Stop the Silly War Dance About the AWB Expiration

[bad_dad_brad]

Since 1994, after the AWB law, I have legally purchased a Ruger Mini-14, a Bushmaster AR-15, and an SAR1 AK-47. All of these firearms were fully compliant with the AWB law, and all are combat semi-automatic rifles, and with ease I was able to purchase fully legal hi-cap pre-ban magazines.

I knew this hype about the expiration of the AWB would create a stupid war dance about what amounts to nothing. The pro-firearm crowd should stop crowing as it alerts the masses about a non-issue that will backlash and turn into a more strict law against legitimate firearm ownership.

Shut the heck up about this or you will not only lose your hi-cap mags in the future but your firearms as well.

Too late as the media hype has taken it to a political level.
I guess there are always lever action rifles.

War is Peace.
Freedom is Slavery.
but mostly . . .
Ignorance is Strength.

Orwell - 1948.

 

[Tamara]

Mr. _brad,

Too late as the media hype has taken it to a political level.

Not to throw you off your feed, but "the media hype" has nothing to do with any "war dance", and would have occurred anyway had not a peep been uttered on this or any other board.

They have their agenda, which they will stick to regardless of what you or I do or say.

Besides...

Silence = Death

 

[Standing Wolf]

Those who are afraid to exercise their civil rights don't still have them.

Frankly, I think we should celebrate, and while we're about it, we ought to drum up the enthusiasm to take on more insane, anti-American laws.

 

[4v50 Gary]

Personally, I see no reason to gloat. Some of us (especially those in CA) can't buy anything new anyway. Still, if folks are happy, let them rejoice and spend, spend, spend. It's good for the economy.

Besides, the antis hate us, will always hate us and won't be happy until all the guns are gone. Now, when Al Qaeda hits us again, let's hear their tune.

 

[bad_dad_brad]

So true Tamara and I agree.

But I just hate the crowing and I just think it makes things worse for the future of legitimate firearms ownership in America.

I don't mean to disdain proactive lobbying to promote what the second amendment means, but we all know that things are more complicated than that.

When you have a camo garbed fellow hefting his California pre-ban Mini-14 with a 30 round magazine in a national media (CNN) published photo proclaiming victory over the AWB, it is not a good thing, when trying to convince the middle class, that gun ownership is in their best interest.

Like I quoted "Ignorance is Strength."

 

[C96]

The almost scary thing is the number of guys that have come to my local gun
shop to by an UZI or an AK47. They really want to buy a real machine gun
and the media has told them it is a simple thing to do.

A couple of the guys thought the shop owner was bs'ing them when he
explained what it took and cost to buy what they wanted. They thought he
was lying, the media had to be right.

There are too many sheeple that believe the media.

allan

 

[Tamara]

The almost scary thing is the number of guys that have come to my local gun
shop to by an UZI or an AK47. They really want to buy a real machine gun
and the media has told them it is a simple thing to do.

Not an obstacle, an opportunity.

Not an idiot, a potential ally.

 

[bad_dad_brad]

I think when the word "scary" was used in one of the last posts, that it was meant to portray an ignorance of current laws about automatic weapons, indeed which have been on the books since the late 1920's. That "Bonnie and Clyde" thing.

I think it would be a cold day in hell when when the average joe could purchase a machine gun in the U.S. - it ain't ever going to happen. A stupid law as well as I can, with a decent AR15, put out a lethal curtain of lead using a slick semi-auto that would probably be more effective than a full-auto machine gun.

The point is, perception by the general public, specifically the middle and upper class that does the voting. is what is important. If I have an AR-15 that is perceived as a hunting weapon, no problem, but if it is perceived as a, I rob a bank assault weapon, then pressure will be put upon to ban my rifle.

It is all about perception.

 

[Don Gwinn]

I've had my fill of hearing that it's too risky to speak up and we should all be afraid to stand up and tell our side of things. I'm also all done apologizing for winning. Shutting up while your enemies lie about you daily is NOT the way to win anything, ever. And crowing about a victory, whether you like it or not, is often the biggest part of convincing the public that you WON a victory. That's why the Brady people brag about their big wins even when they lose.

