Short barrels and reloading

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Shinbone

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I am wondering if it's wise or not to use slower burning powders (I'm thinking of Unique in particular) with small pocket pistols such as the Ruger LCP Max? A Sierra manual (5th Edition) lists Unique as an accurate load using a Walther PPK with barrel length of 3 1/4". I am not questioning the Sierra data, just the info using a shorter barrel seen in pocket pistols these days.
Just curious.
Thanks.
 
Slow powders are often necessary in short barrels to achieve good ballistics. There is nothing wrong with using fast or slow, but fast powders can only produce relatively low velocities.
 
Some time ago I tried to find a replacement for Unique in both 9mm and .45ACP. I guess I had stars in my eyes over all the 'new and improved' powders that are out there... and thought I'd give it a go. Although I learned some things, what it boiled down to was... Unique is pretty hard to beat. My 9mm's are short barrels... 3.6" and 3.1". Even powders with a similar burn rate as Unique did not perform as well in 9mm... they being BE-86 and SportPistol. Faster powders worked well enough, but I had to redline the load data to get the velocity I was looking for, something that Unique does with ease. The one caveat to that I found in my very limited testing was TiteGroup. I don't like TG, it burns too hot for my taste, and it's very sensitive to COL, but it makes some pretty good 9mm for short barreled pistols.

FWIW, I still use Unique when I load .380's for my brother's carry piece.
 
I forget where I read it, but someone tested this and found that in short barrel handguns, loads with slower burning powders still produced higher velocities than switching to faster powders if that is your concern.
 
Shinbone said:
I am wondering if it's wise or not to use slower burning powders (I'm thinking of Unique in particular) with small pocket pistols such as the Ruger LCP Max?
Click to expand...
The pistol powder that gives the most velocity in a long barrel gives the most in a short barre, and vice versa. Not as efficient as far as grains to FPS, but still the fastest. A look through a couple of reloading manuals will show that. And Unique is considered "midrange" as far as pistol powders go.
 
Maybe I’m missing something but the OP is asking about a pistol chambered for the .380ACP (a.k.a. 9mm Kurz, 9mm Browning, 9x17mm, etc) and so far every answer has been specific to the 9mm Luger (a.k.a. 9x19mm, 9mm NATO, etc). While I am a fan of Unique, and have worked up loads for the .380, it’s a bit blasty and flamish in short barrel pistols. There’s better powders for that application but you won’t be disappointed in the results, I’m guessing. Just don’t expect easy cleanup and complete burn.
Bottom line though: Using Unique is always a wise decision. ;)
 
Using faster powders in short barrels than the powder which promotes the fastest muzzle velocity in long barrels reduces blast AND reduces muzzle velocity.

There are no free lunches. The myth of fast powders improving velocity in short barrels is - irrefutably - only a myth.
 
Varminterror said:
Using faster powders in short barrels than the powder which promotes the fastest muzzle velocity in long barrels reduces blast AND reduces muzzle velocity.

There are no free lunches. The myth of fast powders improving velocity in short barrels is - irrefutably - only a myth.
Click to expand...
That is incorrect. You cannot make a blanket statement without regaurd to pressure. Lower pressure applications often have better velocities w correct powder.
 
No harm will come from using medium or slower pistol powder in a short barrel.

I prefer a faster powder in my short barreled 380 S&W Bodyguard. I tried Universal in it and I could feel hot specks of powder burn my hand and forearm when I shot it. Switching to Win231 or Bullseye corrected that issue. I didn't have a chronograph, so no comparison was made, but the faster powder was more enjoyable to shoot.
 
WeekendReloader said:
No harm will come from using medium or slower pistol powder in a short barrel.
Click to expand...

Regarding my post above, and my 'new powder' tests in 9mm... I had one anomaly, using BE-86. I actually hit a burn threshold where more powder did not translate to more velocity (in my shorter Kahr barrels.) Loading the Berrys 124grn PRN, 5.4grn BE-86 produced 1050fps, 5.7grn only 1060fps, and by that time, unburnt (underburnt) powder was fairly flying around.... it was a very poor combination. Yes, I met my velocity expectation with that load, but it was definitely not a very efficient powder combination, yet Unique, quite close to BE-86 on the burn rate chart, doesn't have those problems. Part of it is the burn rate, but perhaps a bigger part is how it burns in any given application.

I load for a fair amount of short barreled stuff... my 9's, my 4" .45ACP's, a 16" .308 semi-auto, a 20" .348WCF. I've found powder selection is a bit more critical for best performance in short barreled firearms... rifle or pistol.
 
Charlie98 said:
Regarding my post above, and my 'new powder' tests in 9mm... I had one anomaly, using BE-86. I actually hit a burn threshold where more powder did not translate to more velocity (in my shorter Kahr barrels.) Loading the Berrys 124grn PRN, 5.4grn BE-86 produced 1050fps, 5.7grn only 1060fps, and by that time, unburnt (underburnt) powder was fairly flying around.... it was a very poor combination. Yes, I met my velocity expectation with that load, but it was definitely not a very efficient powder combination, yet Unique, quite close to BE-86 on the burn rate chart, doesn't have those problems. Part of it is the burn rate, but perhaps a bigger part is how it burns in any given application.

I load for a fair amount of short barreled stuff... my 9's, my 4" .45ACP's, a 16" .308 semi-auto, a 20" .348WCF. I've found powder selection is a bit more critical for best performance in short barreled firearms... rifle or pistol.
Click to expand...
Makes sense. I guess what I meant was that it isn't going to be a problem for the pistol. I've had the fireball out the end of the barrel and also unburnt powder blown all over. Not an efficient use of powder. I guess "Not the best combination" would better describe it.
 
Walkalong said:
That can happen with a lot of combos, it's one of our clues to not only stop, but maybe even back off a bit.
Click to expand...

That particular instance was the most obvious example that I'd ever seen. There are times when the load will tell you it's not happy... and that was one of them. BlueDot in .38SPC was another one, and H4831 in the .348WCF yet another, just not quite so obvious.
 
I've always preferred using the fastest powder I have on hand for general purpose semi auto pistol loads. Generally the cleanest burning and most efficient. Accurate to boot.
I use W-231. 8lbs goes extremely far.

Unique is a classic that will do anything. I'm sure it will work just fine for your application.....the more you use Unique, the more you will love it. I wouldn't hesitate.......I bet you're loadin them already, aren't ya??????
 
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For the example quoted in the OP, a Quickload evaluation found Unique to give the best velocity for a 90 gr 380 loaded to 19000 psi chamber pressure for both 2.8" and 3.25" barrels. For reference, Power pistol was 9 fps slower in the 2.5" barrel.

I tried some bigger differences in barrel lengths. At 12" for the longer barrel, Unique moved to the number 2 position and Power Pistol moved to the top. The difference was only 4 fps.

Generally speaking, modest changes barrel lengths does not make a huge impact on which powders are "best" for a given round.
 
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