Single Stage Trigger?

[Archangel14]

Y'all know I'm a newbie to this AR15 thing, so please bear with me.

What the heck is the difference between a "single stage" and "two stage" trigger? Does it matter to a guy who won't be doing long range, precision shooting? Or to someone who simply dosen't care to have a perfect trigger pull? What's the difference?

Your Humble Newbie...........

 

[cfullgraf]

A two stage trigger has a section that takes up some "slack", then there is the let off stage. One aspect, the total trigger pull is the sum of the parts. The let off stage seems to be lighter.

Generally, there is some separate adjustment between the two stages.

A single stage trigger just has the let off stage.

Lots of service rifle match shooters have two stage triggers in their rifles.

Lots of shooters like single stage triggers.

Hope this helps and makes sense.

A final note, I have two stage triggers in all my ARs. My preference.

 

[Welding Rod]

In the case of an AR, a single stage trigger generally has a lot of creep and sometimes grit in the pull. By any quality commercial firearm standard a mil spec AR trigger is a horrendous device. Additionally, the mil spec single stage trigger is generally heavy as well. They are built with durability and safety as primary concerns.

A two-stage can be safe and still have a crisp let off. What would normally be felt as creep in a single stage trigger pull is instead drawn up with a reasonably light smooth pull during the first stage "take-up". After the take-up the trigger pull hits a firm stop. Further force should not result in any perceptable creep, but rather result in a crisp trigger break during this second stage.

A 2-stage can be reasonable light while still very safe since there is plenty of sear engagement, just without a perception of creep during the pull.

I consider myself to be generally a precision shooter, and personally I am a big fan of 2-stage triggers. They were used in the M1 Garand and M14. I use them in almost all of my ARs. I compete in matches with the M1, M1A, and AR. So having the same type of high quality trigger pull in all 3 platforms is nice. My 2 ARs with singles stage mil spec triggers are seldom shot. Life is too short to put up with a poor trigger pull.

 

[TonyAngel]

I'm a big fan of two stage triggers, because, as Welding Rod mentioned, you can get a reasonably light and crisp pull without sacrificing the need for a deliberate squeeze of the trigger to fire the rifle.

Make no mistake, I'm a big fan of match grade single stage triggers. I run a 4 oz. Jewel in my .22 and an 8 oz. trigger in my .308 when I shoot precision matches; but for a field rifle, I want something that is safe and dependable.

The drawback to putting a nice crisp single stage trigger on an AR is that these triggers usually involve some sort of adjustments (that could loosen up) and in most cases use some sort of a set of lighter springs which could compromise reliability. Single stage match grade triggers like the AR Gold and two stage triggers like the Geissele Hi Speed line usually come with a written statement that these triggers are not intended for duty use, but are more appropriate for competition.

I do run a two stage in my field AR. By field, I mean that I take it humping around in the woods and take it with me when I need something to strap to the back of my four wheeler. The trigger that I use is a Geissele SSA-E.

What I like about the trigger is that it has a pretty crisp 4 lb. pull. What I love about the trigger is that I didn't have to sacrifice safety or reliability to get the nice feel. The SSA-E uses standard weight springs and has no adjustments that can go out of whack. It installs just like a standard trigger.

The trigger I'm using now has well over 10,000 rounds on it and it's never missed a beat.

 

[hardluk1]

I too would like a nice crist lite trigger pull for my AR. For some of use a single stage like evey other long guns we ever owned. Now how light a pull weight can a 2 stage have and still be relieable. I would be way more comfortable with a 3lb single stage than a total 2 stage with a 1lb/2lb pull. To a guy in the military the 2 stage my be great but to me that take up is creep. All my hunting rifles are 1 1/2lb triggers. Fun rifles are 1lb and less.

 

[cfullgraf]

For Service Rifle competition, you have to have a 4.5 lb or higher trigger. Essentially, they hang a 4.5 pound weight from the trigger and the trigger should not release.

My match rifle trigger, the first stage is 2 to 2.5 lbs and the let off is the rest, about 2 pounds.

The first stage is not like creep. It is a distinct move of the trigger with a definite stop before the second stage engages.

 

[taliv]

i use 2 stages for precision work and 1-stage for run-n-gun. just a preference but imho a safer one as noted above.

