S&W M&P 15 5.45x39 vs Arsenal SGL31

[Bob01]

Greetings All,

I am in the market for a 5.45x39 rifle. I had in my head that I wanted a nicer AK74 - ie a Waffen Werks, a second hand Arsenal, etc. Looking on Gunbroker I see a used M&P 15 5.45x39 (albiet with a non S&W lower - its marked "Grizzly-15") that may end near the same price as a used Arsenal SGL31.

When compared new, an SGL31 and the M&P 15 5.45x39 are similar in price.

At the end of the day, I want something that will eat surplus ammo and give me relatively trouble free service. I plan on keeping up with cleaning after each range session especially considering I will only be using surplus ammo with this rifle.

I really like the idea of an AK74, because of its robustness and that I can change the stock so that it folds. The AR I guess has going for it better accuracy (maybe not in this case since its used), can switch uppers so I can shoot other calibers and more aftermarket options...

Below are some pictures of the S&W in question.



















"USED Complete AR-15 Rifle - S&W M&P-15 5.45x39 Upper w/ L.A.R. Grizzly Multi Caliber Marked Lower & 2 (TWO) 5.45x39 SS 30rd C-Products Magazines

Description:
Overall Good++ Condition - Some assembly/usage marks, wear to finish, nicks in paint (see photos). This one's not a "Safe queen" - it's been used but not abused. Great truck gun or cheap range plinker with affordable surplus 5.45x39 ammo!
Complete AR-15 5.45x39 Rifle with 5.45x39 marked M4 profile barrel, bolt, and magazines.
Lower is LAR Grizzly (Model: Grizzly-15) marked Cal: MULTI and has some assembly marks (most noticeably near trigger guard and bolt catch). Fire/Safe Markings on both sides of receiver. We're told by the customer we got this from that the upper is S&W M&P-15.
Optics Ready - No Rear Sight
4-Position Collapsible Buttstock
Standard A2 Grip & Carbine Length Handguards
Includes 2x USED 5.45x39 SS Marked C-Products 30rd Magazines. Different finishes on them - one magazine is matte and drops free, the other magazine is shiny (with lots of nicks in the finish) and does not drop free."

Thank you in advance for your inputs!

 

[Cosmoline]

I've been looking into this as well. Oddly, I've found complete S&W's in 5.45 run about the same as just the uppers.

From research, the big drawback on the AR style is the mess caused by surplus ammo. AK patterns are easier to clean and more forgiving of rust.

Hopefully some folks with either or both will chime in.

 

[Cal-gun Fan]

I own an Arsenal AK and my dad owns an AR-15 in 5.56. For 5.45x39, you're going to want to go with the AK. Get a platform that the round was made for. All 5.45 is steel cased, and a lot of it is corrosive. Its cheap, but good ammo. For the AK, you get so much more for your money. Think of it this way-for $900, you get the best AK on the market. It can easily mount optics and will shoot...ehh, probably 1.5-3 MOA at 100 yards if you do your part. Extremely rugged, fairly lightweight, easy to clean, etc. The MP 15s are nice, but on the other hand they are fairly entry level as far as ARs go. Plus, I've read about them choking with surplus 5.45.

 

[JustinJ]

The 5.45 is extremely dirty and is much better suited to the 74 as the AR platform is just more finicky. For training and plinking the 5.45 uppers are great for savings but for real world use no way. Maybe in a piston AR but not DI, imo.

 

[Inebriated]

Ammo aside, I'll go with the basic answer and say "choose what you shoot better".

But if you want it to eat surplus ammo without trouble, then the SGL-31 is the way to go.

 

[FIVETWOSEVEN]

I shot one of these ARs before and it was accurate enough to hit a steel gong at 200 yards but that's all of my experience. I would recommend the AK over the AR here because of the corrosive ammo. The AR is a DI so it's dumping that corrosive residue into the receiver. Magazines are also harder to find for this AR because you can't use STANAG magazines.

I say just stick with the AK, it won't let you down.

 

[dprice3844444]

if only steel case,ak with chrome bore.the ar partswise and repair wise,would be better.plus, you could buy an extra 223 upper and have 2 calibers in 1 rifle

 

[Adam123]

At the end of the day, I want something that will eat surplus ammo and give me relatively trouble free service.

