1911Tuner
Moderator Emeritus
Bigjim asked a question about accuracy in a machine rest versus hand-held.
I responded that it was possible that a pistol with a loose slide to frame fit
could actually be more accurate in the hand than in the rest. Here's why:
The machine rest doesn't move, so the pistol remains static. If the
slide to frame fit isn't dead tight, the slide doesn't return to the same
alignment between shots, and the only way to return to the same point of
aim is to reaim for each shot by shifting the whole set-up.
When the same pistol is fired in the hand of a good marksman, he realigns
the sights for each shot. If the barrel and slide have a good fit, he can
outshoot the machine rest, assuming that his marksmanship skills are up to the task. Look at a scope mounted on a rifle receiver. As the rifle
heats up, the barrel flexes and changes its position in relation to the
scope. The scope is static on the receiver. Even though the same sight picture is taken...same spot weld...same everything...the barrel's position
is the wild card.
Now...Mount the scope on the barrel. When the barrel index changes, the scope moves with it, so that when the cross hairs are realigned, the scope is indexed to the barrel instead of the receiver. Where the barrel points. the scope looks. Back to the pistol in question. Where the sights go, so goeth the slide and barrel.
Now then...How much accuracy is needed? The dictum is that if the shooter
can hit the target with the weapon at the range at which the target is engaged, it's accurate enough.
With a bullseye pistol, all the potential accuracy that can be wrung out of the gun is highly desired to eliminate any variable that can be eliminated,
and the rest is up to the shooter. These guns have a singular purpose,
and that is the target range. If a malfunction occurs due to the gun being
accurized, nothing is lost...nothing critical anyway.
A pistol that is carried for serious purpose has a different set of criteria. First and foremost, it must function. Whether or not the perfect grip is obtained...dirty or clean...hot or cold...Going bang is paramount. MAXIMUM
accuracy and dead reliability don't often go hand-in-hand. Not that very
good accuracy and functional reliability is beyond our reach...just that the maximum in both is very unlikely, if not impossible.
In a carry pistol, I give accuracy only a passing interest. As long as I
can keep my offhand shots in a 5-inch circle at 25 yards, the pistol is
fully up to the task at hand. That's a pretty loose accuracy requirement, and most pistols can meet that, if we discount the ones that are worn out or absolute junk. If we bear in mind that in any defensive shooting that we are likely to get into, the ranges and the time frames are going to be very short. There will not be time to get the perfect grip, stance, or sight picture...if we even have the time to get a sight picture at all beyond the "Flash Sight Picture"...and sometimes not even that. 21 feet. That's the average MAXIMUM distance, and most fall well below that.
If we have a pistol with an intrinsic accuracy potential of 6 inches at
25 yards, and fire a group at a third of that distance...which is past the
21-foot maximum...we have a 2-inch group. Bring it down to the real-world
range that you will likely have to pull the trigger, and you will have one
ragged hole in a 7-shot cluster, assuming that you do your part. Accurate
enough? I think so. Even a pistol that will do no better than 10 inches at 25 yards will save your hide on the street.
Functional reliability is something that I am fanatic over, because I don't
own a bullseye pistol, and don't play the bullseye game. ALL my pistols
are potentially defensive tools. Some are very accurate, considering that
they have been enhanced in that area only lightly. Some are unimpressive
on paper, even from a sandbag rest...but all will perform well enough in
their intended role that I would carry any one of them....because they all
work. The worst one that I own will function reliably up to about the
1,000 round mark without cleaning or oiling. Most will go past 2,000.
When a pistol is tightly fitted for accuracy, it may work very well when
it's clean, cold, and well-oiled. Heat, powder fouling, and accumulated
lint and dust after a week under a sweatshirt or coat will make for a
very different pistol. Body temperature affects it to some degree. Oil
seeps downward and out of the rails and locking lugs. Lint and dust
find a way into the works...and the squeaky clean pistol that you strapped
on first thing Monday morning is a different animal by Saturday night.
I don't want a rattle-trap, but I do want enough clearance in everything
that moves or affects function for the stuff to go. I've had the privelege
to handle and shoot a few pre WW2 commercial and GI issue pistols. The
side play in the slides were barely discernable, and if oil was applied lightly,
none could be readily detected. Vertical play in the barrel was likewise
virtually nil, if any was present at all...which it wasn't in most of them.
These pistols were more accurate than I could prove without a sandbag under my wrists...and they functioned perfectly, even when heated up
during the session....even when the rails were dry. How does a 25-yard
group of slightly more than 2 inches strike you from offhand using Federal
Match ammo? Admittedly, it was one of my better days, but the potential was there. A Master could better that group.
