"Sniper: Inside the Crosshairs", history Channel tonight

[Big Bill]

That mile and a half shot, which is 7640 feet away for that Canadian sniper using american made 50 ammo, was just phenominal.

Im sure mall ninja's and armchair commando's loved it. I thought that they glorified snipers, making them seem almost god-like. "I shot so many people I had blisters on my trigger finger" oh and he watched wild dogs feed on the corpses of his victims.

You're so condescending. It was a great program. And, BTW, I'm no mall ninja nor armchair commando!

oh and he watched wild dogs feed on the corpses of his victims.

Victims HELL! Those were the enemy!!! You know, the ones who behead innocent people and who desecrate the bodies of our soldiers and civilians. The enemy who blew-up over 3000 innocent civilians in NYC in 2001.

Since I know very little about different rnd bullets, they were referring to some of the ammo as 7.62 in bolt action rifles sniper rifles.

7.62x51mm NATO
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


7.62x51mm NATO rounds compared to AA (LR6) battery.

Type Rifle
Place of origin United States
Service history
In service 1954–present
Used by United States, NATO, others.
Wars Vietnam War, Falklands Conflict, Gulf War, War in Afghanistan, Iraq War
Specifications
Parent case .300 Savage
Case type Rimless, Bottleneck
Bullet diameter 7.80 mm (0.307 in)
Neck diameter 8.77 mm (0.345 in)
Shoulder diameter 11.53 mm (0.454 in)
Base diameter 11.94 mm (0.470 in)
Rim diameter 12.01 mm (0.473 in)
Rim thickness 1.27 mm (0.050 in)
Case length 51.18 mm (2.015 in)
Overall length 69.85 mm (2.750 in)
Rifling twist 1:12"
Primer type Large Rifle
Maximum pressure 415 MPa (60,200 psi)
Ballistic performance
Bullet weight/type Velocity Energy
146.6 gr (9.50 g) 2,756 ft/s (840 m/s) 2,472 ft·lbf (3,352 J)
Source: Popenker[1][2]

The 7.62x51mm NATO is a rifle cartridge developed in the 1950s as a standard for small arms among NATO countries. Specifications for the 7.62x51mm NATO cartridge are not identical to the commercial .308 Winchester though they are safely interchangeable.[3] When loaded with a bullet design that expands, tumbles, or fragments in tissue, this cartridge is capable of delivering devastating terminal performance, including remote wounding effects known as hydrostatic shock.[4][5][6]

The 7.62x51mm NATO cartridge was introduced to military service in rifles and machine guns. It was introduced in U.S. service in the M14 rifle and M60 machine gun in the late 1950s. Fabrique Nationale de Herstal's FAL became the most popular 7.62mm NATO rifle in Europe and served well into the early 1980s. The M14 was superseded in U.S. service as the infantry adopted the 5.56x45mm M16. However, the M14 and many other firearms that use the 7.62x51 round remain in service, especially in the case of sniper rifles and machine guns. The cartridge is used both by infantry and on mounted and crew-served weapons mounted to vehicles, aircraft and ships.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.62x51mm_NATO

So, it's basically a .308

 

[rcmodel]

See what I was saying about the Army vis the Marines and the press.

Army SSG Adelbert F. Waldron III was a United States Army sniper with the highest number of confirmed kills by an American in history.

109 vis Hathcocks 93.

But nobody outside the Army marksmanship program ever heard of Army SSG Adelbert F. Waldron.
Because he didn't have the USMC's Maj. Jim Land writing press releases in mass quantities about him all during the Vietnam war.

rc

 

[Quoheleth]

I saw the last 1/2 of the Sniper program and then the first 45 minutes of the M16 program (I dozed off at 11:45) .

The sniper show's "high point" was hearing the very humble Canadian describe his shot, doping the wind & distance, and then still taking a couple shots to get it right. They then had Scott Jarrett (IIRC), ex-SEAL (why does everyone assume ex-SEALS are all that & a bag of chips?), try the shot with one of their company guns ---- and he couldn't do it. IMHO, that said all the more about the Canadian sniper's work.

The M-16 program was OK, but I think they were selling M-16 so hard they really didn't tell just how bad it really was when first issued. Yeah, they talked about it a little bit, but other programs have been much more brutally honest about the first generation of M16s. They made it sound last night like it was a minor bump. Also, they sold the 5.56 as a magic bullet - as if getting hit by the high-speed uberpowerful 55gr bullet would darn near rip someone half in two.

But, all in all, the shows were pretty good. A solid A- on the sniper program (based on what I saw) and a B/B+ on the M16 program.

Q

 

[freakshow10mm]

The ex-SEAL was a McMillan from McMillan Brothers Rifles (mcmfamily.com).

 

[Quoheleth]

^
Sorry...I knew it was one of the major manufacturing families' names.

Q

 

[Gunmenhunter]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRYwMrsaLxs Here is the show

 

[Warhawk83]

The History Channel mentioned Simo Hayha on a different show earlier this year. I think it was Sharpshooters or something like that. I can't fathom why he wasn't included in this show.

 

[7X57chilmau]

The Canadian sniper's name is Master Corporal Rob Furlong, from the great province of Newfoundland, Canada....

