Sig P238 Range Report

[TimM]

I recently purchased a Sig P238 at a local gun shop. I had actually went in to purchase a NAA Pug but being a huge 1911 fan and always wishing I could find a Colt Mustang that I could afford, when I saw the P238 in the case I instantly fell in love - if that is possible with an inanimate object. And... it was only $85 more dollars than the NAA.



Today I took it to the range for the first time and put a little over 100 rounds through it. My first observation is that it feels really good in my hand, it is a solid little gun. The sites are easy to see (standard not the night sites) and the trigger has a little take up but it is crisp and according the scale breaks right at about 7.5 lbs.

It is not a traditional 1911. The first thing that you will notice is that when it is cocked and the safety is on it is not locked. you are still able to rack the slide and either eject or load a round. My only concern is that while holstering I will need to be careful and not let the slide be pushed back as I can foresee this maybe causing a problem when you don't need it to happen.

The safety is very easy to engage and it works just exactly the way it should. The same can be said with the slide and mag releases.

There is also a little cut out at the back of the chamber used for a "loaded" indicator.

Unloaded

Loaded

The first ammo that I fed it was prvi partizan 94gr FMJ. It fed and ejected smooth with out a hitch. I had no problem at all with this ammo and recoil was very mild.

I had also ordered some ammo from Buffalo Bore. The second ammo that I fed it was Buffalo Bore 380 Auto +P Ammo - 100 gr. Hardcast F.N. and it did not feed this well at all. As a mater of fact I had 1 FTE problem it had FTF problems on 9 of every 10 rounds fired. The same thing happened with Buffalo Bore 380 Auto +P Ammo - 90 gr. Jacketed Hollow Point and Federal Premium 380 90 gr HYDRA-SHOK JHP.

I originally thought it might be a limp wristing problem but soon discovered that it was because the magazine did seat correctly. This had no effect on the prvi partizan ammo but it highly effected the other three ammo. When I realized this was the problem I held the magazine in tightly with the thumb on my weak hand and had no other FTF problems. I have ordered two new mags from Metal Form and I am hoping that this will take care of the FTF problems.

No pressure applied.

Pressure applied.

Also with the hot loads the slide refused to remain open after the last round a few times.

The good news is that off hand at 10 yards, when I did my part correctly, it kept all of the ammo inside two inches - it is definitely a better shooter than I am. The Buffalo Bore had considerably more recoil to it, it was not uncontrollable but you definitely knew it was loaded hot.

Once I got back home to clean the gun I also found that three of the four grip screws were loose. Two were very loose.

With all of that being said, if the new mags work I will be very happy with this little gun and I believe it is one that will be handed down through the generations.

 

[mesinge2]

Great review, I've been looking at the 238 myself.

Now I know what to expect, thanks

 

[rhinoh]

Were those Sig mags you had trouble with?
I got my P238 yesterday, it gets it's first range trip this weekend...

 

[TimM]

Were those Sig mags you had trouble with?

Yes, I only have the one original Sig mag that came with the gun. I am hoping the Metal Form mags will be the fix. I am not sure whether I have a lemon of a mag or if they are all like that. I also hope that the seating problem is with the mag and not with the pistol.

Please let me know how yours performs this weekend.

 

[GunNut]

Great review.

I hope to find some .380 and get out sometime in the next week with mine.

 

[rhinoh]

Well I did shoot 13 rounds through it on some land I have. I didn't shoot it more because, although perfectly legal, someone calls the cops when I shoot much, they show up, tell me I'm legal, roll their eyes at the caller and leave
But I digress-
All went well except the very last round of the second mag did not eject, it was stuck horizontally like it was extracted, lifted vertically but not ejected. The slide then pinched it there between the barrel and the bolt face. At first I didn't even realize it was there, it looked just like the slide locked back on an empty mag until I looked into the port.
This weekend I'll run up to about 125 rounds through it, thats all I have until I reload them to use again! I have about 600 .380 bullets but only about 125 cases, they are backordered everywhere.

One thing that did puzzle me, first couple of rounds were high and left, as I worked through the two mags they seemed to walk onto target. Never had that happen before, don't know if it was me or the pistol

 

[EAJ]

Congrats on the new P238. I've been very pleased with mine. Good to go out of the box. No issues with assorted FMJ or JHP using SIG magazines. Good luck with the metal form Colt mag's.

