust.
I have seen that furniture in red, black and green.
Upper, lower from nodak/spud. Lots of net sites have the barrel.
 
essential arms used to be a good source for retro stuff
 
I stumbled upon a used C7 m16a1 upper for $110. I also snagged a pretty rare Del-Ton 4150 chrome lined 20" lightweight (delton usually only makes 4140 non chromed lightweights). I'm just waiting on my used A1 full furniture set from Numrich ($60).
 
I want to build a rifle in an M-16 like configuration circa the Vietnam era and was hopping some of you might know sources for parts? I was thinking of the carry handle upper receiver(single piece) with a 22" barrel, rifle length gas system with classic pinned gas block, and bakelite handguard? Would that be an accurate description of what the typical infantry man would have been armed with?

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

You'll find your answers here- http://www.retroblackrifle.com/
 
There are a few different versions of Vietnam era M16's. The very earliest are those with handguards, stocks and grips that were made out of a brown material and then painted green, they were marked "Armalite AR15".

To build one of these will take a bunch of patience and deep pockets as the parts are rare and expensive.

The second version is the Model 601/M16, commonly called a slabside because, like the earlier AR15, they have no forward assist and no fence around the mag release. The buttstock is different also as it has no compartment for the cleaning kit. They came with a three prong flash hider.

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Next came the M16E1, this is an evolution of the M16 that now included a forward assist. Also the early style pivot pin, which required a screwdriver to remove, was changed to a push pin that was captured by a pin and spring. The lower was changed by having a boss cast into the lower to accommodate the spring and retention pin.

These transitional rifles still used the early non trap door buttstock and three prong flash hider.

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Last of the Vietnam era M16's is the M16A1. These have a full fence around the mag release to prevent accidentally hitting the release and dropping the mag until the solider wanted to.

The buttstock now incorporated a compartment for the cleaning kit and the barrel now had the familiar birdcage flash hider.

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All the front handguards are the same with some very minor differences. They are made out of a plastic material and it is getting difficult to find originals that aren't damaged.

Now, I am the first person to admit that I am anal about building clones of anything. I feel that if you are going to do something, for gods sake, do it right. For that reason I just hate to see a "clone" of a Vietnam era M16 that is built on a A2 lower. Other things that bug me are using a late model delta ring instead of the early straight style and using an A2 buttstock rather than a correct early one.

If you look at the pictures I posted, note that the upper and lower receivers are not anodized black, they are a color called Colt grey.



Sorry for being so pedantic. Sometimes I just can't help myself.
 
