SC-CWP Recognition Bill

[Rick Daniel]

A CWP recognition bill was introduced today in the SC House of Representatives. This bill (H.3110) was introduced on behalf of the National Rifle Association (NRA) and its state affiliate Gun Owners of South Carolina (GOSC). It was referred to the House Judiciary Committee.

If passed H.3110 will make South Carolina a "recognition" state and CWP holders from other states will automatically be allowed to carry here. Also, the number of states that honor South Carolina permits will be greatly expanded.

This bill is the top priority for NRA and GOSC during the 2005-2006 legislative session. South Carolina gun owners are encouraged to contact their legislators to urge their support of H.3110.

The bill can be seen at: http://www.scstatehouse.org/sess116_2005-2006/bills/3110.htm

 

[RealGun]

I don't see how this bill will pass without removing some of the regulatory discretion freedom that SLED has recognized, explored, and used. Without that, the bill will be fought on the basis of setting aside SLEDs unusually demanding standards. All other state licenses will otherwise be considered inferior, unworthy of recognition in SC. That is the current problem with reciprocity resistance. At the very least the bill undermines the rigorous requirements that SLED imposes. A prerequisite in my opinion would be to change the law to be specific about the scope of SLED's (state police) discretion or to outright remove them as the regulatory agency. I would do that on the basis of them taking regulation beyond the spirit of "shall issue" licensing. Minimally I would exactly define what constitutes "law abiding" in judging someone's fitness for licensing or renewal. In the absence of being jailed for a violent felony, an applicant is sufficiently "law abiding". Any other interpretation is just gun control nonsense. One who is truly unfit to carry self defense weapons belongs in an institution or needs a guide dog.

Without that, what you have is out of state gun owners with greater freedom and subject to less strict standards than state residents. That's how I see it anyway.

 

[ny32182]

Well, I hope the bill passes... I would like my CWP recognized in GA and FL, if those are two of the states in question.

I don't know who's standards would be less than SC's; our required class consists of a common sense multiple choice test and a rediculously easy shooting qualification.

Off topic: I heard that there was recently a change in SC CWP law to allow one of the following, and that the other might be in the works soon: 1) guns allowed in cars on school campuses. 2) carry allowed in establishments that serve alcohol, as long as that is not their primary business, i.e., restaurants, but still not bars. Any truth to this?

 

[beerslurpy]

Yeah mang, we have it already set up- anyone who recognizes us gets reciprocity immediately. I can pretty much travel to the border of every non CCW state of the union carrying all the way there.

 

[RealGun]

I don't know who's standards would be less than SC's

My understanding is that SLED requires reciprocal States to have instant verification capabilities, whatever they can think of to be difficult, but basically recognizing a State that is fully on par with SC. SLED sounds high toned and justified but they appear to go beyond the intent of the law due to their unbridled regulatory discretion, trading little barriers they can find for being required to operate in a "shall issue" manner.

SLEDs regulatory task should be to check their records, the local sheriff's, and the FBI's for specific disqualifications specified in the statutes (not currently included) and nothing else, shall issue beyond that, like it or not.

 

[Langenator]

I don't know who's standards would be less than SC's; our required class consists of a common sense multiple choice test and a rediculously easy shooting qualification.

The great state of Washington...fingerprints, records check, and that's it. No classes, no shooting test.

Resistance on the part of SLED (or any state agency, for that matter) is all the more reason why citizen involvement is key. Make the bureaucracy obey the will of the people.

Speaking of citizen involvement, I assume Grassroots SC is supporting this as well?

 

[RealGun]

Speaking of citizen involvement, I assume Grassroots SC is supporting this as well?

No doubt, but I would guess that the priorities are in a different sequence. Carrying in nice restaurants is high on the list. I would agree that fixing matters at home is more important than reciprocity beyond what we have already. We also have to address SLED making it more difficult to renew a CWP. They want to distill CWP holders to only those they believe are model citizens by their standards.

 

[Markheck1]

Pennsylvania is one

No Prints, No Class, No Shooting,
just a background check, 3 references, possibly a sherrif interview, and a handout when you get it

 

[ScottsGT]

I also think the renewal should be made easier. For Gods sake, why do you need to have a new set of fingerprints?? And another photo, when they use the DMV's photo they took for your D/L?

 

[Al Thompson]

Georgia's CWP is simply a background check, no class or test. IIRC, Alaska and Vermont are simply carry if your not a felon states.

Grassroots leadership is studying the matter, I'm sure Ed and Rob, et al, will let us know what their thoughts are soon.

http://www.scfirearms.org/

 

[scbair]

I feel strongly, both ways!

As a South Carolinian, I'd like to be able to legally and effectively defend myself in more states AND more locales. GA and FL would be nice, and so would "nice" restaurants in my home town!

Thanks to everyone for continuing to "push" for stronger CCW capabilities for the GOOD GUYS!

