So I go to a Hunter Education course...

[MSGT9410]

...And I find some of the stuff the instructors stated to be a little ..."odd". They were ranting about how we should never call our guns WEAPONS because WEAPONS are used by CRIMINALS to MURDER people. Instead, we must call them "Sporting Firearms". This was stressed numerous times. Also, we never "kill" an animal. We "harvest" it (I found that a little...wierd. Maybe I'm just foolish?). Another thing that kinda got me fired up is that one of the instructors was telling us that we had NO REASON to have a loaded firearm ANYWHERE in your house for ANY REASON. I think that's just asinine.

Or am I just an idiot?

 

[boofus]

Ask him why he voted for Kerry

 

[SIGarmed]

Well these courses are state run aren't they? What did you expect?

 

[Deersniper]

Too PC for me!

 

[Majic]

Tell him to get back to the part about hunting and keep the rest to himself.

 

[Legionnaire]

Long time hunter safety instructor here. NY State DEC encouraged all NY Hunter Safety instructors to use the terms "firearm" and "harvest." As SIGarmed suggests, about what you can expect from state run programs.

That said, I taught with a great group of guys. We tried to avoid the word "weapon" but gun and firearm were used interchangably. And when I did the handgun section and used a Glock to illustrate a semi-auto handgun, nobody blanched if I called it a weapon, as it clearly was not a hunting firearm. We talked about killing as well as harvesting animals. But we never instructed students that they should not refer to guns/firearms as weapons. Not a hill worth dying on. I also occasionally taught with some "good ol' boys" who were former military ... who called their firearms any darn thing they wanted to. So it kind of depends on the philosphy of the team you get.

Interesting article in the most recent Field and Stream, blaming some of the decline in the number of hunters on state-mandated HS courses. Article seemed to suggest that the way to go was to get rid of minimum ages as long as the junior is accompanied by a responsible adult. Apparently, a number of states have or are considering such. I liked teaching HS courses; it was a way to give back. But I'd rather take a newbie hunting ...

 

[Titus]

I've always heard "harvest" but not from people who "weren't killing".

What I remember, having gone through Hunter Ed several times by myself or with others, is the old guy with half a hand that would hold it up at the appropriate time in the gun safety talk and say "Ya get one of theeeesssse!" or "And it hurts like hell!"

 

[blind hog]

hunter saftey course

yes you should go as far as the rest of story sounds like pc yard sausage if it looks like duck and it quacks like a duck then its a duck its only there opinion i would take the course

 

[gunner03]

My instructors where pretty cool about it all but did suggest using the word harvest insted of killed,wacked or dumped,so as not to convince the fence-sitters that we're all about the blood.They said most people are not anti-hunter or anti-gun,most give it little or no thought one way or the other. Better to give them the best possible look at our side rather than to prove what the anti's have said!!You will probably never change an anti but you have a chance with the undecided!!

 

[Mulliga]

Time for a little story...

When our club sets up a table in the plaza, people often come up to us and ask "Do we have to have our own weapons to join?"

It's a mindset thing. To the average non-gunowner, the only possible reason for a gun to exist is to eventually shoot someone, and invariably someone innocent. This attitude can best be seen in the execrable book, "The Rifle" by Gary Paulsen. In this book, the rifle almost has a mind of its own - it cannot help but lie in wait to kill all by itself. The use of the word "weapon" to describe all guns is an outgrowth of this kind of thinking.

Of course, "firearm" connotes "weapon," too, so the hunter safety instructors were being silly.

As for the use of the term "harvest" instead of "kill," my hunter safety instructors taught me to use the former, as well. After all, which is more polite: "your mother died," or "your mother passed away"? Using "harvest" helps to emphasize the total package that drives most people to hunt in the first place - getting to know the outdoors, spending time with loved ones, keeping heritage alive, etc.

 

[bogie]

Oh hell... Someone's gotta do it...

This is my weapon; this is my gun.

This one's for killin'; this one's for fun.

 

[rust collector]

Please bear in mind that much of what we teach gets interpreted and then fed to peers and parents later. The class is predominantly 11 year olds, and we have to teach them not to be too bloodthirsty for the good of the sport. The 70% of the population that does not hunt but doesn't mind if I hunt has feelings that must be considered.

We try to teach the kids that happiness is not a large gut pile, if it flies it doesn't have to die, and beer is not a necessary part of a good hunting experience. We also try to give them a shot of game management principles and let them know that hunters help nongame species more than nonhunters do.

There's a lot to try to get across in 10 contact hours, and there's plenty of competition for the limited attention spans of our students. The central theme of the course is safety, not second amendment theory. Thoughtfulness and consideration really aren't cardinal sins, so spare me the PC blather. If you want to advise an 11 year old to keep a loaded gun under his pillow, I guess that's your business. I don't want to read about my students in the newspaper, unless posing with a nice buck.

 

[el44vaquero]

Just my thoughts.

I think they use the terms to be more friendly to the uneducated public who have never hunted in their lives. These people are the folks that believe we are killing bambi. As far as keeping loaded weapons goes, I believe this is also directed towards people who keep a loaded deer rifle laying around where children could get there hands on it. Instead of properly teaching people the safe ways to keep loaded firearms for protection, they teach no loaded firearms period. So just take what they say with a grain of salt and use your best judgement.

just my .02

 

[fisherman66]

I agree.

