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Shot timers reading slide release noise as a shot?

Discussion in 'Competition Shooting' started by Dudedog, Oct 4, 2017.

  1. Dudedog

    Dudedog Contributing Member

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    At my last match a couple people where talking about a instance where shot timers were reading the snap of a slide being released after show clear hammer down as a shot. (of course leading to an incorrect time)
    I don't have a shot timer (need to get one) to test this with but I was curious if anyone else has heard of this happening or has tested for it.

    If it does occur I would guess it would only happen when using the frame mounted slide release and letting the slide "snap" back into battery.

    Possibly true or an excuse to snivel about a bad time?
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2017
  2. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    I guess it could happen if the timer were held too close to the gun at ULSC.
    I don't.
     
  3. waktasz

    waktasz Member

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    It's possible. Just like it's possible for the ejected round to fly out of the gun and land right on the timer, knocking it loud enough to register another shot. I wouldn't worry about it though. Besides, a good RO should mentally note the time as the shooter finishes and before giving the range commands to unload.
     
  4. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    At our local matches the SO shows the time to the ASO as he gives the ULSC command. The time is recorded well before the order "Slide Closed" is given

    Sounds like whinning
     
  5. Owen

    Owen Moderator Emeritus

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    They might need to turn down the sensitivity of the timer if it is something that is happening. I've had to turn the sensitivity way up for suppressor work. When the Timer was then used for unsuppressed it would register 2 or 3 extra shots in a string. We'd load 10 Round's in a mag to get a RPM number, and the timer would register 13 or 14 shots. A good way to check is to use the review function on the timer and make sure the number of shots recorded is the same as the number fired. If that last shot has a 10 second split, and the shooter did a fairly quick controlled pair, that would be a dead giveaway.

    On the other hand, they could just be joking around making excuses about why Jim Bob the GM is smoking them by a huge margin.
     
  6. johnmcl

    johnmcl Member

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    I just ran quick test in my basement range with a CED timer, a Glock 17, and a 1911. The timer did not pick up the slide noise across five samples per gun. I held the timer very close to the gun. In short, I think not.
     
  7. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    In ?? years of competitive shooting with shot timers I've never seen a credible claim of that happening. It is theoretically possible, but if a timer is set to such high sensitivity that it could detect the slide closing, then it absolutely would be picking up shots from other bays, and that's very rarely a problem either. (I think I saw that happen one time.)
     
  8. Dudedog

    Dudedog Contributing Member

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    johnmcl - Thanks for testing --
    Basement range, very :cool:

    Thanks to everyone else for your info as well.
    As I mentioned in the OP, I didn't know if it was possible/probable or just a very interesting reason to come up with an excuse for a slow time. ( I don't need excuses for my self I know I'm slow:))
     
  9. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

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    As others have noted, showing the timer (over the shoulder or behind the back) to the pad-runner eliminates this as a possibility. While the shooter is showing clear, the pad-runner is noting the time. Even if he/she doesn't get the time entered, they'd be able to see it change.

    I think timers not picking up shots (especially minor PF and especially PCC minor) shot through a port or behind a barrel is a much trickier issue. That does happen, and certain stage designs can require real diligence and physical exertion by the RO to prevent it.
     
  10. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    Or when using a silencer. That's a problem we run into frequently. Gotta make sure the timer is out near the can for that last critical shot.
     
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  11. Varminterror

    Varminterror Member

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    I used to crank up the sensitivity and do dry fire practice in my bathroom on the clock with my Vaqueros for SASS/CAS, so the sensitivity is there, but I needed the "echo" amplifier of the shower wall and otherwise dead silence to pick up the clicks. It'd pick up holster noise too if I wasn't mindful of it.

    Lots of things are possible, but far fewer things are probable.
     
  12. johnmcl

    johnmcl Member

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    DudeDog, well "range" is an overstatement. When I had some foundation work done 5 years ago, I had a pair of 30 inch concrete culvert pipes installed below grade external to the wall. I can shoot at an amazing distance of 13 feet. I use it to safety check every gun that comes to me for repair or maintenance. It is still loud as hell upstairs, and is used sparingly.
     
  13. ny32182

    ny32182 Member

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    I've definitely seen it happen, several times. If I happen to be running the clock, I put it behind my back for ULSC. If the RO is holding the timer in front while I'm unloading, I'm careful not to run the slide too hard.

    Sensitivity is likely turned up too high when it is happening.
    If you suspect a badly high time, and the last shot is a seven second split, you might be onto something.

    Flying brass hitting the timer will also record a shot without fail.

    A good RO has the timer close to the gun for the last shot, not obscured by barrels or barricades, and out of the line of fire of the brass, and out of the very immediate proximity of the gun for ULSC.
     
  14. Dudedog

    Dudedog Contributing Member

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    Don't think my times are off I'm just slow:eek:, but if it is possible I just need to remember to run the slide forward by hand.
    When I heard some people talking about it sounded reasonable, and it also sounded like a clever excuse.
     
  15. jmorris

    jmorris Member

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    Shot timers are not all the same. Some can be adjusted for sensitivity and could pick up a slide being dropped if close enough.

    That said, you shouldn't be dropping the slide from slide lock on an empty chamber.

    This is one reson I like shot timers that display number of shots fired along with time, on the same display without any buttons needing to be depressed.

    Although it has been used against me the other way.

    RO "Oh, that time can't be correct, you're going to need to reshoot the stage."

    Me "How many shots are on the timer?"

    When the number he says = the number of shots fired, the conversation is over.
     
  16. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    I've heard that argument so many times, however, when 99.1% (I measured that precisely....with calipers) of shooters do drop the slide on an empty chamber and exactly 0.01% of them ever experience a problem because of it (again, measured precisely, though this time with a Geiger counter) it's really a moot point.

    That's what people do, that's what they're GOING to do, only the most specially gifted will be able to measure the damage it causes, so better be aware of this issue and keep it in the back of your mind in case it ever actually happens on a stage you're running.
     

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