The Big Heller Decision Discussion Thread - AFFIRMED 2ND AS INDIVIDUAL RIGHT

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so when can the people in DC actually take their pistols out of the closet and dig them up in the back yard and rightfully place them next to the nightstand?
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When they go to the DC licensing office and ask for a license for something that they don't have a license for, thus admitting that they are currently in violation of the law and thus subject to prosecution and incarceration.
 
How will this ruling help D.C. residents?

Are there even any gunstores in D.C., since citizens cannot buy handguns across state lines?
 
3. Relationship between Prefatory Clause and
Operative Clause
We reach the question, then: Does the preface fit with
an operative clause that creates an individual right to
keep and bear arms? It fits perfectly, once one knows the
history that the founding generation knew and that we
have described above. That history showed that the way
tyrants had eliminated a militia consisting of all the ablebodied
men was not by banning the militia but simply by
taking away the people’s arms, enabling a select militia or
standing army to suppress political opponents.
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to the Gloom and Doomers.......read the whole opinion first.........

While the ruling does discuss the right to self defense (which is a good thing) it also mentions the other rationale behind a "well regulated militia" above.
 
I haven't read the whole thing yet, but I don't think that's necesarrily what he is saying. In order to get five clean votes, this opinion had to be as narrow as possible. I think he is just making clear that this opinion only applies to complete bans on firearms in common use for self-defense and no more. So far what I've read leaves open the door for additional challenges to broader restrictions.
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Yes, I think we agree. I guess a better way to phrase that would be DOA with THIS Court.

Now the PSA: This was a very narrow ruling by the scantest of majorities. Kennedy will most likely not be the 5th vote for a repeal of 922(o). If you ever want to own a MG, and if you ever want to see a state AWB overturned, you damn well better get your ass out there in November and vote for whoever you think is most likely to appoint the right judges.
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No doubt about this. This ruling is much closer than it should have been. We came closer to getting scalped than I would have thought possible. We really need some new Justices.
 
ctdonath:
DC law does not prohibit its residents from owning weapons outside the district. I know of at least one indoor range in MD that set up a deal where you give them the money for a weapon and they store it for you, it is 'your' weapon, made available to you anytime you want to shoot it at their range or transfer to you upon either the ban being gone or you leaving DC.

Kharn
 
It may be objected that if weapons that are most useful
in military service—M-16 rifles and the like—may be
banned, then the Second Amendment right is completely
detached from the prefatory clause. But as we have said,
the conception of the militia at the time of the Second
Amendment’s ratification was the body of all citizens
capable of military service, who would bring the sorts of
lawful weapons that they possessed at home to militia
duty. It may well be true today that a militia, to be as
effective as militias in the 18th century, would require
sophisticated arms that are highly unusual in society at
large. Indeed, it may be true that no amount of small arms could be useful against modern-day bombers and
tanks. But the fact that modern developments have limited
the degree of fit between the prefatory clause and the
protected right cannot change our interpretation of the
right.
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What's this mean?




Now the PSA: This was a very narrow ruling by the scantest of majorities. Kennedy will most likely not be the 5th vote for a repeal of 922(o). If you ever want to own a MG, and if you ever want to see a state AWB overturned, you damn well better get your ass out there in November and vote for whoever you think is most likely to appoint the right judges.
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So your saying, not to vote for Hilary and Obama?
 
On Foxnews....


Wayne LaPierre just announced that they (NRA) are filing suits in Chicago and its surrounding suburbs today.



-- John
 
^ Excellent. Everyone keep in mind that this case is just the beginning. We'll see a lot of suits being filed around the country over the coming months. The directly relevant ones like that (Chicago) I expect will fall quickly, then we can move on to the 922(o) debate and such.
 
I think this is the fastest growing thread I've ever seen on THR!

The opinion is kind of what I expected. It's not exactly bad, but it's also not what I would have liked.
 
We are way better off now, we have grounds to halt any AWB that might get passed. You could make a court argument to unban the machinegun registry now also.

One step forward.
 
Time to call my sister and BIL to offer them FREE one of my handguns after the Chicago handgun ban dies a miserable death. Hades, I'd even be willing to pay the shipping and FFL fees on both ends.
 
i guess we just need to take baby steps. i think i was rooting for a neil armstrong type step, you know... one giant step for the constitution... if we have to chip at it slowly, i guess i can live with that.
 
We are way better off now, we have grounds to halt any AWB that might get passed. You could make a court argument to unban the machinegun registry now also.

One step forward.
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You apparently didn't read the majority opinion all the way through, did you?

It's a relatively narrowly applied decision. The majority opinion specifically said the 2A in no way allows whatever, wherever, or however possession and use of firearms. You are not even a tiny step forward to getting MGs.

Read the opinion.

K
 
^ The opinion is still unclear. Most of us have read it, and there are portions of it that imply that MGs may be OK (p.58), and they may not be. What is clear is that the court did not decide such a matter, and we're going to have to work on it. No need to get snappy at people over this. How exactly would the statement concerning "whatever, wherever, or however possession and use of firearms" clearly prohibit simply allowing new manufacture MGs to be available, but still subject to NFA requirements? The fact is, we are one step closer to just about everything with this case. That one step may be all we get, but the establishment of an individual right, and the mere mention that individuals may require more advanced weaponry to be as effective as 1700s militia is a good enough sign for now. I doubt that the MG issue will be challenged, much less resolved, in the next decade, but it's a start.
 
Although Heller does not solve all of the problems, it sure provides a stable, definable platform for future legislative measures.

Hooray for Today!:)
 
You apparently didn't read the majority opinion all the way through, did you?

It's a relatively narrowly applied decision. The majority opinion specifically said the 2A in no way allows whatever, wherever, or however possession and use of firearms. You are not even a tiny step forward to getting MGs.

Read the opinion.

K
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True... this is a blow to any hopes of opening the MG registry.



-- John
 
The blitzkrieg is on. The floodgates are open.

D.C. is finally free... Man... I'm 17 and I thought I wasn't going to see the day!

The fight is not over yet... but we have won a major victory that could be the ace in the hole, judicially.

Too bad ol' Chuck wasn't alive for this... God knows he's up there celebrating along with us.
 
jaak:

A better analogy might be a "trip & fall" than a "step". :) That is what sense happend to DC. Heller stuck out a foot and tobbled the clowns. Now, all the clowns following blindly along will trip and fall over the DC case. I love Dominos.

:)

Doc2005
 
You apparently didn't read the majority opinion all the way through, did you?

It's a relatively narrowly applied decision. The majority opinion specifically said the 2A in no way allows whatever, wherever, or however possession and use of firearms. You are not even a tiny step forward to getting MGs.

Read the opinion.

K
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But you have to understand legal writing, nowhere did they say that it dissalowed it in those circumstances either. Everyone is reading too much into the decision.

All we needed:

- Individual right ruling.
- Circuit court's invalidating D.C. Ban affirmed.

Everything else is to be fought in the legislature as usual, or in future cases.
 
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