I'd rather put a PC face on hunting than the rednecked one I watched in my rodeo town as a kid.

My first hunting trip ended and on the drive home we came across 2 full bags of garbage and empty shotshells that evidently fell off a truck. We picked up every last piece of trash and shotshell. Neighbors watching I hope.

Sure it is PC bullpoop, but I'd rather not alienate those who have an open mind or who live around the places we practice our hobby.

 

[mattw]

My hunter's saftey course in gulfport mississippi was a joke. Those guys were such idiots and they were sooo sure that they were right. My father and I both got a good chuckle when he illustrated a semi-auto handgun and held up his "Springfield 9-1-1" (a springfield armory 1911) believe it or not he, honest to God, believe that the handgun that he had which said Model 1911-A1 on the side was called a "nine-one-one." The were just morons in general and I loathed every minute of the class. I was really upset because I'm sure that those idiots at Cadet Point have soured more than one newbie hunter on the sport. I thank God that no anti-gun librals were there.. they would've had plenty of ammo to turn mississippi into California.

 

[ruger270man]

I agree, to never use the word "weapon".. I tell other gun owners this as well when I hear them use it.

Is it PC... yes.. Does it make gun owners look better in the eyes of non-gun owners?

yes.

I also agree with "harvest".. although I dont use it myself.

 

[1911 guy]

I suppose...

P.C. for sure, but they also have to talk to the lowest common denominator. This could be they kid whose dad only takes him out for deer once a year or the woman sitting there just because she wants to see what her son or husband is interested in. Do I agree with the terminology they suggest? Not really, but I'm not bothered by it. I do tell my neices and nephews to never have a loaded gun except when you're actually shooting, but my wife's pistol and mine are both loaded 24/7. Again, the most basic instruction until enough is learned to progress.

 

[RavenVT100]

To the average non-gunowner, the only possible reason for a gun to exist is to eventually shoot someone, and invariably someone innocent. This attitude can best be seen in the execrable book, "The Rifle" by Gary Paulsen. In this book, the rifle almost has a mind of its own - it cannot help but lie in wait to kill all by itself. The use of the word "weapon" to describe all guns is an outgrowth of this kind of thinking.

My daughter's school made her read this.

 

[RCL]

Things sure have changed.
When I was still teaching about 15 years ago, WE were encouraged (by the master instructors) to stress that they were weapons, even the bows! (I taught firearms and archery)

 

[birddog]

The only time I've ever chewed a magazine editor a new one for changes to an article of mine is when he changed a quote about "killing", to "harvesting". Thankfully the magazines are getting away from using "harvest"...finally!! It also drives me crazy to hear it on hunting shows. People reading hunting magazines and watching hunting shows do NOT need to be bathed in the PC glow. They know that killing is killing. As far as the non-hunting crowd, they know we're killing too. The ones that hate it will hate it no matter what we call it. The ones who are on the fence are not going to be influenced by PC terminology one way or the other. Harvesting is what you do to corn and beans. Our society is far too intent on hiding reality behind vague terms.

 

[TonyB]

OK then,if someone breaks into my house..I'll use my "sporting firearm" to "harvest" them........and I'll use as many "exploding projectiles" as it takes to do it

 

[scout26]

Having been through a couple of these classes with mine and other's kids:
At least around here the kids under age 14 (IIRC) have to be accompanied by an adult. About half the time that's MOM !!! So what gets stressed is safety, game management, and sportsmanship/ethics.

A "Weapon" can be a gun or a bow or a knife or a baseball bat or a hammer. Weapons are used to kill people. (As bogie stated......)

A "Firearm" or a "Bow" is used to "Take" or "Harvest" game.

Yes, it may seem "PC" but the goal is to get young people into the fields and woods to hunt safely and ethically. But Mom has got to be comfortable with the fact that you won't shoot yourself or get shot accidently. They may still have a problem with "Oooky" stuff, but as long as they don't have to see it they will support the kids in their interest to hunt.

 

[gezzer]

Elmer Fudd PC Crap :banghead:

 

[Flyboy]

I'm with scout26 on this one. I try to avoid the word "weapon" unless I really mean it. I know it's PC tripe, but sometimes it pays to play well with others.

Additionally, I'm of the school of thought that says it's not a weapon until intent is formed to use it as one. My kitchen knives are for slicing, chopping, or otherwise preparing food. They're not weapons. If you break into my home while I'm cooking dinner, though, my 10" chef's knife is going to become a weapon in short order. Ditto with a car, baseball bat, telephone cable, or electrical wiring: they're not weapons until somebody decides to use them as such.

My guns are the same way: they are tools for propelling one or more projectiles downrange in a consistent manner so as to deliver energy to a target. Most of them are for paper and/or clay. A few are used for hunting, and I'll grant that they are weapons when used for that purpose (though I shy away from the term; see above about "playing well with others"). My 870 with the 18" barrel and buckshot is a home defense weapon: I've already formed the intent to make that my defensive weapon in the event of a home invasion. Ditto with my sidearm (1911): even though I haven't chosen a target (haven't needed to, and, God willing, won't need to), I have formed intent to use it should the need arise. The 1911 in the cabinet, though, isn't.

Mmmmm, pedantry.

 

[DigMe]

My instructor told me that if we wanted to memorize everything in the hunter's ed book "You'd have to have some kinda photogenic memory"



brad cook