Speaking Of Doubling.....

[Dave McCracken]

Part of the fun at The Geezer Squad's get togethers is playing with the other kids' toys. Doug Kelly is good for this, he has a lot of fine shotguns and seems to like letting others shoot them a bit.

Today's was a Parker, D grade 20 gauge with purty lumber, typical engraving and 25" barrels. Single trigger was clean, and the butt had one of those skeleton plates where only the rim was steel with nicely checkered wood in the middle. It weighed a hair less than 6 lbs, according to Doug. Made in 1919, it's a masterpiece of lethal art.

So after a round or two of trap doubles, I asked if I could try it out for a couple shots. The ever generous Mr Kelly handed it to me with 4 of his 7/8 oz reloads. I stepped to the line, loaded both barrels and was ready to try a shot from low gun when I recalled that Doug's stocks fit his modest frame and were way too short for me. So, I mounted the Parker, pulled it well into my shoulder and called for the bird.

Premounting then and there may be the smartest thing I've done this week. I swung up to the bird and pulled the trigger.

Both barrels went off, though it took a second or two to figure this out. All I knew was that it kicked like heck.

Figure it out. Gun weight of less than 6s lbs, 1 3/4 oz of shot leaving at about 1225 FPS or faster. A lot of energy through that slender, unpadded butt.

Doug knew what happened from the sound. He then tried a couple shots and again it doubled. Note that it had just made it through a round of trap doubles glitchless, and many rounds before. Following those two times, it worked perfectly for a number of dry fires. It was cased and the owner switched to another D grade 20 he had brought.

I am unscathed, though I had worried about damage. That shoulder has a torn rotator cuff and some arthritis, some new medications have just gotten me to the point where I can shoot without pain. Thank Heaven for modern medicine.

Points to ponder.....

First, think of what would have happened if I had bad form or left a little air betwixt butt and shoulder.

Second, even fine shotguns can glitch.

Third, 870s can't double.......

 

[sm]

Gee Dave,
Don't ya know your supposed to set up a double 10 bore to do this on purpose to be a tacticool and all?

Little know fact: this doubling is how the fad to wear ball caps started, word is the fella unleased both barrels, found himself upon the ground, little birdies and stars in his vision, and hat backwards.

Yes it has happened to me. I was a kid [clarify, I was a smaller sized and younger kid] when this happened to me the first time, with a 20 bore. Get older the 12 bore did it. I must have been doing something right as the last time it was in .410.

*ahem* never had it happen in 28 ga though.

Anything mechanical - can and will get a glitch.

Good thing using good form in your case...I was shooting low gun when the 12 bore and .410 did it.

Nope never had it happen in a single shot, pump, or semi that is for sure true.

Regards,

Steve

 

[Dave McCracken]

Thanks for the support, Steve.

I thought that the folks here newer to shotgunning would like to see this, since there's been some discussion recently.

New folks, doubling is unpleasant. Trust me and Steve on this.

 

[Bob F.]

Had a 12ga Antonio Zoli SxS 26" doubl on my first try at Canadas. It was the only shotty I could shoot steel out of as it was "open and opener". Missed mine but son got his first with 20ga 870Exp with mod choke screwed in.

Stay safe.
Bob

 

[sm]

Dave,

Doubling - is just one example of how this Shotgunning is both Art and Science. Principles apply to all firearms and the shooting thereof.

I harp about Gun fit to shooter, and not just shotguns. I will state again - I am convinced that a long gun, that fits the shooter, with a Pachmyer Decellarator will allow a shooter to shoot better and have less felt recoil.

Same priciples goes for Handguns too...shooter needs to be able to reach controls, trigger, and the stocks need to fit.

This gun fit encompasses many things, including Rule of 96's - simply put -the weight of payload to weight of gun. Horsepower to Weight ratio is fine for race cars...not in firearms. Even race cars have to use a bit of common sense, so does the shotgunner/ rifle shooter.

