starting 44 mag reloading: do I need Lee Factory Crimp Die?

[evtSmtx]

Just branching out from pistol to 44 magnum so this is the first of several questions. The few inert rounds I loaded after the die adjustment was complete
look pretty much like the factory rounds I compared against where the case goes into the cannelure

 

[jgh4445]

I use a FCD or crimp in the seating die. Lots of recoil and the bullets in the cylinders can run out a bit and pretty much lock everything up.

 

[MEHavey]

Standard roll-crimp dies work just fine.
(BTW: What dies are you using?)

 

[CZ9shooter]

Your seating die should do fine when properly set up. Plus, seating and crimping can be accomplished in one step with cannelured bullets. Why add an extra step? For most semi-auto rounds, especially with cast bullets, I do prefer seperate steps, but not here.

Depending on the power level of the ammo you are assembling, and the weight of your gun, you may need a heavier than usual crimp. But this is nothing most basic dies cant handle.

 

[evtSmtx]

I'm using Lee dies on my old and still much appreciated Lee Classic Turret. When I get 1K rounds or so of experience I may set up a toolhead for my Dillon. I need some time for the hints to my son that he'd have more 44 ammo if he bought the old man the dillon toolhead and dies.

 

[evtSmtx]

I'm starting with CFE Pistol and working up by .1 grains from the start load.

when I'm more used to reloading .44 I'll try H-110 or Lil Gun

 

[Mr.Revolverguy]

I would not use LilGun I only use it in 300 blackout. Lil Gun burns really hot and is known to cause more top strap cutting than H110. Now most say it will eventually stop but I don't want advance wear on any of my revolvers if I can help it.

 

[Walkalong]

Nope. Chances are extremely good all your rounds will chamber just fine without it. If not, chances are 99.99% that you can fix it by tweaking your load technique. It's much less of a problem with revolver rounds.

 

[oldpapps]

To the question posed:
No you don't 'need' a FCD but they are nice to have.

Jumping to the question posed on you other thread, getting a consistent crimp is needed for consistent burn/pressure/accuracy is dependent upon proper meeting of case and crimp groove. As long as case length is consistent enough to meet the need, trimming is not required. I seldom trim straight walled cases, ever. They don't lengthen all that much and when loaded in batches, what length change there is, is with in reason for all cases.

Referring to previous responses.

I have yet to see a true demonstration of the reported 'burning' effects of Lit'Gun powder. With that in mind, I looked in both my newer spreadsheet and my older database files and found only one loading logged using Lit'Gum powder and that listed only 11 rounds fired. Over the years I have burned many pounds of Lit'Gun but not in revolvers. Added note, I have no listing of ever using 296/H110 in any 44 loads. Now 231 (wimp load), 2400 and Olin 630 (long gone and out of production) are a different story.
Lit'Gun is good stuff.... But do I want to be the test subject that cuts a top strap?

As I don't know you use for your 44 loads, I can't make a solid statement as to what your needs may be. As of late I have been using mostly powder coated lead for my non-wimp loads and I think the polyester coating is slicker than jacketed or lead and a firm grip is needed for a good burn of 2400 powder. This sickness is better discussed in a different thread. Never the less, I do use a FCD for these types of loads.

I fear that I have not been of any help in your quest... Sorry.

 

[Hondo 60]

Need??? No.

People were reloading for hundreds of years without the benefit of a "Factory Crimp Die"
Those are of very recent vintage.

But, having said that, I use 'em for almost all handgun calibers.
32 S&W Long, 32 H&R Mag, 9mm, 38 Spl, 357 Mag, 41 Mag, 44 Spl, 44 Mag & 45 Colt.

I like seating & crimping in separate steps.

 

[[email protected]]

FS reloading offers a lee collet style FCD for the 44 mag. It is made like the rifle FCD. I can see where it would help if you dont trim your cases to the same length.

 

[Jlr2267]

I do not use the FCD with lead bullets. The FCD has a sizing ring which can size down your bullet, causing excessive fouling among other problems. I have used it with jacketed bullets with good results.

 

[gamestalker]

I assure you, long before the FCD existed, the magnum wheel gun and rimless cartridges were being reloaded without issue. I've never owned, used, or found the need to use the FCD, and yet I've had absolute success reloading .357 mag., 44 mag., .357 mag., and even the 500 S&W magnum for a short season, and as well various other wheel gun and rimless cartridges.

The FCD may have it use, but it is by no means a necessary tool. A proper roll crimp is all that's necessary, not too mention far easier to master.

GS

 

[ku4hx]

The only "extra" step I've ever taken with the 44 Magnum is using a separate roll crimping die. I shoot mostly cast boolits and last stage crimping-only prevents lead shaving.

Do you need an FCD, absolutely not. But if you feel the need to use one, and it works for you, go for it. I fired thousands of 44 Magnum rounds long before the FCD was marketed. I've never had a issue proper component selection and proper "old style" crimping didn't handle.

 

[Walkalong]

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=7699828&postcount=14

Seated and crimped in one step with a Hornady seater.

 

[joem1945]

I use Hornady dies and seat and crimp in one operation. I'm loading AA #9 and 240 gr hard cast lead RNFP from MO Bullet.

 

[Mauser69]

I personally see ZERO benefit to the FCD for revolver rounds, with one exception: If you have screwed up some loads by getting a bit too aggressive on the roll crimp and slightly bulged the case so it will not chamber, the FCD can fix those without having to pull the bullet and re-size. If you do the plunk test with your cylinder for the first few rounds after adjusting your crimp, you will never have that situation.

That said, here is my personal opinion - I like Lee dies. I buy them for all my handgun reloading. Sometimes the option of the four die set is nice.

I buy the 4 die sets for pistol calibers, but virtually NEVER use the FCD - I have it only for the very rare situation where I may be reloading pickup brass that is having a problem chambering in my pistols. If I find that, I will use the FCD to fix the loads that first time, then never need it again for the brass that has already been fired in my guns. I have absolutely NO interest in adding an extra unnecessary step to my reloading by running all rounds through the FCD. And also note that the FCD can CAUSE problems in certain situations: it may swage down a properly sized lead bullet to undersized for your gun, thus causing more leading problems.

I only buy the three die sets (without FCD) for revolver rounds. I have never had a problem with proper crimp on .357 and .44 Mag loads with the standard Lee or Lyman seating dies; NEVER seen any bullet jump or creep with my handloads. I won't ever use the FCD for those calibers, so why waste the money to just have it sitting in the box?

 

[bluetopper]

They do help in chambering 44 gas check reloads in a Freedom Arms cylinder.

They size the whole finished cartridge down, not just the crimp.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I seat and crimp in the same step with my .45 Colt.

The only thing I use a FCD for is autos with tight chambers. My Sig has a pretty tight chamber and I couldn't figure out why I was getting FTEs with my handloads. I started running them through a FCD and haven't had it happen again.

Some folks like em for everything though. It's personal preference and no one is wrong. See what works for you.

 

[Ironicaintit]

44 magnum should be roll crimped, in the same movement as seating.
Using the FCD on a revolver round feels like a solution looking for a problem!

I use a FCD lightly on auto-loaders, just to make sure the bell is ironed out.
But im a reloading newb, too. So take a grain of salt with that

 

[rondog]

People love the FCD, people hate 'em. Myself, I love 'em.

 

[nofishbob]

In reading the above replies, I think it is important to remember that there are TWO different Lee FCD die designs: the one with the fixed sizing ring, and the one with the sliding crimp collet that contacts the shell plate.

I hope that this helps clarify why people seem to be talking about different things!

Bob