Shootings in NYC

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vito

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Today's news about the triple shootings in NYC, a pizza parlor employee and two volunteer civilian "police" does note that the two "police" officers were unarmed (because they are not allowed to carry a firearm) who pursued the shooter and then were shot and killed by the shooter. Later armed regular officers shot and killed the criminal. I know it will not even cross the mind of Mayor Bloomberg that if these volunteer auxiliary police had been armed that possibly the killings would have ended with just the initial victim. I'm sure that this incident will bring forth calls for even more draconian gun laws that will insure more honest, unarmed citizens are easy victims for the criminal element. Will they ever learn?
 
I'm sure that this incident will bring forth calls for even more draconian gun laws
Well maybe if someone started shouting from the other direction to allow concealed carry for law abiding citizens...!
 
Here is an article from: http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8NSF4DO0&show_article=1

NEW YORK (AP) - A gunman shot and killed a pizza parlor employee and two unarmed volunteer police officers who pursued him, then was shot to death by other officers in a series of shootings in a crowded Manhattan neighborhood Wednesday, the mayor said.
The bedlam began around 9 p.m., when the gunman went into the pizzeria, asked for a menu and then shot an employee 15 times in the back, Mayor Michael Bloomberg said.

The two auxiliary officers—civilian volunteers who wear uniforms, are unarmed and help patrol streets—followed the killer briefly before he turned his gun on them, the mayor said.

"Tonight was a horrible night for the New York Police Department and for our city," he said. "Two men who volunteered their time to make our city the safest big city in America lost their lives helping to keep it exactly that way."

The gunman, who was wearing a fake beard and carrying two guns and 100 rounds of ammunition, had to cross a street to shoot the auxiliary officers, Bloomberg said.

He was killed by regular police officers who rushed to the scene.

The shootouts took place outside a strip of busy restaurants and bars near New York University in a crowded section of Manhattan's Greenwich Village.

Restaurant worker Nikola Simic said he saw police officers swarm toward the middle of the street.

"Then we heard a shooting that was like a good five minutes," Simic said.

Josh Drimmer was inside a bar at the time of the shooting.

"Hearing that many shots in a row," he said, "it was war. It felt like that for a hot second."

Witness Darren McNamara, a tourist from London, said he heard two bursts and thought it was someone shattering the front window of a shop, but it turned out to be gunfire.

Police cordoned off several blocks and escorted area residents to their homes.
 
"Tonight was a horrible night for the New York Police Department and for our city," he said. "Two men who volunteered their time to make our city the safest big city in America lost their lives helping to keep it exactly that way."

A person who was working a full-time job to make money to pay his rent and be a productive part of society was also murdered. If he had been armed, he could have prevented all 3 murders. It's another example of how gun control benefits criminals.

The two auxiliary officers—civilian volunteers who wear uniforms, are unarmed and help patrol streets

wear uniforms...unarmed...patrol streets in Manhattan? That's their fault.
 
PILMAN: So was this an 'assault weapon' or a handgun? I'm curious if this will be used to push the AWB II.

Well, the bad guy had 100 ROUNDS OF AMMO!!!

Maybe they'll tack on an ammo clause as well..... :banghead:


Not sure if the "fake beard" provision will be grandfathered.......
 
PILMAN said:
So was this an 'assault weapon' or a handgun? I'm curious if this will be used to push the AWB II.

Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly said the 9mm pistol Gavin fired was recovered, along with a .380-calibre semiautomatic handgun and the remaining ammunition. He had shot at least 23 rounds, and Kelly believes "he appeared to be ready to take even more lives."


http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_8776.aspx
 
NYC puts unarmed people in uniform and sends them out into the streets to "deter" crime? Maybe a civil suit can be used for good this time.
 
My late mother once said that some people, "don't have enough brains to keep their ears apart." That pretty well describes New York City's Mayor and Police Commissioner. If they are going to send volunteers out to perform as police officers and patrol the streets they should be trained and armed. But then considering a recent incident I'm not too sure how well trained their regular officers are either. All together this is a sad situation, but to be expected in New York City.:barf:
 
Why would any unarmed person chase an armed murderer and not expect to possibly be shot dead?

I am sure they were aware of what they were getting into. However - they obvioulsy took their "oath" seriously and were simply doing what they thought needed to be done. Its unfortunate that the dept woes not arm their reserves.

wear uniforms...unarmed...patrol streets in Manhattan? That's their fault.

I think I speak for all Reserve Officer everywhere.......I would rather you just say thank you for your service and wish their families heart felt thankyou's for their sacrifice! No need to stomp on the graves of brave individuals that do a job for nothing that most won't do for money!
 