The more concerned citizens who hold CWPs (or otherwise make known their support of armed defensive capability), the more of an uphill battle the statists and the radical leftists will face! As an NRA and Grassroots SC member, I greatly admire the efforts to encourage our law-abiding citizens to avail themselves of this ability.

Keep up the good work, guys!

 

[Rick Daniel]

The good news is our bill is getting a lot of attention. Yesterday an influential public policy group informed me that they are making H.3110 part of their agenda this year. Also, numerous House members have offered to sign on as co-sponsors. It will come up quickly in the House Judiciary and we expect fairly quick passage. The Senate, of course, may be a bigger obstacle. We'll see if the new rules help.

As far as SLED goes, they may simply decide to stay out of the fray. They stayed out of our one handgun/thirty day repeal last year (although many predicted they'd sink it). We'll see what happens.

As some have pointed out, SLED assumes far more discretion on certain CWP matters than ever intended. Without legislation, GOSC has had good success curtailing this, but it is still out of hand.

Last year we worked with Rep. Bill Sandifer and Attorney General McMaster on securing reciprocity with North Carolina. As a result, SLED now uses a less stringent criteria in evaluating states for reciprocity. Instead of a strict "exactly the same" criteria, they now use a "substantially similar" criteria (a major improvement). Unfortunately they've only added Alaska recently.

The point is this change to "recognition" is badly needed. It is, and should be, our top priority.

Also related to SLED's discretion, we recently worked with Governor Sanford to scale back SLED's over-zealous use of adverse drivers records to deny CWPs. We managed to get the "standard" changed from a 10-year drivers record check to a 5-year check. Still not good, but we've accomplished much without opening up the CWP law to possible adverse changes.

 

[Glock-A-Roo]

As a longtime SC resident and CWP holder, I've never understood SLED's recalcitrance regarding CWP.

Back in the 90's when I got my permit, SLED was allowed 90 days to issue it if I was not denied. I called them about 2 weeks after I had mailed my paperwork. They told me that I was cleared, no problems... and they would mail my permit 89 days after the date they got my paperwork. That's right, they just sat on it until the last minute, just to be obstinate.

SC is pretty friendly to self-defense & firearms ownership, so I've never understood SLED's attitude.

 

[corncob]

SC is pretty friendly to self-defense & firearms ownership, so I've never understood SLED's attitude.

Me neither!

I guess I'll call my reps. Maybe SLED won't give us a hard time about this one, but I have a feeling we are going to have a very difficult time with the "nice restaurants" bill, whenever that comes up. A lot of people in SC have a pretty backwards attitude towards alcohol in general. And even though you can talk sense into most folks given a few minutes, imagine how it's going to sound on the evening news, coming out of some Democrat's righteous mouth, or worse, from a "policy expert" from Bush's "Project Safe Neighborhoods."

Edited to change "since" to "sense." Supremely ironic given the context, eh?

 

[Rick Daniel]

Yes, please do contact your House members and ask them to sign on H.3110 as a co-sponsor. Rep. Mike Pitts (the primary sponsor) asked that we do this as he feels a gradual adding on of co-sponsors creates an impression of interest in the minds of other legislators.

Following Mike's preference I waited to ask my House member. In fact, I just called Rep. Chip Huggins and asked him to sign on and (as I expected) he agreed to do so.

Please, everyone in SC call your House member over the next few days.

Go to www.scstatehouse.org for contact info.

 

[Langenator]

SLED was a pain when I got my permit, over the photo. They require you to submit a photo (I used a copy of my passport photo), but for the actual license they use the one off your drivers license.

Problem: I'm a WA resident (Army stationed me in SC, which allows me to get a resident CWP) and don't have an SC drivers license. Thus they had no digital photo of me in their computer. They dithered over this until I called my state rep (Joel Lourie).

CWP arrived soon after.

 

[corncob]

I'm surprized, considering the fact that Lourie is a devoted gun-bigot.

 

[Langenator]

Maybe so, but nobody in SC wants to get caught on the wrong end of treating military personnel badly.

 

[corncob]

I think you're absolutely right about that.
Nice blog, by the way.

 

[ny32182]

They took about 115 days to mail mine.

 

[RealGun]

I also think the renewal should be made easier. For Gods sake, why do you need to have a new set of fingerprints??

I don't know, but perhaps to verify that you are indeed the same person. At middle age, a person's appearance can change dramatically compared to a five year old picture. If there is a possible scam, someone will find it and exploit it. The other possibility of course is to just make it difficult, but I doubt that.

The deal about automatically waiting until the 90 day period is up I believe has to do with FBI never responding. It is common for a State law to decide that it is the FBI's job to participate, but no one sent them any money. I think it's true that they do not actually run background checks at the FBI level. Thus you have to wait until the mandatory issue date (times up).