Then you should have went with an AK74.

 

[Rob G]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob01

At the end of the day, I want something that will eat surplus ammo and give me relatively trouble free service.

Then you should have went with an AK74.

+1.

I organize group shooting events for friends. We always have 3 or 4 ARs and my AK-74. We also shoot the cheapest steel case ammo we can find to keep costs down. The ARs are sometimes okay with the cheap ammo, and sometimes they're not. We jammed up three one day shooting it with one locked so badly it had to go to a gunsmith to get the round out. The AK has never had a problem with the cheap stuff and that's in a gun with a higher round count than any of the other rifles we bring.

Bear in mind, I'm not putting down ARs. I think they're great rifles. But if you're looking for a gun that will flawlessly fire the worst ammo you can find, then you're looking for an AK.

 

[swmp9jrm]

I don't have an AK-74 - want one, but just haven't gotten around to it yet. I do have an M&P15 in 5.45x39. It has thousands of rounds of milsurp through it - all corrosive - with no issues whatsoever. A couple of extra steps in cleaning to clear out the corrosive salts, but this thing runs no differently (except cheaper) than my 5.56 AR's. And the nice thing about the M&P is that with a barrel and a bolt in 5.56 I can switch ammo if the need ever arises.

Certainly no reason not to get the AK, but I also see no reason to discount the AR.

 

[RobGR]

One thing to note is that the first batch of 5.45x39 S&Ws had major keyholing issues b/c of out-of-spec barrels. That all should be rectified by now and S&W has excellent customer service, but definitely something to ask the seller.

The 7n6 5.45 surplus is a dirty mutha. Super easy to clean my SGL 31, just have to get in and make sure you hit those key spots where the corrosive salts could set up shop. I clean as soon as I get home from the range, b/c I'm by the coast and that is my typical routine anyway, strip it down in my garage sink, put on a kettle of boiling hot water and pour. Most of the hot water evaporates, but it'll need a wipe down, then some CLP or RemOil, wipe down again. One spot I've missed and recommend everyone checking is the muzzle, remove the brake and clean it off b/c it cakes up like you won't believe. I use a old toothbrush and fine steel wool (if necessary) to remove. I use the same bore snake on all my 22lr, 5.56 and 5.45 barrels.

I recently built an AR and decided to go 5.56, why do I want 5.45 on a DI system and when I already own an AK74. I did the research though and Magpul 5.56 pmags can easily be used for the 5.45 cartridge, just use 26 or so rounds in a 30 rnd pmag and you should not have any feeding issues. I think it was the clear window pmags. You'll have to double check that if you go the S&W route. However, I recommend Arsenal's SGL 31, a Saiga (which you could convert yourself), a Vepr or any other AK74 variant from a reputable company, like Waffen, nothing wrong with having an AKM in your collection. Get one and let us know what you decide on!

 

[RobGR]

swmp9jrm

I don't have an AK-74 - want one, but just haven't gotten around to it yet. I do have an M&P15 in 5.45x39. It has thousands of rounds of milsurp through it - all corrosive - with no issues whatsoever. A couple of extra steps in cleaning to clear out the corrosive salts, but this thing runs no differently (except cheaper) than my 5.56 AR's. And the nice thing about the M&P is that with a barrel and a bolt in 5.56 I can switch ammo if the need ever arises.

Certainly no reason not to get the AK, but I also see no reason to discount the AR.

Any misfeeds or FTF, FTE with the 7n6?

Anything you had to trouble shoot, like mags, to get her running smoothly?

If you've shot a couple thousand rounds of the stuff through your S&W, it's a pretty damn good gauge on the firearm. I was concerned about build up in the gastube & receiver, that's why I just decided it was a bad idea for my home build.

 

[nyc71]

I own a M&P 5.45 & haven't had any issues with the riffle, I find myself shooting it more often because of ammo cost. I would love to own a SLG-31 "at right price"

 

[Cal-gun Fan]

Honestly, compared to other AKs, the SGLs arent that expensive anymore. Wasr's aren't $350 out the door. If you can find one, they're running $500 before tax etc. Saigas are right around $420 out the door unconverted. Waffen Werks are $700.