Spartan Blades

[JimStC]

Recently I purchased the Spartan small neck knife. I was very seriously impressed. Actually it is good or better than the Chris Reeves Professional Soldier.
Today I added two more Spartans:
http://www.knifeart.com/spartancqb.html
http://www.knifeart.com/spartanphrike2.html

I am very impressed by the engineering of these blades. The designers are no BS guys with real world experience. That means a lot to me. I use the Enyo every day and it is a solid tool.

Jim

 

[hso]

Curtis and Mark (like Kim and Gary) are former SF who take their knifemaking seriously. Nice guys too. Get the four of them together and you've got an evening's entertainment.

 

[JimStC]

Agree regarding nice guys. After I bought the Enyo, I e-mailed them saying how pleased I was with my first Spartan. I received a response the same day thanking me for the purchase. Shows class by my standards.

Jim

 

[kim breed]

Wait until their new fighting dagger comes out. its sweet.
Really enjoy both Mark and Curtis.

 

[Jason_G]

So which came first?

The Spartan dagger or the Benchmade that looks almost identical? The Benchmade was designed by Greg Thompson according to the info on the page I linked. I know knives have evolved to the point that they all tend to have certain similarities in form, simply because they have similar functions for the most part, so sometimes originality in design is tough or simply a bad idea, but those two look almost identical. I'm not a dagger guy, so is there a story there that I'm missing? Is this a just a common pattern dagger?


Jason

 

[JShirley]

Yeah, I saw it, and asked myself if Benchmade licensed it from them...

 

[hso]

Keep in mind that Spartan has a couple of Harsey designs so I wouldn't be surprised to see other designers working with them.

 

[JimStC]

Included in the Spartan description for the dagger is a credit to Greg Thompson as the designer, just in case anyone missed it.

Jim

 

[Jason_G]

Included in the Spartan description for the dagger is a credit to Greg Thompson as the designer, just in case anyone missed it.

Thanks, I did miss it. That makes more sense now.

Jason

 

[sidheshooter]

Spartan was first with the ring dagger offering, so far as I know. I'm pretty sure that I have old adverts in my files crediting the fort Bragg guy that pre-date the bench made press release.

as an aside, this one is just smokin' hot, IMHO:

http://www.knifeart.com/enyodamascus.html

 

[JimStC]

Quoting from the site:

This design concept of the CQB tool originates with Greg Thompson, an instructor of close quarters fighting techniques (Hand To Hand) for the US Special Forces. Mr. Thompson is a member of the H2H/Team ROC of the Fort Bragg based training group, US Special Operations Combatives Program (USSOCP). Recently, Mr. Thompson developed the new combatives program for US Army Special Operations Forces and this CQB tool is part of his edged equipment gear.

 

[JimStC]

sideshooter, I drooled at that blade..... Had to dry my keyboard. I went the cheaper route and bought the plain Enyo

Jim

 

[hso]

With respect to the Spartan ring dagger, I'll confirm that I saw them offer it well before Benchmade. Thompson came to them, refinement of the design took place and Mark and Curtis started making it. Eventually Benchmade started making their version of it after Thompson got together with the larger company. These things do happen in the knife industry.

 

[sidheshooter]

^^^ there it is.

sideshooter, I drooled at that blade..... Had to dry my keyboard. I went the cheaper route and bought the plain Enyo

Jim

I hear you, big time. Actually, your posting of your satisfaction with the Enyo likely has me heading over to the "spartacoat" version myself... unless I feel like saving a few more dollars in the "husband discretionary account", and waiting...

 

[Jason_G]

came to them, refinement of the design took place and Mark and Curtis started making it. Eventually Benchmade started making their version of it after Thompson got together with the larger company. These things do happen in the knife industry.

Gotcha. Well, that's on the up and up, as long as the designer is getting credit. I was just hoping that whoever the designer was wasn't getting ripped off. I hate it when companies rip off others' designs, especially when the person getting ripped off is one of the "small time" guys who are designing and making these one at a time, and not exactly getting rich to begin with. I wouldn't figure Benchmade for doing that, but some companies have... I'll stop there.