Skeet/ Trap shooters will shoot 100 rds in a typical competitive round. Often times these folks will shoot two rounds or 200 rds. Five stand, Sporting clays, and other disciplines shoot higher rd counts as well. These are folks not just going out to 'shoot to make noise or impress themselves with a few rounds of internetwonderloads"

Repetition of firing can cause fatigue, which leads to flinching, poor form, and getting whacked pretty good. Scores drop - physical damage such as detached retinas, neck, shoulder, and back injuries occur.

Same thing applies to 3 gunners, and folks taking Defensive Training classes. These folks too shoot a LOT, and often shoot heavier loadings. You will note these folks are not shooting lightweight guns with the heavier loadings - in volume either.

Same thing as doubling.
Same thing in using really heavy loads in light guns when you do not have to.

Personally, I never owned a shotgun with a chamber more than 2 3/4" in anything other than .410 - until more recent. I have yet to fire a 3" shell in that gun. I loaded one, I inserted a few in the barrel removed...taking note and checking it out - never fired one in it.

I tend to stalk or take closer in shots, or knew my limits and my loads in my guns before I went out.

Now there is a place for "heavy loads". My buddy has a 835 Ultra Mag in 3.5" for waterfowl, he won the darn thing and figured he use it for non- toxic shot. Like a friggin' train wreckdescribes them Roman candles we fired off...I had been piddlin' with a single shot .410 with popcorn loads...yeah buddy that was a distinct change of slap trigger and the "go bang".

The reality is - he like many patterned the gun for his waterfowl and turkey needs. FWIW he did not always use 3.5" shells. He shot a lot of Skeet/ Trap/ 5 stand with that gun with target loads - so that gun was an extension of him. All he did was load it with what the task needed, from a loading already patterned. The way one is supposed to do this.

Same reason I suggest the 20 ga H&R / NEF single shot instead of the 12 bore ones. Especially in a Youth version, make a better truck gun, extra gun, or one for a eldery person than whacking a 12 bore single shot down.
The NEF youth in 20 comes with a real nice recoil pad, running #3 buck or slugs is not bad at all.

The idea is - we are supposed to hit what we are pointing at. If game - make ethical kills. If more serious, we need to stop an immediate threat.

WE do not need to be doubling, 1) not a gurantee one is gonna hit what pointing at, 2) accelerated wear and tear on shooter and shotgun, 3) if a serious situation, well juries and court rooms do not always believe the 'rationalization' of shooter as percieved by the firearm used.
Yeah I know - if the shoot is good, the shoot is good. There is that beyond reasonable doubt part and having been on juries and such...simpler is better IMO.

Doubling to me is taking two doves, quail, or ducks with one shot. I also like to take the Doubles at skeet with one shot, now that my friends is soooo much fun!


Steve

 

[Larry Ashcraft]

I did it once, quite by accident.

I guess I was about 14 or so, hunting jackrabbits with my uncle and brother, I had my grandad's old double. Jackrabbit jumped up, I pointed and pulled BOTH triggers on that old 12 ga.

Don't want to do THAT again.

 

[Dave McCracken]

Bob, they make 870s in 12 gauge too. One of those is probably a better choice for non toxics than that SxS. Save that one for lead and smaller birds.

Open and opener? One of my picks for the uplands qualified. 8 and 15 POC.

Steve, sometimes we who have been doing this since Mastodons went on the Endangered List have to back up a little to see how and what new folks do and see.

Friend Doug does himself a bit of a disservice using those light 20s for clays. The extra battering builds flinches like trash builds raccoon sightings. Those 20s are for carrying lots and shooting a bit, as in grouse and quail hunting.

But, I'm not going to tell a man older than me how to have fun.

Et tu, Larry? Amazing how well pain can teach us....

 

[Bob F.]

Yeah, Dave, since that incident have acquired an 870HD 18"cyl bore. Think I'll pattern it with some of the steel I still have. Unfortunately, don't get out much.

Stay safe.
Bob

 

[Dave McCracken]

Bob, good move. DO get out, life's too short....