S&W ID verification

[cruzer62]

First post for me: I have a very nice old S&W .38 Special and would like to hear from someone who can support or disagree with what I believe is the correct ID of this revolver: Ser. # 470033, nickel plated, 5 screw, 5" barrel, walnut grips with single brass mounting screw in center of diamond surrounded by checkering, nickel S&W grip medallions, square butt, rounded edge front sight, no adjustable rear sight, fluted cylinder (with matching Ser. No. on rear). Right frame plate: MADE IN U.S.A. Left side frame rear of trigger: small stamped S&W logo. Smooth trigger sides and front surface, smooth sides of hammer with fine engraved checkering on hammer thumb plate. Left side of barrel: SMITH & WESSON; Right side of barrel: 38 S.& W. SPECIAL CTG; Top of barrel:
(very small font, first line) SMITH & WESSON SPRINGFIELD, MASS. U.S.A.
(second line) PATENTED FEB.6,06, SEPT.14, 09, DEC.29, 14

My research shows this as a ".38 Military & Police Model of 1905, 4th Change". If this is correct, foot notes state that sqaure butt S&W's from this era are rare, as is nickel plating; the mystery is in the barrel inscriptions: I have been unable to find verification of these exact insciptions or any reference to the small font inscription on top of the barrel. Also, my reference books do not cross-reference serial numbers to exact year of production in the early 1900's. Any information on the exact ID of this pistol would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

 

[Oyeboten]

Hi Cruzer 62,


Usually these kinds of research quests, when for an S&W, would be directed to "radagast" in the 'S&W date of Birth' Column, under "Revolvers".


But, I could give it a whirl.


Serial Numbering of the ".38 Military & Police Model of 1905, 4th Change", ran from 241704 in 1915, to, 1000000 in 1942.


I would guess yours would have been made in the latter-mid 1920s, as say, maybe like 1926, 1927. But I do not have any narrower references to say certainly.


Square Butts predominated after WWI, but are scarce in the very early ones.

Nickle is less common then Blue, definitely, for any era of production.


These were about as high of quality as High Quality ever got, and are suberb Revolvers for carry or pleasure Shooting.


Standard pressure, Round Nose Lead, or, Lead Wadcutter Ammunition should be all it is permitted to shoot, avoiding any Jacketed or Hardball or "+P" Kinds out of kindness to the Alloys used at that time.

With appropriate Ammunition, these Revolvers last virtually for ever.


Serial Number should also appear on the 'flat' underneath the Barrel, where the Ejector Rod rests.


Stocks ( 'Grips') were often Serial Numbered to the Revolver in Pencil on their back sides.


Post some images of it so we can have fun seeing it?

 

[Radagast]

cruzer62:
I'm assuming you are using the Standard Catalog of S&W as your reference. The note about the square butt being rare is a typo, it is the round butt that is rare. The patent date stampings are correct for the 5th change, which was introduced in 1915. I can tell you that serial numbers in the 358xxx range shipped in December 1920 and the SCSW notes serial numbers in the 500,000 range shipped in 1927, so we can extrapolate that your gun shipped between 1921 & 1927, probably 1925 to 1927, as Oyeboten said.

To get an exact shipping date, for $50 you can obtain a factory letter from Roy Jenkins, the S&W factory historian which will give you the shipping date, address and any special details regarding your gun.

 

[cruzer62]

Oyeboten/Radagast: Thanks for the comments. I failed to mention that the serial number on the barrel is also matching. I will post some pictures ASAP.

 

[Radagast]

cruzer62:
A mistake on my part, the patent dates are correct for the 4th Change, not 5th Change. There was no 5th Change.
It was normal for the butt, barrel flat and rear face of the cylinder to have the serial number stamped on them during that period, usually the serial number on the barrel would have a B prefix.

 

[Jim K]

I also read that in the SCSW and wondered about it. The round butt was the more common earlier, but by the time that gun was made the square butt was the most common and that continued through the Victory Model and the post-war Model 10, right down to the last few years, when S&W went back to a round butt frame.

Just a nitpick, but the M&P never went to serial number 1000000; the whole reason for the "Victory Model" was that S&W's numbering machine only went to six digits, so when they reached 999999, they decided to use a letter prefix. They selected "V for Victory"; the next number was V 1 and a legend was born.

Jim

 

[Oyeboten]

Hi Jim Keenan,


Quite correct..!


And, somehwere, in a Sock Drawer, light freckling of the otherwise perfect Blue, is No. 999999...for all we know.

 

[Radagast]

Or it could be on the bottom of the Atlantic, a British Service Revolver that never made it into service. You never know though. One of the first 10 .44 Magnums was IDed in the DOB thread which I would not have expected, so the last M&P may turn up as a query one day.