Thoughts on Turkish made shotguns?

Discussion in 'Shotguns' started by TacticalChurchill, May 5, 2021.

  1. TacticalChurchill

    TacticalChurchill Member

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    Hi everyone, new to the forum. I hope everyone is doing well today.

    I wanted to start a discussion on Turkish made firearms, specifically the shotguns that have been so abundant as of late. I was hoping to hear some informed opinions and have some experiences shared in relation to these firearms. I've seen a lot of disdain for these no-name Turkish made shotguns around the internet and I wonder to myself if the people that bash them have actually owned one or if they are simply just subscribing to the theory of others for the purpose of riding the negative bandwagon simply for the sake of it.

    I personally just purchased an Akkar Churchill 612 (imported by EAA) and so far it has been great. It is the same shotgun as the CZ 612 which seems to have gotten a slight bit of attention years ago. I purchased it as a bedside gun and plan to take it down to the range once every 2-3 months and put a box or two of shells through it.

    So, my personal opinion thus far is that it is solid for what I paid. In other words, a decent gun for the money. Is it the same quality as a Remington 870 or Mossberg 5xx - no, surely not. But for what it is I feel like it's just fine. I look forward to hearing the opinion of others here on this forum. Thank you!
     
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  2. mac66

    mac66 Member

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    Turkish shotguns aren't terrible. Shotguns aren't rocket science, they are pretty basic tools. I bought a couple basic Dickinson marine 12 ga shotguns a couple years ago because they were dirt cheap i.,e $120. I bought one and like it so much, I bought the second one. They worked well. I keep one up at my cabin and sold the other last fall for twice what I paid for it.
     
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  3. George P

    George P Member

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    I own a S&W Elite Gold, which was the forerunner of the Dickinson from Cabela's. A 20 bore with English stock, double trigger, fixed IC/M and a splinter forearm - all of the attributes of a TRUE SxS (;)), mine has been flawless. True Dickson style trigger plate action, deep high gloss bluing, true bone and charcoal case coloring/hardening, machine-turned internals, simple white small bead it may not be a Purdey, but then, at the closeout price of $1200, I'm not concerned taking it afield. made by AKUS whom many consider to be the Purdey of Turkish shotguns as to high quality, it is my favorite bird gun.
     
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  4. Kano383

    Kano383 Member

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    Turkish firearms are made on state-of-the-art CNC machines, with the same materials and processes as US firearms. I have visited factories that would put to shame some good ol' US names, with QC directly issued from the aviation industry (one particular factory produces rocket and aircraft components besides guns...).

    Several Mossberg models are actually made in Turkey...
     
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  5. George P

    George P Member

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    Beretta and many other major makers have either parts or even complete guns made there (and elsewhere other than their native country)
     
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  6. JCooperfan1911

    JCooperfan1911 Member

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    I hope they’re side by side guns made for CZ are good. I am buying one of their Sharptails Coach guns soon. Virtually no information on the boards about them and only a few magazine articles (which I don’t really trust as reliable sources of info). Time will tell.
     
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  7. TacticalChurchill

    TacticalChurchill Member

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    Yes, this is actually what I noticed as well. The common response I see to this is "Turkish made shotguns that are overseen by known names are fine, but the no-name ones are trash." What are your thoughts on this?
     
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  8. TacticalChurchill

    TacticalChurchill Member

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    This is essentially what I am doing. Albeit with a little less of a purchase, instead of just nodding in agreement I am trying one out for myself without a ton of information out there on them. I hope your purchase works out well for you.
     
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  9. George P

    George P Member

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    Those are made by Huglu who is a decent mid-level (quality) and will work great for hunting.
     
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  10. JCooperfan1911

    JCooperfan1911 Member

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    Thank you. All I’m hoping is it doesn’t wear out or break in little time, and doesn’t double fire on me when shooting buckshot. Ouch.

    Other than that for a working man’s side by side there’s little else. Some various Chinese shotguns and the Stoeger Brazilian guns, but I would have to imagine the CZ/Huglu product is at least somewhat superior to them?
     
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  11. cdb1

    cdb1 Member

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    We have three Turkish made semi-auto shotguns in the family. I’ve been very pleased with them.
     