 

[rhinoh]

Ran about 100 through mine this morning- had a few problems.
Twice the last round in the mag did not eject.
Once the slide did not go fully into battery, preventing firing. Nudged right in though.
Had two spent shells that were really mangled from ejecting. Case mouth pinched almost halfway shut.
Had two failures to fire, one had NO firing pin mark, the other had a light dimple, both fired when reinserted and hit again.
Gun shoots 5-6" high at 25 ft.
So I'm still gonna depend on my S&W 637 snubbie since the P238 isn't 100% yet...
I did cycle one mag of Speer Gold Dot and one of Hornady Critical Defense through with no issues.

 

[TimM]

rhinoh,
Do your mags fit flush? Are they like the photo "without pressure applied" or "with pressure applied"?

 

[LancerMW]

ive had great luck with metalform mags, even went with 3 of them untested into a steel match (not the best idea) but they all worked flawlessly.

 

[rhinoh]

rhinoh,
Do your mags fit flush? Are they like the photo "without pressure applied" or "with pressure applied"?

One fits flush. The other two can be pressed in about another 1/16".
Looking at the mags they are two different versions of genuine OEM Sig mags..two of them have the follower with a pointed peak, the other that fits flush is more rounded, the one on the right in the pic..
Although I can't say for sure I'm thinking the rounded top one came with the P238 and the other two were just bought from Top Gun Supply, in fact I got them before I got the pistol!



Added in edit- looked around the net a little and it appears the pointed followers are old stock and not right...the rounded one is correct. They were very likely to be the reason for my fail to extracts on last round.
http://sigforum.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/430601935/m/517108701

Kinda disappointed I was sent pointed ones when this is a known issue.
I'll call Sig Monday and see if they'll swap...they should but what a PITA.

 

[EAJ]

Kinda disappointed I was sent pointed ones when this is a known issue.
I'll call Sig Monday and see if they'll swap...they should but what a PITA.

SIG is aware of the problem and will swap them out. No problem there except for some inconveniencefor you.

 

[gdbrown56]

Well I picked up my P238 today and proceeded to fire approximately 75 rounds of PMC FMJ through it. It performed flawlessly. That said, when I got home I loaded 6 rounds of Speer Gold Dot hollow point in the magazine. I was unable to rack the slide. The round would not load into the chamber. I proceeded to try rounds of Corbon with the same result. It seems that the jagged surface of the hollow point ammo hangs on the ramp therefore resulting in failure to load. Has anyone else experienced this issue. BTW, after the Corbon I loaded the magazine with 6 rounds of Remington FMJ and it racked with no issue.

 

[rhinoh]

Odd, as I mentioned above I shot a mag of GD and CD through mine, no problems. That is a rather steep feed ramp though. I forgot to try the DPX I have in some other 380s, I want to try them too next range trip.

BTW I was looking at the mags closely last night after discovering I had two varieties and noticed the floor plate was welded on, leading me to wonder how they disassemble. Turns out if one carefully uses a pair of needle nose pliers you can maneuver the follower out the top. So...I wonder if Sig will just send me new followers so I don't have to fool with sending the mags themselves back for exchange...

 

[TimM]

It seems that the jagged surface of the hollow point ammo hangs on the ramp therefore resulting in failure to load. Has anyone else experienced this issue.

Yes this was the cause of my FTF problems as well. It even did it with the Buffalo Bore Hard Cast Flat Nose rounds. It is very disappointing.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

My older Mustang Pocketlite works with every mag I own, and feeds hollow points. What I DON'T like about that gun is the barrel is very loose at the muzzle, and accuracy is mediocre except at close range (battle worthy, but it isn't going to do slow fire head shots at 20 yards). I was hoping the SIG would be a better gun. They probably have just designed a gun from the bottom up instead of copying the Colt. Sig seems to do a good job when they design the gun.

 

[TimM]

BTW I was looking at the mags closely last night after discovering I had two varieties and noticed the floor plate was welded on, leading me to wonder how they disassemble. Turns out if one carefully uses a pair of needle nose pliers you can maneuver the follower out the top.