 

[geekWithA.45]

bad_dad_brad:

While you do have a valid point about not wanting to activate the masses and set off a backlash, I think the time for living in fear and walking on eggshells as a gunowner is over.

Done.

Finished.

As in Never Again.

 

[sm]

I shared this with one of our Moderators and members…I guess this is perhaps as good as place as to share with the rest of you fine folks. Yes, yours truly used another Visual Lesson on a College Campus. *grin*

Now I had my audience already selected from previous exposure to their Political leanings and various positions on RKBA – includes AWB.


I brought a Box each of:

-Strike Anywhere and Strike on Box only Kitchen Matches (250 count)
- Strike Anywhere and Strike on Box on Match boxes (32 count)
- Matchbook of matches (20 count).

They asked why I jumped over the small stream of water from some construction being done on campus - “I thought it might be the start of the flood of blood and assault weapons that is supposed to happen today†– I replied. *smirk*

I then dumped the sack of matches onto an outside table … Okay, you folks explain to me how in the hell the larger capacity / larger matches are anymore dangerous than the smaller ones. Explain to me how in the hell the Strike on Box / Book types are any safer.

Now some of you would suggest “all matches should be bannedâ€. Folks, the Reality is, criminals are not wired like responsible persons – they don’t care. Oh some do pay attention to laws and use against the law abiding. The only persons hurt by these legislations are the honest and law abiding. Ban matches and it is going to be a bitch to re-light the pilot light on a gas stove or gas hot water heater now isn’t it?

[Heads nod, eyes light up, and I heard a few “clicks†in the gray matter].

I was asked about the sign that says “no firearms on campusâ€. I replied we have had one firearm on campus and it was discharge recorded this yearâ€. Some were not aware of this. I continued that if a boyfriend can drive onto campus and discharge a firearm to get attention from a girlfriend that dumped him…what is going to stop a Terrorist that KNOWS that firearms are not allowed. The Campus is easy pickings like Russia of late.

[More “clicksâ€, jaw dropping, and head nodding]

I was asked what would be good solution. I replied, they should turn off the TV and the slanted views, use the Computer and Internet for something besides gaming and educate themselves about the Politicians, the Constitution, Bill of Rights, our State Laws …and so forth.

I then poised the question, now if any of YOU were a BGs, Criminal, or Terrorist and knew the Persons on THIS campus were allowed to be armed, would you seek to do harm here or chose another Campus that persons were not.

Would you like for our Persons on Campus – including the Campus Police to have the ability to fire more rounds before reloading, and have more ammo per magazine?

It is the intent of the user, that box of 250 Strike Anywhere Matches means one does not have to have the box with them to light them, they don’t have to run out and buy matches as often.

The Matchbox and Matchbook make carrying more convienent.

We already have laws in regard to Arson – banning types of matches; quantity of matches is not going to prevent Arson.

I then lit a smoke with an ‘evil’ Strike Anywhere Kitchen Match, whipped across my jeans…

Hell - I at least tried....

 

[SMLE]

bad_dad_brad

I think it would be a cold day in hell when when the average joe could purchase a machine gun in the U.S.

Send the devil some long underwear. An average Joe with some $$$ to burn most certainly CAN buy an MG. Takes a little paperwork and time, but it's not that hard at all.

 

[Ellery Holt]

Shut the heck up about this or you will not only lose your hi-cap mags in the future but your firearms as well.

WildAlaska, is that you?!

Like I quoted "Ignorance is Strength."

Well, that's one way to protect rights, I guess. But I stand with those who (and do myself) try and educate folks about the issues. I think that's a better way to protect rights, and I'm genuinely sorry you're advocating differently.

 

[Zundfolge]

AWB sunset or not the antis are still committed to destroying us and the media will still spread their lies with glee regardless of whether we engage in this "silly war dance" or not.

