The Ashtray Flies Again - 45 Colt

[Byla]

I found a stash of what appears to be 200 gr 45 JHP Speer (#4477) Ashtrays. I believe I bought them for loading 45 Auto Rim back in the 90s. I want to try a few loads for my 45 Colt New Vaquero. I've found published data for Unique: start 8.8 gr., 1.555" @ 940 fps in the Speer #12 manual and loaded up a couple dozen rounds. I have AA#5, Clays, 231 & VV-N350 powders and am looking for published data for a second preferably milder load.

Alternatively, the same Speer manual has 231 at:

260 gr JHP 1.590" 7.2-8.0 grs 725-843 fps
225 gr JHP 1.590" 7.5-8.3 grs 804-870 fps
200 gr L-SWC 1.515" 7.3-8.3 grs 854-998 fps​

And for 45 Colt Ruger Only:

200 gr JHP (bullet I have) 1.555" 10.0-10.5grs 1198-1239 fps​

So I know to stay clear of 10 grs and I need to stay near 1.555" to keep the crimp in the cannelure. It seems something like 7.7-8.5 grs would be reasonable place to try a few rounds.

The only other close data I have seen is for Hornday 200 gr XTP with AA#5 and it is about the same speed as the Unique so I might try a few rounds with it as well.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I have only loaded a 250gr RN and 255gr SWC bullet in the 45 Colt. I used 7.2gr W231 for many years until I tried HS-6 and now that my goto 45 Colt powder.

I think you will like the results you get with AA#5, don't forget the report...

 

[Bfh_auto]

I found a stash of what appears to be 200 gr 45 JHP Speer (#4477) Ashtrays. I believe I bought them for loading 45 Auto Rim back in the 90s. I want to try a few loads for my 45 Colt New Vaquero. I've found published data for Unique: start 8.8 gr., 1.555" @ 940 fps in the Speer #12 manual and loaded up a couple dozen rounds. I have AA#5, Clays, 231 & VV-N350 powders and am looking for published data for a second preferably milder load.

Alternatively, the same Speer manual has 231 at:

260 gr JHP 1.590" 7.2-8.0 grs 725-843 fps
225 gr JHP 1.590" 7.5-8.3 grs 804-870 fps
200 gr L-SWC 1.515" 7.3-8.3 grs 854-998 fps​

And for 45 Colt Ruger Only:

200 gr JHP (bullet I have) 1.555" 10.0-10.5grs 1198-1239 fps​

So I know to stay clear of 10 grs and I need to stay near 1.555" to keep the crimp in the cannelure. It seems something like 7.7-8.5 grs would be reasonable place to try a few rounds.

The only other close data I have seen is for Hornday 200 gr XTP with AA#5 and it is about the same speed as the Unique so I might try a few rounds with it as well.

Lyman 49th shows AA5 starting 10.3@820 max 11.5@913. COAL 1.557 this is an unknown 200 jhp.

 

[Roverguy]

200 grs. And 8.8 Unique should be a recipe for success in any pistol that the bullets are sized to. If not wholly satisfactory, perhaps back it down first to 8.5 and potentially even 8 grs, but should be a winner as is.

 

[cfullgraf]

Back in the day, I loaded some of the 200 grain Speer hollow points. They shot well in my S&W 25-5.

I forget the load, I could look back at my reloading records. I'd use Unique, it works so well in the 45 Colt.

I prefer heavy bullets, 250-255 grain bullets, in 45 Colt but the 200 grain HP's shot well.

 

[25-20 WCF]

I used that bullet in my .45LC BH, killed a few deer with it. The bullet was really too soft for deer at 1150 fps, massive expansion and limited penetration. Nonetheless it killed the deer quickly. Dean Grennell coined the term “flying ashtray” when the old Speer 200 HP #4477 came out in the early 1970s. It had a huge hollowpoint along with a cannelure for crimping in revolvers if desired. It was one of the premier SD bullets in the M1911 for decades, but as more and more manufacturers introduced other .45 auto pistols of differing designs, it was found that the 4477 didn’t feed well in all of them. Too, some of the short barreled .45 pistols had muzzle velocities below the expansion threshold of the flying ashtray. Speer retired the design and introduced the Gold Dot to replace it. Too bad, the older bullet was more accurate in my .45 autos and .45LCs.

 

[mkl]

I've had good luck with the 200 grain lead and 7.5 grains of Unique. Low recoil and acceptable accuracy. Used in Ruger Blackhawk and S&W 25-5.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

The Speer #11 goes lower with Unique:
Start: 8.6gr - Max 9.6gr. 926 - 1031fps.

It doesn't list No.5 or W231/HP38. If you have it, Red Dot makes a good plinking load for the .45 Colt. I only load soft lead for plinking in my 5-1/2" Vaquero but I have loaded the 200gr. XTP with 12gr. of No.5 for close-range vermin control. It's a bullet meant for the .45ACP so it doesn't have a crimping groove but most any bullet for the .45ACP will work fine in the .45Colt with good neck tension. Now, if you plan to hunt with that bullet...