small base dies?

[agd1953]

Good morning, I am going to start reloading .223 for my bushmaster varminter. I understand I will need to full length resize but will I need to Small base resize? The Varminter has the best barrel varminter make according to them. I assume that the chamber will be very close to specs. Any help would be appreciated. who makes the best dies for this application?

 

[Walkalong]

RCBS makes "small base dies". Lee makes .001 undersize sizers for auto pistol calibers, but I do not know if they do something similar for rifle. You may not need a small base die, depending on your chamber. I do not use one for brass fired in my Mini-14. I use a standard Redding 3 die set. I use the standard seater for blasting loads and a Forster seater for accuracy loads in .223. I also have Forster seaters in .222, .222 Mag. & .22 Hornet. Of course, AR's are different and from many makers with many different type chambers.

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=205445

 

[RecoilRob]

I just got the small-base X-die for my Varminter. Wanted to try the X version and figured the small-base couldn't hurt. The X has a shoulder to control case length and seems to work well in the few loadings I have used it.

If you are planning on using once-fired military brass, it might be a worthwhile investment as you have no idea what weapon the brass came out of and they might be a bit tight using the regular dies.

I have several thousand military OF that I processed with regular dies and have had no trouble with them in the Mini-14, Colt or Varminter....but that is a small sample to say you won't have problems. I'll be using the X-die from now on.

The Varminter is quite the tack driver, yes?

 

[dmftoy1]

I've never had an issue with standard dies on .223 (and I only have AR's for it) but I recently bought a batch of .308 once-fired from Midway and it would NOT chamber in my Savage 10 FLP without using a small base die on it. I imagine I could've beat the bolt handle closed with a dead blow hammer but I think you get the picture. From the research I did after finding this out it appears that you need the small base dies if the brass you're using was fired in an automatic weapon because the web stretches more than in a normal one. (at least that's the conclusion I came to)

I fired probably 1k of M193 through my AR and all of that brass resized/chambered perfectly in my AR's. (1 Bushy M4, 1 RRA NM Service Rifle, and 1 RRA "Varmint") The RRA's have a Wylde chamber so I don't know how that compares to the rifle that you are loading for. My understanding is that the standard 5.56 chamber is the loosest, the wylde is slightly tighter, and the .223 chamber is the tightest. (tightest = shortest throat) I don't know if there's any difference between the chambers at the rear or not.

Have a good one,
Dave

 

[agd1953]

recoilrob, what is different about the x-die and standard rcbs small base dies. I've heard of them but not sure what they do that is different. How much did you pay for them, if that's not to personel a question

 

[Kamicosmos]

I also picked up the small base X-Die for my Varminter. (Great AR!)

The X-Die has a mandrel in it that keeps the brass at the same length after the inital trimming. In other words, once you start using an X-Die, trimming your brass is a thing of the past!

Midway has the SB X-Die for $35 by itself, or $45 in a 2 die set. I highly recommend it. The varminter is probably one of the few AR's that is accurate enough with it's non-chromed match chamber to actually make use of the SB dies.

 

[hapi]

x die in regular base works for 99% of guns. if they wont feed in your gun then call rcbs and they'll exchange it for a small base die for free....they're cool like that. really, rcbs is the best in the business with customer service and i'll only buy their dies because of this fact. the small base die will work the brass a little more and you'll see a little more wear on the brass=less life than a regular base die. so start with the regular and go from there....


great article on the X-die

http://www.jouster.com/cgi-bin/reload/reload.pl?read=5995

 

[RecoilRob]

agd1953,

Kamicosmos has it right. Got mine from Midway (love those people) as sizers only in .223 and .308. $35 for each.

Have used the die on a limited #Radway Green fired in the Varminter and did NOT trim them, just resized in the die that I had set up on some virgin Guat's. The RG's came out looking fine and were not overlength! Nice die.

Seems that people report multiple resizings can cause the necks to thicken...have to use them more to see if that is true.

And, dmftoy1 has the same experience I had with the 7.62 OF'd from Midway. NICE looking late LC brass, but it surely came out of M240's and IS a bit big around the case web. The SB X-die worked a bit getting them down but did a fine job and they chamber easily in all my rifles.

As an aside, several years ago I reloaded a few hundred 7.62's that I picked up in the service that came out of M-60's....and had case head seperations. The modern guns seem much easier on the brass.

 

[agd1953]

Thanks for all your help. I think I'll get the two die set with x-die. and yes the Varminter is a tack driver