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  12. George P

    George P Member

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    Try some of the SxS guns from AKUS and similar; you'll like them
     
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  13. Ohen Cepel
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    Ohen Cepel Contributing Member

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    It is about like asking "how are US made shotguns"? Importers go there and ask for a $500 price point gun and they get a good gun at that price point, which they then sell for $X. If they ask for a $5,000 gun it will of course be much better, MUCH better, but then it will sell for much more.

    I think they can be buys and a good value. I have several and have no complaints for the price point I got them at.
     
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  14. ColoradoMinuteMan

    ColoradoMinuteMan Member

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    I haven't seen them all but all the Weatherby guns I have seen coming out of Turkey are really nice from over under to semi automatics. I believe the Stoegers are coming from Turkey as well and they seem to be good operators.
     
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  15. entropy

    entropy Member

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    Tell me that when your Tri-Star TT-15 is on 100,000 rounds. George P., how many rounds does your Citori have through it?

    There are some decent Turkish shotguns, CZ (Huglu), Weatherby, AKUS (agreed -the best Turkish made)and Stevens among them. and almost all of them are good enough for light to moderate use; great for the guy who wants an O/U for a couple rounds of Sporting clays and a couple boxes through it in the field. And Turkey is reknown for great looking wood. To suggest any Turkish gun will hold up like a Ljutic or Kolar (two top quality US shotgun manufacturers) to thousands of rounds of Trap, Skeet, or Sporting Clays a year like these guns will, without a hiccup, is absurd.

    The pumps are ugly, crude, and inexpensive, but they are solidly built, and good values. Like the Op said, they aren't an 870 or 590, but they work.

    The semi autos are either clones of the Beretta a300, and are pretty decent guns, or are inertia guns, which inherit the same problems more expensive inertia guns have.
     
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  16. George P

    George P Member

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    My Gti was "retired" at 350K, my Beretta A400 semi just passed 35K, my Browning Ultra XS 20 has 15K (I don't shoot it much and it showed at a subgauge FITASC event)
     
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  17. George P

    George P Member

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    BUT I still love my AKUS SxS for field work; it will see maybe 100 rounds in the field and another 400 on the skeet/5-stand field a year. I expect it to last at that rate.
     
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  18. whatnickname

    whatnickname Member

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    The firearms industry in Turkey has undergone a metamorphosis over the past 20 or so years. What was once a cottage industry where steel was soft, and many parts made by hand, has become high- tech and extremely sophisticated. Back 50 years ago if you got paid a fixed price for making sears you used soft steel so you could make more sears. Quality suffered accordingly.

    In my opinion, the Turkish firearms industry has the skill and ability to manufacture guns that are very high quality. The issue as I see it is a legacy issue of sorts. The Turks have the ability to make every bit as good a gun as Perazzi for example. The issue is who is going to pay Perazzi prices for a Turkish shotgun, regardless of how well it’s made? The answer is probably no one. For this reason the Turkish firearms industry seems to have concentrated on lower end guns, many of which are in the $500 to $2000 range. Simply put, they’re an excellent value for the money. I own a Mossberg O/U in 410 gauge. Cost me about $700 out the door at Gander Mountain. It’s not on par with a Browning or a Beretta but it’s what I will call a good, utility grade shotgun. It does what I want it to do.
     
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  19. Offhand McFlan

    Offhand McFlan Member

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    They SEEM nice, but...syphillis and gonhorrea will not help us defeat the Axis powers!

    No, seriously...! They seem very well made...but the only accidental discharge I ever had was with a Turkish made 870 clone. I read a post where another guy had EXACTLY the same experience with the same model. I immediately sold that gun. It just seemed too touchy to me.

    However, that was my only experience with Turkish shotguns. I think I'd buy another, but maybe just opt for a different make or model. The gun in question seemed very sensitive. Turkey produces a helluva lot of shotguns, and other types of firearms as well. Overall they get very good reviews, and being that Turkey produces so many firearms I would expect they'd have bad apples just like any other ballpark.

    Probably there's there's a tongue-in-cheek caveat to be minded, that clones need to be purchased with caution and research. Its a potential weak spot when manufacturers loosely follow a proven design. Not always but frequently. If you look at the CZ75 clones made by Tristar, they have got excellent reviews and some aficionados say the clones are actually better made than the originals.