It is a good looking knife. I'd like to see it in use, to see exactly how that ring could be employed.


Jason

 

[JimStC]

Jason,
In my limited experience I see good upside to the ring as a striking tool. Bet I wasn't first to think of that. (Ummm, Duh)
I look for multiple uses for any tool. Options are good by my thinking.

Jim

 

[AStone]

Somebody said something about blades in this thread?

No, really, I heard it from around the corner and up the street.
_____

The CQB Tool has been on my list for a while.

Not as high on the list now,
but still on the list.

 

[hso]

From my personal experience, if the BM is this similar to the Spartan, either the knife came fully developed in Thompson's hand to Spartan and then again 2 years later to BM with no changes (unlikely) or Spartan's contributions weren't credited when Thompson took the knife to BM. This also happens at times.

Regardless of the route the knife took in the design/production process, Spartan made them first, the Spartans are made in the U.S.of 154CM.
Benchmade only has an agreement with Thompson.

 

[Jason_G]

From my personal experience, if the BM is this similar to the Spartan, either the knife came fully developed in Thompson's hand to Spartan and then again 2 years later to BM with no changes (unlikely) or Spartan's contributions weren't credited when Thompson took the knife to BM. This also happens at times.

Well, I sure hope no one got cheated out of due credit, but I'm glad to know which was made first. That would weigh heavily in my purchasing decision if I were in the market for such a knife.


ETA: I was looking a little harder at that CQB dagger and noticed that it looks like it is only edged about half way up the blade. I get that the knife is thicker towards the hilt, and maybe that thicker cross section makes for more strength, but it doesn't seem like it would weaken the blade that much to put an edge all the way down, even if it is a thicker bevel. I wonder what the reasoning was behind that? Anyone know?


Jason

 

[sidheshooter]

^^^The relatively short edged area is to make sure that you don't mess yourself up as you transition to a firearm, or at least that's my understanding. The ring is for both speed of deployment, as well as an aid in retaining the dagger as a transition to a firearm is made.

There is some dope available at benchmade on this, as well as a sidebar on the knife in TK, FWIW:

http://www.benchmade.com/images/pr/pdf/socpdaggeruseandcarryguide.pdf

http://www.ussocp.com/includes/pdf/Tactical-Knives-SOCP-May-2012.pdf

 

[JimStC]

Sid,
Thanks for the references.

Jim

 

[Jason_G]

^^^The relatively short edged area is to make sure that you don't mess yourself up as you transition to a firearm, or at least that's my understanding. The ring is for both speed of deployment, as well as an aid in retaining the dagger as a transition to a firearm is made.

Ah. Gotcha. Thanks.

Jason

 

[modarmory]

Spartan fans you will be happy to know that they have a folder coming out in the next month or two. Unsure of price.
They have a few specifications on their facebook page about the knife

 

[sidheshooter]

^^^

 

[JimStC]

I see another Spartan Blade in my future. Thanks a lot Mod:banghead:

The mail today brought the two knives that started this thread.
As impressed with my first one. The CQB Tool is smallish in my hand but is a definite purpose built tool. I get the ring's purpose now: drawing the knife. It is too short to use as a strike tool. The design of the blade having sharpened edges on 1.75" of the 3" blade is a great idea. When I grip the knife, my hand does extend to the blade as the handle area, excluding the ring, is 2.5". If my grip includes the ring, there is no blade contact. The kydex sheath is well conceived as it covers the entire tool other than the ring. This necessitates securing the sheath for a one hand draw.

The Phrike is a very attractive knife. The handle concept for a skeleton design provides a stable grip. 4" blade with a 4.5" handle fits my hand well. Two thumb reliefs, one on the handle with cross notches and one on the blade which is smooth. The one on the blade is "notched" so that the thumb won't as easily slip forward.
The sheath is MOLLE and is not what I would choose. I will replace it with one of Kevin's designs at TIE. This knife is suited to concealment, but not with this sheath. It needs a small kydex sheath.