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Actually Highpower, what you have there in the first picture appears to be actually an early Colt SP1. Nice rifle BTW!! However, the military never used the 2-screw system and that was only used on the civilian models to prevent military parts from being used. Stupid I know, but that's a pretty good sign that it's a real Colt rifle.
Really though, unless you are looking at the pre-production prototype ARs, the first series to be adopted was the 601 that had the green painted brown furniture, a 1:14" twist barrel, duckbill flash suppressor, chrome slick-side bolt carrier, slab-side lower, and smaller delta-shaped charging handle. This was the rifle adopted by the USAF to arm the Security Police, replacing the M2 carbine in May of 1962.
The 602 series was the next upgrade by replacing the delta charging handle with the now current T-shaped charging handle, the furniture was changed from the green painted brown furniture to black and the rifling was now changed to a faster 1:12" twist as well as making the barrel slightly larger diameter (about .010") in front of the front sight base than the earlier 601 series. Another major change was the replacement of the thin duck bill flash suppressor with the heavier 3-prong style that served until the adoption of the bird cage flash suppressors.
The Army and Marines still refused to adopt the AR-15 as they lacked a way to manually force the bolt forward which lead to the development of the 603 series, first the XM-16E1 and later the M-16A1. Both featured the now familiar forward assist and the 1:12" twist barrels. Through the lifetime of the 603 series, the barrel changed to have chrome lines chambers then eventually fully chromed chambers and barrels. The XM still retained the 3-prong suppressor and also featured a chrome plated bolt and carrier as well as a buttstock with no provisions for a cleaning kit. A chnge to the lower receiver was the addition of the single ridge to prevent accidental magazine release to a point but mainly was now there to retain the pivot pin as a captive pin rather than the removable pin of the earlier 601 and 602 series. The later M-16A1 seen a change from the 3-prong suppressor to the birdcage, a phosphate finished bolt and carrier, a buttstock that now featured a compartment for a cleaning kit and a protective ridge around the magazine release button that was purpose designed to prevent accidentally releasing the magazine. This was the rifle that served up until the adoption of the M-16A2.
During this time, the Air Force parted ways, mainly due to the forward assist. They felt it wasn't needed and insisted that this feature not be included in Air Force M-16 contracts. This is the primary difference between the M-16 and the XM-16E1/M-16A1 series rifles. Production features otherwise mirrored the 603 series with the addition of the single detent pin tube, 3-prong suppressor, solid stock and chrome plated bolts and carriers with the later magazine protecting ridge, birdcage suppressor and phosphate coated bolts and carriers. One change that was incorporated with the 603 versions that wasn't carried over even in the later 604 variants was the Air Force decided to stay with the solid buttstocks rather than go with a butt trap feature.
Many of these old Air Force rifles from the 601, 602 and 604 series were finally upgraded to M-16A2 standards in early 2000s probably around 03-04 with the addition of a new A2 upper, fire control group, buttstock, pistol grip...well, pretty much most everything other than the lower, selector lever, buffer and buffer spring and a few odds and ends then were either stamped or electropenciled with "BURST" and the "AUTO" stamp was "XXXX" out.
I can remember we had 2 pre-604 lower A2 rifles in our vault that would occasionally come out into the classroom. I would wait for them to push the pivot pin out and when it fell out, go on an epic rant about how they broke the weapon and they would be charged with destruction of government property and get a chuckle out of their reactions as I then went on to tell them that no, actually these old lowers are still out there and if you take a good sniff, you can probably still smell dead VC on them so if they do get issued one when they deploy, just be aware of that pivot pin that will come out and to not loose it.
Really, there are 2 excellent sources for information on the early pre-A2 rifles. First is the retro section at AR-15.com. Lot of good information there! A second source to look into is R. Blake Steven's book, The Black Rifle. This book while expensive is a "must have" for anyone serious about the early years of the development and goes into a LOT of detail.


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My 601 clone. All original parts except for the fire control group, lower Nodak Spud 601 lower receiver and the later style buffer. Edgewood buffers are EXPENSIVE especially for a part you never really see.

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The early bolt catch on my 601.

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The early Delta style charging handle. Yeah, easy to see why this got changed in the later series.

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The green painted brown furniture.

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The finish on the Nodak Spud lower is a little lighter than the original upper but it's not uncommon to see this especially in Air Force issued rifles.
 
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What the hell, let's throw up some pics of my non-601 clones:)

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Here's my clone of an early Air Force contract 604 series M-16. Note the 3-prong flash suppressor, the chromed bolt carrier group and captive pivot pin spring housing tube under the ejection port cover.

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The Army/Marine XM-16E1 version with it's forward assist, 3-prong suppressor chromed bolt carrier group solid stock and the same lower receiver design with the pivot pin detent spring tube.

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This was not an uncommon field modification. With early rifles lacking chrome plated chambers and bores, cases could become stuck in rusted and fouled chambers. Early XM-16E1 rifles lacking a butt trap lead to modifications like this where a hole was drilled into the handguard to allow an assembled cleaning rod to be stowed for quick access to knock out a stuck casing. I did the same sort of modification and used a piece of bicycle inner tube to secure it in place.

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There were minor items that changed over the years to what we're more familiar with today that found it's way into the system. This bolt release is now installed on my XM-16E1 clone. This was about the time there was a transition from the early 601 style to the later boot-heel style bolt catch button we know of today.