How accurate is accurate enough?
Food for thought...
Tuner
I responded that it was possible that a pistol with a loose slide to frame fit
could actually be more accurate in the hand than in the rest. Here's why:
The machine rest doesn't move, so the pistol remains static. If the
slide to frame fit isn't dead tight, the slide doesn't return to the same
alignment between shots, and the only way to return to the same point of
aim is to reaim for each shot by shifting the whole set-up.
When the same pistol is fired in the hand of a good marksman, he realigns
the sights for each shot. If the barrel and slide have a good fit, he can
outshoot the machine rest, assuming that his marksmanship skills are up to the task. Look at a scope mounted on a rifle receiver. As the rifle
heats up, the barrel flexes and changes its position in relation to the
scope. The scope is static on the receiver. Even though the same sight picture is taken...same spot weld...same everything...the barrel's position
is the wild card.
Now...Mount the scope on the barrel. When the barrel index changes, the scope moves with it, so that when the cross hairs are realigned, the scope is indexed to the barrel instead of the receiver. Where the barrel points. the scope looks. Back to the pistol in question. Where the sights go, so goeth the slide and barrel.
Now then...How much accuracy is needed? The dictum is that if the shooter
can hit the target with the weapon at the range at which the target is engaged, it's accurate enough.
With a bullseye pistol, all the potential accuracy that can be wrung out of the gun is highly desired to eliminate any variable that can be eliminated,
and the rest is up to the shooter. These guns have a singular purpose,
and that is the target range. If a malfunction occurs due to the gun being
accurized, nothing is lost...nothing critical anyway.
A pistol that is carried for serious purpose has a different set of criteria. First and foremost, it must function. Whether or not the perfect grip is obtained...dirty or clean...hot or cold...Going bang is paramount. MAXIMUM
accuracy and dead reliability don't often go hand-in-hand. Not that very
good accuracy and functional reliability is beyond our reach...just that the maximum in both is very unlikely, if not impossible.
In a carry pistol, I give accuracy only a passing interest. As long as I
can keep my offhand shots in a 5-inch circle at 25 yards, the pistol is
fully up to the task at hand. That's a pretty loose accuracy requirement, and most pistols can meet that, if we discount the ones that are worn out or absolute junk. If we bear in mind that in any defensive shooting that we are likely to get into, the ranges and the time frames are going to be very short. There will not be time to get the perfect grip, stance, or sight picture...if we even have the time to get a sight picture at all beyond the "Flash Sight Picture"...and sometimes not even that. 21 feet. That's the average MAXIMUM distance, and most fall well below that.
If we have a pistol with an intrinsic accuracy potential of 6 inches at
25 yards, and fire a group at a third of that distance...which is past the
21-foot maximum...we have a 2-inch group. Bring it down to the real-world
range that you will likely have to pull the trigger, and you will have one
ragged hole in a 7-shot cluster, assuming that you do your part. Accurate
enough? I think so. Even a pistol that will do no better than 10 inches at 25 yards will save your hide on the street.
Functional reliability is something that I am fanatic over, because I don't
own a bullseye pistol, and don't play the bullseye game. ALL my pistols
are potentially defensive tools. Some are very accurate, considering that
they have been enhanced in that area only lightly. Some are unimpressive
on paper, even from a sandbag rest...but all will perform well enough in
their intended role that I would carry any one of them....because they all
work. The worst one that I own will function reliably up to about the
1,000 round mark without cleaning or oiling. Most will go past 2,000.
When a pistol is tightly fitted for accuracy, it may work very well when
it's clean, cold, and well-oiled. Heat, powder fouling, and accumulated
lint and dust after a week under a sweatshirt or coat will make for a
very different pistol. Body temperature affects it to some degree. Oil
seeps downward and out of the rails and locking lugs. Lint and dust
find a way into the works...and the squeaky clean pistol that you strapped
on first thing Monday morning is a different animal by Saturday night.
I don't want a rattle-trap, but I do want enough clearance in everything
that moves or affects function for the stuff to go. I've had the privelege
to handle and shoot a few pre WW2 commercial and GI issue pistols. The
side play in the slides were barely discernable, and if oil was applied lightly,
none could be readily detected. Vertical play in the barrel was likewise
virtually nil, if any was present at all...which it wasn't in most of them.
These pistols were more accurate than I could prove without a sandbag under my wrists...and they functioned perfectly, even when heated up
during the session....even when the rails were dry. How does a 25-yard
group of slightly more than 2 inches strike you from offhand using Federal
Match ammo? Admittedly, it was one of my better days, but the potential was there. A Master could better that group.
How accurate is accurate enough?
Food for thought...
Tuner
