S&W: Only Five Rounds???

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Phriend

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I really like the S&W J-Frame weapons. However, it seems that these guns only hold five rounds. Is that going to be sufficient for self-defense??? (I'm not so sure I'd feel safe with that).

Also, do you happen to know of any handguns that are similar to the S&W J-Frames that are able to hold more amunition?
 
I carry a 5 round J frame and feel well protected.

You are going to get a lot of answers from those who feel under-gunned without 17 rounds in the gun and 2 reloads.

IMO if a 5 round J frame wasn't a good handgun for SD it would be S&W's top selling revolver, would it?
 
I remember hearing of a FBI report from the 80's stating that most shootings involving non-leos took place at abut 7 feet involving 3 rounds or less. Someone please correct me with quotable sources. I well understand that bullets flying at your head tend to throw off one's aim, but still, if you cannot hit with the first 5, what makes you think 12 more will help?
 
IIRC, it's 2.3 rounds average fired, and 21 feet distance, per FBI. That's old data, and the introduction of big box autos has upped the number of rounds fired. But it only takes one to do the job, and as noted, if 5 isn't enough, 15 probably won't help.

The most legendary combat pistol of all time only holds 7 rounds.
 
There will always be more evil out there, than one has ammunition.

Once this accepted, this frees up the mind, to have better mindset about how to go along in Life's Journey.

Prevention, avoiding, evading and dealing with evil.

7, 6 and even 5 round are proven in dealing with evil, if one has the mindset and skill sets to do so.
 
The intent/purpose of the little J-frames was never really engaging in running gun battles with multiple assailants. The gun was thought of more as a last ditch, up close and personal means to stop an attacker, and...within its limitations...is pretty good in that role.

Small, light, portable, and with a power level that can be taken seriously...a J-frame is more likely to be the gun that you won't leave at home. The gun that you have with you is the best one for self-defense.
 
So long as you stay out of Hollywood, you'll be fine. ;)

However, it seems that these guns only hold five rounds. Is that going to be sufficient for self-defense???

In the real world, a J-frame has just enough bullets to either get you into trouble or get you out of it, but not both. If that's insufficient, your jury might not be too kind in its evaluation of the "defense" element of "self-defense."
 
Make the time and effort to learn to shoot the J-frame proficiently over the ranges at which it is intended to be deployed. Point shooting skills with this gun are a good thing to develop. If I have to use it in all probability things will be happening close and fast other wise I in all probability will be using the Nike defense.
 
If 5 shots are not enough to defend yourself against a would be attacker. I suggest more range time.
 
Make the time and effort to learn to shoot the J-frame proficiently over the ranges at which it is intended to be deployed.

And bear always in mind that the little snub wasn't designed with 25-yard target shooting in mind. It's the quintessential "Belly Gun" that's at its best when deployed at powder burn distances.
 
Are 5 enough? According to all the stats, it very likely is. There are no guarantees of course. Though if you need more than 5 it's most likely because either:

1) You are missing

2) You are badly outnumbered

3) Both

Not all inclusive (didn't count body armor), but you get the idea. Missing won't win a gunfight. And if you are outnumbered? Say, 3 to 1 and they are armed with guns. Eek, that's 3 aimpoints against 1. Not a pleasant place to be with but a handgun.

IMHO, more ammo is never a bad thing. But it is not the sole determinant of what I carry. Actually, it doesn't figure into the equation much at all.

This was my criteria I used when selecting my one and only CCW piece:

1) Reliability. If it don't work, the number of rounds in the gun doesn't matter. Well, except that it would make for a heavier club.

2) Pointability. I desire a gun that points naturally for me, which increases the likelihood of a stopping hit at short distances without the use of sights. The mechanical accuracy of most handguns exceeds the ability of most shooters, so it comes down to what you shoot best.

3) Convenience. A big, hefty gun is nice, if you have it with you. I wanted something small enough to slip into a pocket holster and go. That encourages carry whenever it is legal to do so. To take it to an extreme, a snubby in the pocket beats an AK in the safe.

4) Ease of unholstering/drawing. Looking at the stats, most life or death encounters involving an armed citizen are over in a few seconds. So speed of draw is key. Pocket carrying a Glock 26 is fine as long as your pocket openings are large enough to make a clean, reliable draw.

5) Price. Yeah, that does figure in for the vast majority of us.

6) Ammo price. For those that don't reload, check ammo prices before you buy.

In the end, a hammerless J Frame fit the above criteria best. Snubbies have a well earned reputation for reliability, and my J Frame is no exception. I don't claim to be an expert shot, far from it, but I do well with my 642. 5 shots, 5 yards, 5 inches, 5 seconds. It is compact and easy enough to carry that it is with me where ever I can legally carry. The smooth, rounded backstrap make it super easy/fast to draw. In practice (unloaded of course), I've never had a hangup. And the prominent grip is easy for the hand to find and grasp. And it only set me back $355 at the time, and 38 special is fairly affordable - though I do reload now. Round count would have figured in as a tie breaker, but no such tie existed for me in this case.

For me, the S&W 642 is best. YMMV, quite considerably. If you don't feel comfortable with 5, then perhaps look into other options that boost your confidence.

7, 6 and even 5 round are proven in dealing with evil, if one has the mindset and skill sets to do so.

Correct - software is more important than hardware. Not that my software is free of bugs, far from it :eek: .

In the end, I do my best to avoid such situations to begin with. I live in a safe area, so that's not too difficult.
 