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My late series 604 clone. Note that the snag-prone 3-prong flash suppressor has been replaced with the birdcage style. Another change was the addition of the fence around the magazine release to prevent accidentally dropping your magazine and the shiny "non-tactical" bolt carrier group has been replaced with a phosphate finished style instead. However in reality, I have seen a lot of mix-match parts out there. A black bolt carrier, chrome bolt, black extractor a small head firing pin held in by and older style solid firing pin retaining pin.:scrutiny: Yeah, whatever works and what we have handy seemed to have been the motto even back in the day!

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My late model 603 M-16A1 clone. To me, this will always be the rifle of the Cold War. Reagan was in office, the Soviet threat was real, troops in Europe ready to repel Red Army hoards and this was the rifle that stood up to them! :cool: Again, a later style bird cage suppressor and fenced lower receiver like the later M-16 as well as a phosphate bolt but serrated to work with the forward assist the Army and Marines insisted on. Also not really seen is the addition of a butt trap for a cleaning kit.
 
I'll sell you my M16a1 upper (original twist barrel only shoots 55 grain ammo) for $250 + ship. It is a Colt pull off from when Fort Ord infantry upgraded its rifles in late 70s. It is in very good shape, has no BCG tho.Has the prong flash hider and tear drop forward assist
PM me
 
And one more just for fun.:p


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Looks like 2 Air Force late model 604s, huh?

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Well, how about I put the magazines in?

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And now we'll open the ejection port cover. Wait, what's wrong with that bolt on the rifle on the right? Is that an early chrome bolt carrier? Nope, that's a CMMG .22 conversion kit.

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I made one of my ARs into a quasi-dedicated late 604 clone. Everything in it is from an actual 604 rifle but I left out the buffer and buffer spring (not really needed when using a CMMG .22 conversion) and the gas tube isn't right either. I wanted to keep the gas from blowing back down the gas tube and fouling the bolt so I decided to get rid of the gas tube. However, the gas tube is what is needed to keep the handguards from twisting around as the gas tube also retains the handguard cap. My solution was to find an old scrap gas tube and cut it down. To prevent the gas from being blown back out onto the barrel under the handguards, I simply installed it upside down sealing off the gas hole and securing the handguard cap. If I ever want to convert it back over to a 5.56mm 604 clone, I would just have to throw in a buffer, buffer spring, bolt carrier group and a new gas tube from my parts stash and viola, a centerfire rifle is born.
 
Try a forum search of AR Retro or Retro AR as we just recently had a few threads on the subject and if I recall correctly some good links for parts. Me? I cheat having a few Colt SP1 rifles. Highpower, thanks again for sharing your really nice exhibits and to the others who shared their rifles.

Ron
 
Thanks for the kind comments.

Grunt; That is indeed an early SP1. Also it's the rifle that got me into the whole retro AR thing. I have a couple more that are in the process of being built, one is a XM177E2 and the other is a 607.
 
Highpower, I know what you mean about wanting everything correct on our clones. I was so glad when Nodak Spud began producing lowers with the correct contours and went with his receivers exclusively for my retro builds. My poor 601 first started out on a black Olympic Arms A2 lower and while it worked, the wrong lines and wrong color just bugged me to no end! You'll notice the one picture with the early bolt catch is installed on that Olympic lower but since then, that went onto the new 601 lower from NDS and I'm much happier now. I would like to get an edgewater buffer to be completely correct but with the prices those things bring and the fact you can't see it when it's assembled has stopped me on that front. Still, it's just one of those little details that makes my OCD flare up from time to time.
 
Well, there's the word you used right there, "lately." I had mine for years back before the whole retro thing really took off like it has.
 
My SP1 came with a birdcage flash hider and a bolt carrier notched for the forward assist, but no forward assist. My dad bought it new back in the 70's.
 
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