Our celebration of our one little victory in a long string of defeats may be the only thing that keeps some of us fighting (lord knows many of us are growing weary in this constant and unrelenting fight to maintain liberty).


If we can't be openly happy about and celebrate our victories then screw it, lets just give them our damn guns and get in the cattle cars now. Maybe we'll get lucky and they'll just gas us in the showers instead of making us toil in the fields or factories.


:banghead:

 

[GigaBuist]

Of course we're happy-dancing after the AWB sunset.

I'm not aware of any other federal firearms regulation to EVER go away in the history of the US. Granted, I'm a young'in at 24 -- but seriously, have they EVER dropped control of something that they had?

This shows progress alone.

Further, the Brandy Group and the anti-gun crowed DROPPED TRUMP on this thing and they lost! They pulled out the "machine guns everywhere" card and played it well enough that apparently we got people coming into gunshops thinking they can buy full-auto stuff now!

They lied. They lied horribly -- AND THEY STILL LOST!

The public, or those paying attention and not in the know, thought that real life machine guns were going to be legal suddenly. WE STILL WON!

They dropped trump. They've got nothing left. They told the US population that machine guns would be in our hands if this law didn't get passed again. They lost, and it's not true.

So, when we go after the '86 machine gun ban what do they have left? "No, really, this time we mean ACTUAL machine guns! Not just things that LOOK like them!"

They made it look like the '34 NFA was going to get repealed. They LOST STILL! That makes me happy. Makes me wonder if we COULD get the '34 NFA repealed.

 

[Titus]

You'll never get anywhere trying to suck up to people who aren't going to like you anyway. The people who are going to actively push gun control are going to do it anyway. One of the few things the media has gotten right lately is the fact that this 68% (or whatever) of people who support the AWB don't really care that much about it. You could ask them about how guns work and what the current laws actually say and you'd be doing well to get as good an answer as you'd overhear at a gun show. And it doesn't mean much to them when they vote.

Strength is strength. The 1994 elections is as big a reason as any why the AWB expired. The massacre the Democrats experienced is what did it, not because we sat around trying not to upset people. You can hide if you want, and wait and see if Feinstein et al all of a sudden say, "Gosh, those gun owners are so nice, we're just going to stop trying to ban all their guns." Or if the masses stop supporting every piece of gun control some pollster asks them about. The only way we're keeping our guns is to keep delivering the votes for or against politicians. Democrats aren't backing off of gun control cause someone didn't get their picture taken with a Mini-14. They're doing it cause they don't want to end up wearing their butts for a hat again. Okay, I'm getting on a roll here! I just remember that movie where the guy says, "I'll take that." and the other guy says, "Well, you're gonna have to."

 

[tulsamal]

I'm not aware of any other federal firearms regulation to EVER go away in the history of the US. Granted, I'm a young'in at 24 -- but seriously, have they EVER dropped control of something that they had?

Let's see. Do you remember when the whole Brady Bill thing passed? For several years there going to a gun show was a pain in the ass. I would pick out some nice S&W revolver I wanted to buy, pay my money, fill out the paperwork, and then have to go to the store in question five days later to finally get my gun. Damn "five day cooling off period." That went away. We don't do that around here any more. It takes about 30 seconds to get approval and walk away today.

When I was a kid in the 60's and 70's, I loved to shoot snapping turtles with a .22 rifle. It really used to baffle me how I could buy a 50 round box of .22 LR's at the grocery store but I had to produce ID and fill out the log book. Every damn time I bought .22's. No just taking them up to the cash register at Wal-Mart. Get out the log book. We don't do that any more.

My Dad picked up a Charter Arms .38 Undercover back in 1968 when it seemed like all the guns laws were rolling downhill. He was all happy because he got it in a private sale and "there was no paperwork." He was 100% certain that handguns were going to be outlawed in his lifetime. He's in his 60's now and I'm still buying more. We stopped the tide.

