Suggestions for accurizing a sporterized 1903?

[Rogue6]

I picked up a sporterized 1903 very cheap. The receiver is drilled for Weaver mounts and the barrel has been shortened, so it's not a candidate for restoration. I thought it might be fun to see what I can do to make it more of a precision rifle without spending TOO much money, and I don't really want to sell it.

The monte carlo - style stock was cracked, so I ordered a synthetic one from Bell & Carlson. Other than that I haven't done anything yet. It has what looks like a commercial safety on it.

Any suggestions? I'm generally interested in WW II C&Rs, so I'm a novice at this.

 

[dirtyjim]

basically all i would do is bed the stock, install a timney trigger then start working up a good load for it.

 

[jimmyraythomason]

Make sure the shortened barrel is cut square and was properly recrowned.

 

[RKRCPA]

Years ago I had one rebarrelled to 22-250, some days I really miss that rifle.

 

[Rogue6]

Okay, I figure I'm going to do glass bedding on the stock. I looked at those Timney triggers and they're pretty reasonably priced, just not sure if it's needed. It's milsurp so it's a two-stage trigger, but after you take up the slack it breaks pretty crisply without too much pull. I might try it with that before putting a commercial trigger on it.

I had one guy tell me to use pillars on the stock, and another tell me that if the barrel is "floated" and it's glassed in pillars are not really necessary. Any thoughts?

Also, what about "fire lapping" the barrel? I'd never heard of that before today but a friend recommended it. Looking it up on the internet it seems to have mixed reviews.

 

[DBR]

RE: fire lapping

Clean the barrel well then shoot some rounds through it. If it shows copper fouling it may benefit from fire lapping.

I have done several rifles and revolvers with NECO's system and the Tubbs Final Finish system. In every case the guns stopped significant fouling. As far as accuracy improvement - it might help.

Fire lapping mostly benefits rough throats and localized rough or tight spots in the barrel. If the barrel has tight spots the bullet gets squeezed as it passes through them and gas leakage as it gets beyond the tight spot can cause some copper fouling.

The other thing fire lapping does is make the finish marks go in the same direction as the bullet travel. In most production barrels there are significant finish marks across the rifling from the drill and in the area of the throat where the freebore blends into the rifling from the chambering reamer.

 

[justashooter in pa]

glass bedding the receiver, especially the recoil lugs, is the best you can do. there should be no pressure from the front of the receiver ring forward. the old test involved sliding a new dollar bill down between the barrel and stock all the way to the receiver ring. in a synthetic stock you may have to relieve the barrel channel slightly, but this is done only after you have bedded the action, for obvious reasons.

headspace should be checked, and locking lugs can be lapped if you have much room to grow headspace. throat should be examined. if significant erosion has occured this is not as bad as a dinged or worn bore at muzzle, but bad enuf.

reloading should be a part of this. factory ammo once fired in this rifle should be neck sized only and used only in this rifle. 168 grain sierra match kings or international match are likely to give you best accuracy. loads can be found in comercial loading manuals. boat tail soft points in 150-165 are very accurate hunting purpose bullets.

 

[dirtyjim]

you can & should use a pillar in the rear but i generally don't bed the tang unless the inletting is sloppy. when i bed the action i bed to the balance point on the barrel which is usually somewhere between 2-4" forward of the receiver depending on the barrel contour. some people bed the whole length of the barrel and some stop at the recoil lug.
my way works for me.

 

[Rogue6]

Thanks for all the suggestions.

And geez, decent scopes are expensive, aren't they?

 

[amlevin]

Here is a 1903A3 (Remington) I just finished

Here is one I just finished. It started as a "Sporterized" rifle with a cut original stock. the barrel has been turned and the receiver had a Lyman 57 sight mounted.

I carved the stock from a blank given me about 25 years ago. The rear of the action is pillar bedded and the entire action is bedded to about the end of the chamber in Devcon 10110. The trigger is stock but has been stoned for smoothness. The sear spring is lighter than original but don't know what the original "smith" used. Feels good at about 4#. The scope is a Center Point 4-16X40 with Illuminated reticle. The stock is designed for my hand and the way I shoot. The forend is sloped on the bottom so when I am on a rest and want to elevate, I just push forward. I can elevate the muzzle a full inch without adjusting the bags or rest. Finish is Tru-Oil




The barrel is the original barrel stamped 10-42. The bore is in great shape although I may lap it to give it a little "shine". The crown is nice and straight with sharp edge where it meets the bore.

Here's a 300 yard 5-shot group after working up a load with 4064 and Nosler 175gr Custom Competition HPBT.


(3/4" ring spacing on this target)


Rogue6-

The accuracy from a rifle like this will come not from a lot of expensive work but patient work. Bedding, stoning, and patience in working up the proper load will yield a rifle that will shoot as well as most "out of the box" hunting rifles.