Just thought I'd put the man's name in here.... He deserves it. Helluva shot!

J

 

[C-grunt]

I watched it off and on as there was a show about SFAS on the military channel at the same time. From what I saw I liked it. I missed the Furlong and Hathcok interviews though

Didnt Furlong use a McMillan rifle for the shot?

Also Mythbusters revisited the Hathcok shot through the scope with a correct/similar scope and was able to reproduce the shot.

 

[USSR]

Specifications
Parent case .300 Savage

Ah, you got to be careful with Wikipedia, as it tends to have some "dubious" info at times. The .300 Savage was the "inspiration" for the creation of the new cartridge now known as the 7.62x51 Nato/.308 Winchester. In the case (no pun intended) of cartridges such as the .243 Winchester and the 7mm-08, the parent case IS the .308 Winchester, as they are nothing more than the parent case necked down to a smaller caliber.

Don

 

[Redneck with a 40]

I thought it was a very informative, entertaining, well done show. History channel puts out some good stuff, in my opinion. Based on the sniper shot in Iraq, the enemy sniper kill at 1200 meters, all the talk of the .308 being a marginal 1000 meter cartridge is null and void. The .308 may not be the best performer at that range, but it got it done!

My favorite segment was the sniper in Falujah, he totally lit that alley way up, scared the s*** out of them, way to go!

Its also nice to know that 2550 fps on a 175 gr boat-tail, gets you out to 800 meters very effectively. That's about the velocity I'm getting out of my 20" Remmy 700 SPS Tac.

Also, if Remington is good enough for the Army/Marines, its good enough for me.

 

[skidooman603]

Also TOP SNIPER on Mil Channel

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

Just watched it to completion (I dvr'd it). Wow! This is a must see for riflemen.

 

[nipprdog]

I just saw that it airs again today at 3PM EST.

Preceded by three episodes of Lock'n Load with R. Lee Emery.

 

[t george]

watching it right now... good stuff Lots to be proud of from these snipers!!!

 

[Erik M]

They seem like payed actors who got thier information from video games.


To restate my opinion from 2 months ago since this is a necro thread:

Im sure mall ninja's and armchair commando's loved it. I thought that they glorified snipers, making them seem almost god-like. "I shot so many people I had blisters on my trigger finger" oh and he watched wild dogs feed on the corpses of his victims.

Completely unrealistic.

 

[nipprdog]

They seem like payed actors who got thier information from video games.

 

[RX-178]

I think it's quite fortunate for the American war effort that not all of our servicemen are aware that the things they do for a living day in and day out in those hellholes are completely unrealistic and undoubtedly impossible to accomplish in 'reality'.

 

[Smokin Gator]

Did they mention what the requirements were for the snipers from different armed forces were to be credited with a "confirmed" kill? All of them probably have more than they are officially credited for, but for some of them the difference may be greater due to what it takes for it to be considered "confirmed".
Also, from what I understand, as far a sniper really sneaking in to enemy territory and crawling hundreds of yards, taking a couple of days to move that far, through little cover and getting in and out after getting a specific target, no one beats Carlos Hathcock. Others have more kills but it wasn't that type of operation. He had a number of kills that were specifically targeted individuals that really needed to go away.
Mark

 

[Big Bill]

I think it's quite fortunate for the American war effort that not all of our servicemen are aware that the things they do for a living day in and day out in those hellholes are completely unrealistic and undoubtedly impossible to accomplish in 'reality'.

What? Maybe I'm just thick headed tonight, but could you please explain this a little better?

 

[RX-178]

@Big Bill

That was in response to a poster who said that the first-hand testimony of all of the real snipers in their interviews was 'completely unrealistic'

 

[Big Bill]

RX - OK. I should have read the other post. Sorry. It makes perfect sense now and I agree with you.

 

[Erik M]

@Big Bill

That was in response to a poster who said that the first-hand testimony of all of the real snipers in their interviews was 'completely unrealistic'

I never said all. I was only quoting one individual person from the show. I don't feel I have to justify my opinion on the subject. Someone that would describe their exploits as a sniper as "I shot so many people I had blisters on my trigger finger" and "[he] watched wild dogs feed on the corpses of his victims" and "7.62 means it has more powder" lives in his own little word far from reality and military decorum.


The show contained entirely to much entertainment value.

 

[t george]

those snipers are heroes in thier finest form... without them and others like them you would not have the right or the ability to say that you think thier testamonies are unrealistic... and I might not have the right or ability to argue that...

Thanks to all the armed forces for every thing you do.

 

[RX-178]

I add that in regards to the description of wild dogs, that every single first-hand account of Fallujah that I have read had mentioned the wild dogs feeding upon human flesh.

Read the book 'House to House', written by David Bellavia, with the 2nd Battalion, 2nd Infantry Regiment of the US Army, who currently has a recommendation for a Medal of Honor and Distinguished Service Cross under review.

In that book, he even describes seeing wild dogs lapping blood and meat off of the tracks of an M1 Abrams tank that was stopped in the street.

The book even describes, in excruciating detail, how he killed an enemy combatant in HAND TO HAND combat after he hesitated to fire his rifle after smelling gas fumes in the room he was in.

Incredibly 'unrealistic', I imagine.