Back in the 1970's, if you went around and asked people if they thought it was likely that CCW laws would "come back" and regular citizens would be able to legally carry a handgun in the majority of states, they would have thought you totally insane. And yet that is what has happened. I really think the victory of the CCW laws is the most important one of all. It goes TOTALLY against the flow of the 1968 efforts toward gun control. Now the state is actually issuing a license to Joe Blow to carry a gun. They are making a de facto statement that a handgun has a legitimate purpose. Major, major victory.

Need more?

Gregg

 

[Valkman]

I think it would be a cold day in hell when when the average joe could purchase a machine gun in the U.S. - it ain't ever going to happen. A stupid law as well as I can, with a decent AR15, put out a lethal curtain of lead using a slick semi-auto that would probably be more effective than a full-auto machine gun.

As SMLE pointed out, it is possible for a "average joe" to buy a MG - and I'm in the process of doing that right now. If you have a clean record and lots of money, then you too can buy one.

I don't think it matters one bit what our reaction is the AWB sunsetting - the anti-gun people have thier agenda and they're going to go forward with it no matter what we do. They WILL propose another AWB, and you can bet it'll be stricter than the last one. Then we'll see who'll vote for it and who won't when they realize they won't get re-elected if they vote for it just like happened with the last one.

 

[Justin]

Hmm.
In The Great American Gun Debate, Ruger, Colt, Smith & Wesson all gave the anti's what they asked for.

And what, exactly, did their compliance with these people get them/us?

Really, name one victory that we derived from that.

Name one victory brought out from the NRA compromising with the antis. Name one.

To imply that they'll somehow leave us alone if we try not to bother them is positively asinine and provably ineffective. The only way to get and win political victories is to speak up and get active.

 

[Diggler]

I guess the Iraqis were wrong to be dancing in the streets after their liberation.

That must have been what brought on Abu Musab al-Zarqawi and his band of al-Qaida terrorists.



The anti-gunners hate what we stand for, no matter if we stick our heads in the sand or not. And they will keep on trying to ban, no matter what our actions are. The more the public sees nonviolent, law-abiding people that have firearms of all types, the more irrelevant Feinstein and her ilk will become.

 

[Foreign Devil]

Given all the defeats we've suffered in the past 10 years how can you now blame gun owners for celebrating this one significant victory?

The anti gunners are dedicated to the destruction of our rights and our silence on the issue will not change that.

The media hype was coming anyway. With wars and hurricanes and terrorism that this idiotic law was still major news for a couple days.

What we should do is to portray ourselves as decent, responsible citizens in front of the media.

 

[hillbilly]

Bad dad brad....I sort of understand your concern.


But I would submit that your fear and your outlook is a large part of what is wrong with many in the shooting community.

Your position sounds a lot like this:

"Oh please, Mr. and Mrs. Political Flunky, please let me have the arms which are my Constitutionally guaranteed right.......I promise I won't get too loud or happy about it. Just please please please don't put me in jail for buying a magazine made after 1994."


Bad dad brad, where would the Civil Rights marchers in 1963 have wound up if they had stuck with the view of "Let's get our rights, but let's be quiet about it so we don't provoke a backlash?"

They would still be quietly suffering under legal apartheid.

Where would we all be if those silly people who made a big stink about higher British taxes had just "played nice" and hadn't illegally vandalized those ships in Boston Harbor?

I mean vandalizing those ships in the harbor might provoke a British backlash, for goodness sakes.

I submit that it might be you, bad dad brad, who needs to change his attitude, not the folks celebrating the end of 10 years of petty tyranny.

hillbilly

 

[Partisan Ranger]

I doubt I will ever own one of the formerly banned weapons. But I think getting a useless so-called 'gun control' law wiped off the books is a major victory and a good precedent for the future.

A steady increase of laws that restrict our rights over the years is the norm. When we actually get rid of one, I think it's worth noting.

 

[El Tejon]

brad, you simply MUST leave Illinois!

Celebrate? Heck, I've been demanding a gun owners march in D.C. for 15 years now.

I'll celebrate my God-given rights with zeal. The antis want to imprison me me if I sit in my house and do nothing.

 

[JohnBT]