 

[1KPerDay]

amlevin, is the bolt not installed or did you change out the firing pin/cocking piece?

 

[amlevin]

You have sharp eyes. The bolt is out. I replaced the old '03 a3 bolt with what some call an "A4" bolt that has the low safety that locks the firing pin. Clears the scope nicely.

 

[Bexar]

Years ago I had one rebarrelled to 22-250, some days I really miss that rifle.

There's one on Auction Arms right now.

Bexar

 

[justgoto]

I would get a good scope or sights mounted then work-up a load to see how accurate it is before you start replacing things that might be fine as is.

I accurized this one in 10 shots with an Audette Ladder Test.

 

[Rogue6]

Great advice, but what's an "Audette Ladder Test?"

 

[justgoto]

but what's an "Audette Ladder Test?"

It is a quick method to determine when your barrel muzzle is vibrating the least, with specific cartridge component combination.

Here is what I did with the 03...
******
I loaded 10 cartridges with my preferred powder, each cartridge getting .2gr more powder than the one before it. I started at a mid level charge as to not overloaded the cartridges as I went.

Then I took them out to my 100 yard station since I was using iron sights, (with a scope I take it out to 200 yards.)

I shot each cartridge examining the case for pressure signs, (stop testing if they appear,) then marking the POI on my target as to which shot was what hole.

After shooting, I examined the target looking for consecutive shots that had the closest POI.

There were 3 shots that made a half inch group, so I choose the 2nd load's charge to make 4 cartridges to test, (1 for a fouling shot.) That group was less than a half an inch so I was satisfied there. (One might want to experiment with bullet seating depth afterward to get even better accuracy.)
****

I now have a chronograph and record the velocities to help me choose. At extended ranges, a 30fps velocity spread can result in quite a bit of vertical stringing.

 

[Rogue6]

Still working on it after two re-do's

Again, thanks for the great advice above. So far, I've bedded it (and it took a lot of shaving out that Bell and Carlson stock), had the crown redone and the lugs worked on, and installed a Timney trigger that I tried once at 2.5 lbs and ended up with at 3 lbs (again, a fair amount of shaving - it is not "drop in"). I haven't worked any loads up for it and have just been firing various factory loads with wildly differing performance, and the best has been 1.25 MOA at 100 yards. I think it's probably down to me and the load at this point, although I'm still toying with the idea of fire lapping to see if does anything.

 

[DBR]

See my post #6. If you want more info about my experience with fire lapping PM me.

 

[4v50 Gary]

95% of your accuracy is going to be from your barrel. Get a good barrel to start with and have it assembled by a gunsmith who builds accurate rifles.

Then you can start working on the trigger and stock. It should be done by the same gunsmith.

Then work on the sights. Guess who will be doing that work for you?

 

[triggerman770]

the CMP has Criterion Barrels for the 03. they are a subsidiary of Kreiger.
match grade. I put one on my m-1 and got moa at 100 with irons. not even worked up a load yet

 

[kaferhaus]

Fire lapping isn't going to help your barrel.... forget it.

 

[Rogue6]

CMP doesn't seem to have any more barrels, and they're about $125 to $200 on gunbroker. MidwayUSA has the Criterion barrels but they're over $200. The existing barrel on it actually looks pretty good, in that it's bright and no pitting and the lands and grooves are well defined. My gunsmith thinks its a Douglas(?) replacement barrel but there are no markings on it. Interesting about the different opinions on fire lapping.

 

[10-96]

I'm glad folks brought up barrel replacement and such. The OP never said ( or I never saw it) that the barrel wan't a shot out, seriously throat erroded GI bbl that got shortened. So yeah, I would also like to suggest barrel replacement or milling to set back the shoulder another thread or two. But then setting the bbl back might outweigh the cost of a replacement bbl.

Contact SARCO INC- they tend to have GI replacement bbls on hand. Or, like was said above- check on a Criterion or some of the other bbl manufacturers. You may have to call them direct to see if they can sell you one that is short chambered and pre-threaded.

 

[zkurtb]

Fire lapping isn't going to help your barrel.... forget it.

I ran across the following article that attempts an honest before-and-after test of the Tubbs system of fire lapping on two different rifles. The result was an almost 40% improvement in accuracy (grouping size) in both rifles. Have a look, and let me know whether there are any flaws in the test. To me it sounded solid, and therefore tempting to do on my rifles.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/affordable_accuracy.htm

 

[Liberty1776]

You said you're getting some 1.25" groups? What do you expect to get from an essentially well-bubba'd military rifle? That's way better than original specs...anything much better than what you're getting is going to cost some dollars (new bbl)