    Turkey generally makes good firearms. There are some exceptions, and reliable data on those exceptions may be somewhat vague, obtuse and difficult to foresee because of the language barrier, geographic distance, etc. Turkey provides arms for LEO in other countries besides just commercially in the U.S.. Through those avenues alot of data is lost. One bad example in the U.S.may stand out more than it should.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2021
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  20. Ru4real

    Ru4real Member

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    For hunting and occasional trap, Tri-Star makes a good shotgun. Customer service was on par with Ruger for my one customer service experience.

    For a dedicated sport gun, trap, clays, etc there are much better choices.
     
  21. SterlingBullet

    SterlingBullet Member

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    The store I work has has sold a lot of Turkish shotguns since last spring. The owner decided to carry a number of imported Turkish guns because brands like Mossbergs, Remingtons, Brownings and Benellis were simply not available from national firearms wholesalers. Out of the hundreds we have sold, we have had two complaints. In the first case, the importer replaced the firearm; in the second case, the owner did not read the instruction manual on how to properly operate the action.
    In regards to Turkish pistols, the machining of the frames, slides, hammers, triggers, safeties and other parts seem to be as good, and maybe even better, than some of the major US manufacturers. The close fittings and tolerances are superb. One manufacturer, Canik, likely has the best out-of-the-box triggers of ALL manufacturers.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2021
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  22. DocRock

    DocRock Member

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    It’s a mixed bag. The Turks today are like the Eibar manufacturers in Spain 40 years ago. Some of them make some very nice guns. And some of them make rubbish. And there’s rather a lot in between.

    I have yet to see a quality, robust o/u from a Turkish maker that will handle high volume. In fact, I have not seen a single gun of any variety from the Turks that would qualify as a high volume target gun. They make some very nice field SxS. I have an S&W Elite Gold and a matching Dickinson in 12 bore. Very nice field guns. Some of the Huglu made CZ guns are very nice looking for the money, especially the wood. Clearly, for the money, some the semis are pretty good.

    But they are still building to price points. Have you seen some of the rubbish from Khan and whoever makes some of the ATI stuff. I have seen some semis that I would not care to shoot. And while this will no doubt offend those who think their $300 Yildiz SxS is a quality gun, it is not.

    So, there’s nothing wrong with guns being made in Turkey. And they definitely offer value for money. But if it costs nothing, that’s because it’s rubbish. Not because that is all the Turks can make, but because that is all they can make for nothing.

    A clarification on the Spanish comparison. While the Turks play a similar role to the Spanish in the 70s, their quality is far better. A single selective trigger on a Sears branded “Matador” was a recipe for doubling in a couple of hundred rounds. A cheap Turkish gun today will be better made and hold up better than a cheap Spanish gun from 1974. But in each case, the makers built to a price point.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2021
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  23. Kano383

    Kano383 Member

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    Khan Arms, the factory making guns for Mossberg is not "overseen" by Mossberg... They produce a wide array of shotguns, and just a few for Mossberg - these are made on the same machines, by the same people, and with the same quality as any of their own models.

    Canik makes guns that have withstood durability tests against Glock, and part of their business it to produce aerospace components. They make almost everything in-house, including barrels, and their QC room is a temperature-controlled enclosure with the latest CNC probes, specialized microscopes, and test equipment.

    Manufacturing has evolved tremendously in the last thirty years, and old-fashioned dusty shops where artisans mass-produced guns that depended on their personal skills, with tooling that could be antiquated or worn out, are long gone.
     
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  24. LoonWulf
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    LoonWulf Contributing Member

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    My FFL buddy just brought in a 612 for me. Im looking forward to seeing how it handles. I doubt ill put enough ammo thru it to ware it out.....ever.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2021
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  25. MEHavey

    MEHavey Member

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    Where would you put TriStar/Armsan in that mix?

    (For the record I have multiple Model-12s, ditto Rem 1100s and 870s (Express & Wing), an early Miroku/Browning Citori, another Finnish "Lion" O/U, more Ithaca-37s, a couple of Berettas (Pigeon & 6xx)...

    ...and a little Tristar Viper at the tail-end of that list that..... "ain't bad" ) :thumbup:
    https://tsswarehouse.com/wp-content/uploads/imp/3/5/4/6/0/6/354606.jpg
    (for less than $500, in fact, it's incredible)
    :what:
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2021
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