If 5 shots are not enough to defend yourself against a would be attacker. I suggest more range time.
Hopefully just a would be attacker... rather than attackers.

So would the 2.3 average rounds fired perhaps be for 1.1 average attackers - LOL? How far back do I squeeze the trigger to get a 0.3 round?

Averages can be misleading. Consider 10 incidents with the following number of shots fired:

2
2
1
1
1
10
1
3
1
1

The average is 2.3, but you can't pick your situation.
MOST of the time, 5 would be more than enough -- feeling lucky?
In fact, MOST of the time an unloaded gun will suffice since usually no shots are fired.

Everyone has their own level of comfort regarding #rounds, caliber, etc. Even with no gun, mindset is a big factor regarding outcome.
 
Colt used to make a big thing about the 6th shot issue in their advertising, but S&W's use of a 5-shot size in .38 Caliber went back to the late 1870's in top-break revolvers, and real-life experience didn't present any reasons to change. As others have pointed out the J-frame was intended to be for back-up and civilian personal protection. For those that thought they need more, S&W offered their K-frame, 6-shot snubbies, and intended that these would be a police officer's primary weapon.

For all-around use I prefer a Colt Detective Special, but the little S&W's and Taurus model 85 series work much better out of a side pocket.
 
If 5 shots are not enough to defend yourself against a would be attacker. I suggest more range time.

I somewhat agree. The point with the J-Frame over an automatic pocket pistol is that you get "FIVE FOR SURE".

I carry a Kel-Tec P3AT personally but my wife LOVES her little aluminum S&W .38 special w/crimson grips. I too would carry it if she would let me touch the darn thing (its her first gun and she is quite possessive about it).

:)
 
You are going to get a lot of answers from those who feel under-gunned without 17 rounds in the gun and 2 reloads.

Shouldn't that be a pair of autos with 17 rnds each and each with two reloads? :banghead:

Seriously, if you feel that much under-staffed with 5 and not 6 rounds...:banghead: ok, ok 5 is fine. I carry a 5-shot and have yet to feel like I needed another.
How 'bout another side to the whole sufficient for self-defense aspect... Gonnaget proper and professional, top-notch training and consistantly practice with this gun or will it be a basic medicocre course occasional practice and leave it at that? Seems to me they'd go together.
 
A 15 ounce ,5 shot revolver is better than a 2 pound 17 rounds semi auto left in the sock drawer.
 
And bear always in mind that the little snub wasn't designed with 25-yard target shooting in mind. It's the quintessential "Belly Gun" that's at its best when deployed at powder burn distances.


I agree with this statement but with proper instruction and practice you should be able to hit targets at 25 yards plus with no problem.
 
The intent/purpose of the little J-frames was never really engaging in running gun battles with multiple assailants. The gun was thought of more as a last ditch, up close and personal means to stop an attacker, and...within its limitations...is pretty good in that role.

Tuner, you just described the essence of the role of all of our self defense pistols, no matter the caliber or the capacity. I'll take a little J frame any day.

I'd be more worried about keeping physically fit and being able to get out of a situation than how many rounds I carried.
 
If you need more then five rounds then your situational awareness has completely failed you and gotten you in a position where you must be completely surrounded and outgunned by a group of attackers. Other then that, five rounds is enough to get you out of 99% of any jams you might find yourself in. I carry a J-Frame and do not feel undergunned at all. For me carrying a speed loader for a revolver bulges to much in my pocket. I use a Bianchi Strip that holds 6 rounds of ammo. Biggest thing, practice practice practice.
 
Just tried out a new 642 last night.

It's very simple. There are two controls: the trigger and the cylinder catch. It's easy to teach someone how to operate it, and you don't have to practice specifically with that gun all the time to use the controls under stress.

It's small and light.

You can tell if it's loaded, without much fumbling or training. It makes sense to someone right away.

You can load loose rounds quickly, and a speedloader is a lot more pocketable than a magazine -- doesn't care about lint, either.

There's no slide to bite the shooter's hand, and it works in any position, with a strong or weak grip, every time you pull the trigger.

If you look at real cases of civilian defensive shooting, and even police shootings, few of them involve more than a few rounds. Of those that do, at least some involve someone without much shooting discipline letting loose with all the rounds in a 9mm and hitting nothing. Until recently, nearly all cops carried "six-guns" and they were fine.

WRT accuracy, I was able to shoot very tight groups with the thing last night. Apart from the obvious limitation of sight radius, I don't think they're any less accurate than another S&W.
 
I'm a big fan of the "5 for sure". I bought a S&W 638 for my wife, but I find myself carrying it so much that I think another one may be in order. Then I can do my NY reload by carrying both:) LOL even both loaded are less than my S&W 28-2 (6 shots) or the same weight of my loaded SIG P220 (8+1)!!!
 
I bought a 642 years ago when that was THE gun to have, I have since bought a 638. I took the lasergrips off the 642 and retired it to the safe.I see no point to the 642 when you can have the hammer option.
I'm seriously considering getting rid of my 640 for a 649.Are they ugly,I don't think so nor do I really care.
 
I carry the "five for sure" as my BUG, or sometimes by itself. I live in a safe area, low/no crime area. I do not carry a reload for this. I feel I have practiced enough to place my shots if needed. (at least that is what I tell myself).

I will make one comment. The little J frames are not for for new shooters. With the proper ammo they are very hard to shoot. If this is you, then think twice before you carry a J frame, or at least plan on lots of practice.
 
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