I worked in NYC for over 20 years, and could never understand what the auxillary cops did. They are less useful than UN "peacekeepers."

In NYC, they have paid traffic enforcement officers, meter maids, regular cops, etc. Why do they need unarmed auxiliary cops? And the regular cops that I know have contempt for the volunteers.

I feel badly for the two volunteer auxiliary cops. But, just damn, being unarmed and chasing down a shooter?? Beyond stupid.
 
I'm pretty sure this didn't happen.

Us New Yorkers aren't allowed to carry guns on the street, let alone have
hi-capacity magazines. Therefore it didn't happen because we have laws
against all that.:rolleyes:

I can tell you that if this guy ran into my bar the outcome would have been quite different.

and people wonder why I have a gun in NYC
here's a pic of this guy's weapons and ammo
 
Hnk45:

When I worked in Manhattan, I always felt safest in some of the Irish Bars around 50th and 8th. Now I know why: owners like yourself! ;)

I used to live on Long Island, and could not get a permit for a handgun, even to keep in my own home! I had to settle for my trusty Mossberg 500 (which I should have kept but traded for my first handgun when I moved to NH).

Once I was cleaning it on my deck in the backyard, and my neighbors called the Suffolk County PD on me! The cops handed it back with a warning to keep it locked and unloaded. I said ok, but I think they knew I had no plans to do that. If I wanted a baseball bat for home defense, I wouldn't have bought the Mossberg....

Anyway, crazy NY gun control laws are just one reason I moved out of the state. Here in NH, we have very little crime, and very loose gun control. Coincidence??
 
I'm sure they will find a way to push thru some sort of new law because of this.
This guy probably isn't a licensed holder
had hi-caps
carried on the street

all of which, are against the law here so I guess it shows how well the laws work.
 
This shooting seems suspicious to me due to the apparent spontaneous nature, lack of stated potential motive, and no mention of the aggressor's name. Why no mention of these things?

My guess: spontaneous jihad syndrome.
 
The shooters name was David Garvin. He lived on Horatio St. which is a nice block in a nice neighborhood. He or someone he knew worked at the establishment in question and was fired or had a disagreement with the employer
 
Lawbreakers

It seems these criminal types just ignore the gun laws.

That's an outrage!

We need to make it illegal to break the law!
 
" ... The two auxiliary officers—civilian volunteers who wear uniforms, are unarmed and help patrol streets— ..."

The New York City auxillary officers are NOT SWORN peace officers, therefore, they are not allowed to carry firearms.

It is my understanding they are not allowed to make arrests, either. (???) In all the States I know about, one has to be a sworn peace officer to make an arrest. (I'm not talking here about a "Citizen's Arrest.")

L.W.
 
" ... The two auxiliary officers—civilian volunteers who wear uniforms, are unarmed and help patrol streets— ..."

Patrol streets unarmed, to provide safety to other unarmed citizens?

RIP and all that but truly that has got to be one of the dumbest ideas I've ever heard.

How exactly are they supposed to help with no arrest powers, no arms, no peace officer powers at all?

Idiocy.

Anyone know if the city offered them a vest at least?
 
Many Aux Officers are kind of like Cops in training, some are there for crowd control for parades, large gatherings etc. They are supposed to be coupled w/ Police officers. Kinda like ROTC & the military
 
"How exactly are they supposed to help with no arrest powers, no arms, no peace officer powers at all?"
With a badge and a uniform. Criminals are not supposed to act when they see "the man" present. Deterrence, like a burglar alarm. An alarm won't stop anybody - it may deter robbers when they see the sign, hear the thing ring - but it's not capable of stopping anyone from breaking in the door and robbing the place, any more than a cell phone.

"Why would any unarmed person chase an armed murderer and not expect to possibly be shot dead?"
Maybe they saw it as their duty. Tactically a very bad idea, but ethically sound. They took an oath to uphold the law, I believe. Thought they'd do just that. They were shot down in the process, and they sure as hell didn't deserve it. They didn't have a legal choice to carry a gun. If you don't like that, talk to Rudy, Pataki, Bloomberg and Co. Wasn't the reserve officer's call on whether they could carry or no. The Wise Men in power made that decision for 'em.
 
Thirty years ago I was invited by the chief of police of Lakehurst, New Jersey to become an auxilliary police officer. When I saw that his auxilliaries wore the same uniform as the regular police officers but were unarmed, I told him his auxilliaries were insane.

Pilgrim
 
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