 

[MCMXI]

Take a look at the video in the link below to see how an AR two-stage trigger works. As you pull the trigger in the first stage, the hammer hooks are sliding against the sear. At the end of the first stage pull, the movement between the hammer hooks and sear stops when the hammer hooks make contact with the disconnector. So during the first stage pull you have reduced the sear to hammer hooks contact area (interface). As you pull the trigger in the second stage you are again sliding the hammer hooks against the sear until the instant the hammer hooks separate from the sear thereby releasing the hammer. This is the end of the second stage pull. A true two-stage trigger affects the hammer hooks/sear interface for both stages of the pull. It takes X amount of work to separate the sear from the hammer hooks so you can see that it's possible to change how much work you do in the first and second stages. My SSA triggers are approximately .66X for the first stage and .33X for the second stage. If there were no disconnector, you would only have a single stage trigger and you would pull the trigger until the hammer hooks separated from the sear. I much prefer two-stage triggers on rifles.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRq5W8SUbu8&feature=relmfu

 

[MCMXI]

A true two-stage trigger affects the hammer hooks/sear interface for both stages of the pull.

Quoting myself but what the heck ... this is why the Savage AccuTrigger is not a true two-stage trigger. The "flappy paddle" that Savage calls the AccuRelease is there to block the hammer hook in the event that the hammer hook loses contact with the sear without the trigger being depressed. It feels like a two-stage trigger but the sear/hook interface is only affected when the main trigger shoe is depressed. So in reality it's a single stage trigger with a spring loaded AccuRelease that makes it feel like a two-stage trigger.

 

[hardluk1]

For the guy that does not want or like a 2 stage trigger is there a quality single stage ar trigger that both light of pull and reliable? Like no more than 2 lbs. Or is just not avalible for an ar.

 

[rcmodel]

There are match triggers available that light.

But for the average person using the average AR-15, they are too light.

You will be getting doubles and bump fires just from the recoil bounching the rifle against your shoulder each shot.

That is the logic of using two-stage triggers.

They are perfectly safe when bumped on the ground, or otherwise, yet light enough to be very accurate once the second stage is reached.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/709049/jewell-trigger-assembly-ar-15-small-pin-154-two-stage-matte

Here is a better safer unit for everyday use!
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/24...all-pin-154-two-stage-matte?cm_vc=subv1709049

rc

 

[snake284]

Y'all know I'm a newbie to this AR15 thing, so please bear with me.

What the heck is the difference between a "single stage" and "two stage" trigger? Does it matter to a guy who won't be doing long range, precision shooting? Or to someone who simply dosen't care to have a perfect trigger pull? What's the difference?

Your Humble Newbie...........

The difference in single and two stage triggers boils down to the way they feel when pulled. Most two stage triggers I've pulled were not too much different than a single stage except that there was a lot more creep or rather take up on the two stage. If you are used to a two stage trigger, you can probably shoot a firearm with one very well, providing the weight of pull isn't obsessive. Most military triggers in the old days were two staged. The M1 Garand, the 03 and 03-A3 Springfields, the 1914 and 1917 Enfields all were two stage triggers. There was just a good bit of take up before it got to the point where you were squeezing it and it broke and released the fireing pin. Most sporting arms have one stage triggers. There is very little creep or take up before it breaks and releases the firing pin.

Also cfullgraf, you are correct, but I used the word creep for lack of a better term since it is in some ways similar. Take up is a better explanation.

 

[taliv]

hardluk, look at the JP single stage. it is excellent, but i don't know if it will go below 2 lbs. it's so crisp you won't mind though

 

[adelbridge]

Two stage triggers are a simple way to clean up a crude military design.

A lighter trigger pull is mostly dependent on changing out milspec springs for lighter springs.

I have had issues with russian ammo and my 4.5 lb spring, primers dont ignite. I planned on using russian ammo only to sight in and have no desire to run it so no real loss for me.

 

[cfullgraf]

Also cfullgraf, you are correct, but I used the word creep for lack of a better term since it is in some ways similar. Take up is a better explanation.

With a two stage trigger, you can probably get some creep in the second stage. The take up, as I called it, in the first stage is designed to be there.

There are situations where one is probably a better choice than the other, but for the most part, the choice of trigger is personal preference.