I believe that you can depress the follower and when the spring is compressed you can insert a pin or paper clip through one of the holes in the mag to hold the spring. It is then fairly easy to remove the follower.

 

[rhinoh]

Made it back out the the range and ran about 60 more through. Didn't have any problems this time, even with the 2 pointy top mags. Still gonna call Sig today about replacing them or the followers...

 

[Storm]

My 238 in the 7300 serial range came with the proper mag. I did order three Metalform mags (OEM for the Mustang) to be on the safe side. $13.99 from CDNN is a good price. One thing about the Metalform is that the mag plate extends significantly beyond the front frame contour. I don't think it will bother me in shooting and offers a reference point for my grip at the bottom of the frame.

 

[rhinoh]

I called Sig this morning about my 2 'pointy top" mags possibly causing FTEs on the last round.
They are sending me 2 new ones with a label to return the old ones after I get the new ones. I call that OUTSTANDING!

 

[Storm]

Here's a photographic comparison of the fit of the SIG mag (top photo) and the Metalform (bottom two photos). I don't think it's going to be an issue for me. The extra could be ground off (losing part of the Metalform logo) but I don't think that it will come to that.

 

[rhinoh]

I kinda like that extension, could be handy to retain grip, and like you said it could be ground off if it is a problem.

 

[MICHAEL T]

When testing a new auto I use nothing but factory ball and try to use a couple different brands. I don't believe reloads or lead should be used to test reliability of a new pistol. I have 2 mustangs and they are trouble free I had a problem with one when I went to a steel guide rod. Removed and went back to the plastic and went back to a 100%

 

[Storm]

I kinda like that extension, could be handy to retain grip,

That's exactly what it does. Now the SIG mag without the extension doesn't feel quite right to me. The Metalform extension also acts as an indexing point in that it lets you know where you're at on the frame. The edges are nice and smooth so I can't see any problems with abrasion or discomfort in firing. The SIG mag will go to back-up with my three Metalform mags used before it.

 

[3ald3eaver]

Poor QC on P238, FTF, Mags etc.

When I first purchased my p238, it would not manually feed rounds by cycling the upper much less while trying to fire. It would not even chamber the 1st round manually. It came with the new style mag which has the lower/shorter follower. Sig shipped me 2 new mags to try. They were identical and would not feed. I went back to the dealer who had a p238 with the old mag. It would feed rounds consistently. However, IMO, the old mag with the raised/higher follower would cause the FTE on last round. So that is not an option. I have read that some shooters have had success forcing the mag deeper into the pistol while shooting. I have also read that some shooters suspect the feed ramp to be "adjusted" upon "upgrade" return.

I shipped mine last Friday with Sig's next day air label. Tuesday they said they had it fixed. I was told they "adjusted" the mags to rectify. I questioned the resolution and was told they would replace with 3 more new ones and retest. I called today and Diana told me it had no failures with an additional 100 rounds using the 3 new mags.

Sig can not use the excuse that the mags were the problem in my case since I received 1(with pistol) +2(additional) "newer" ones to begin with and none would work.

While I appreciate being able to deal with the head of customer service directly, it would mean so much more if the responses weren't like that of the Obama administration, smoke & mirrors and OZ like. Problem is, I asked what the original resolution was and she told me my "new" mags had to be "adjusted." I explained that was interesting and uacceptable. I rhetorically asked if Sig was going to "adjust" all of my future mags at Sig's expense. I received an illegitimate answer to almost every question I asked. I asked her about the sale of Sig in 2000 and the current board of execs who have only been in place since 2005 and she told me Sig was never sold and the board of execs change often... proof is in the pudding https://www.sigsauer.com/AboutUs/Management.aspx

In theory, this pistol was a home run. In reality, it's a foul ball. There is a myriad manufacturing issues that were missed during poor QC. I don't know the current return rate but I would suspect over 50% are being returned due to FTF and lack of reliability. I highly doubt law enforcement would accept the failure rate the p238 delivers. I am at the point of wanting a full scale investigation into the p238.

Bottom line, when mine is returned and I get more than 1 FTF in 50 rounds or 100% FTF on JHP's, it's going back and Sig will have to white glove deliver a replacement or a check for refund.

IMO, they had to have adjusted my feed ramp and the mag catch to make mine shoot at all. I am not a gunsmith but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night!