I have an original "Thunderer" that has been giving me some of the trouble it has reputation for. It seems to be in rather good shape (photos); I did buy some new parts (springs, cylinder stop, etc); I have been working with it, looking at diagrams, trying to find videos on-line etc. Basically all the parts are there and I can disassemble and re-assemble it without too much trouble now, but the cylinder stop does not kick in properly and there are a few other problems as well. Over-all we (my shop buddies and I) have hit a bit of a brick wall with it and I'd like to ask a few specific questions of someone who is familiar with this type of pistol.
Thunderer (Colt .41 double action)
- Thread starter Pinzelmeister
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It looks like the cam on the trigger is not engaging the cylinder stop. I suspect that the stop is a repro part. They are always too thick and not flexible enough because they are cast rather than machined from spring steel like they were originally. If that is what is wrong, you will have to start filling it down on the outside to thin it until it has enough spring to engage the cam. You might also have to "tune" it by tapping that arm inward until it engages properly. Then you should file the arm on the top to better slip over the cam. It looks like you could take some off the cam so it does not strain the stop too much, a trick often used on the SAA hammer cam as well.
I will warn that what I suggest above could very well result in a broken cylinder stop if you get impatient or the part just breaks. It is a good idea to have a spare or two.
Jim
I will warn that what I suggest above could very well result in a broken cylinder stop if you get impatient or the part just breaks. It is a good idea to have a spare or two.
Jim
The stop is definitely a "repro" part, and we have been working with it gently. And yes, that's correct, it is definitely not engaging properly. It's really not clear what the "cam" is supposed to be doing, since it's so hard to find support material (eg videos or something showing how the mechanism is supposed to work). But right, it's not engaging the stop. I think the little double spring (#36 on most diagrams) is supposed to push the stop into place, but that is definitely not happening. Anyway thanks a lot for the comments.
We did fix an old SAA (1873) recently, that was easy compared to this.
We did fix an old SAA (1873) recently, that was easy compared to this.
The cam pushes up on the bottom of the "L" cylinder stop. That moves the upper part back out of the cylinder notch, freeing the cylinder to turn. When the cam clears the end of the cylinder stop, the stop snaps down, and the upper part drops on the cylinder in time to engage the next stop notch. (There are no leades in the 1877 cylinder.)
When the trigger is released, it returns under pressure from its spring. The cam rides down under the cylinder stop, pushing the bottom arm outward. When the trigger reaches its forward position, the cylinder stop snaps back in on top of the cam, ready for the next shot.
Jim
When the trigger is released, it returns under pressure from its spring. The cam rides down under the cylinder stop, pushing the bottom arm outward. When the trigger reaches its forward position, the cylinder stop snaps back in on top of the cam, ready for the next shot.
Jim
+1!!
I went through that over and over again about 40 years ago when I was still young enough to be a pretty good gunsmith.
After about 7 tries, I could get one part to work, and while I was doing that?
Another part would break.
What you need to do is expend the effort on building a nice shadow box and hang it on the wall to look at.
That's what I finally did with mine.
Rumor has it:
Colt only had one guy that could make them work.
And his scrap bin took two janitors to lift and haul out and dump it every night after work.
rc
I went through that over and over again about 40 years ago when I was still young enough to be a pretty good gunsmith.
After about 7 tries, I could get one part to work, and while I was doing that?
Another part would break.
What you need to do is expend the effort on building a nice shadow box and hang it on the wall to look at.
That's what I finally did with mine.
Rumor has it:
Colt only had one guy that could make them work.
And his scrap bin took two janitors to lift and haul out and dump it every night after work.
rc
brushhippie
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What year was that thing manufactured Pinzel? I guess I am lucky mine has not given me any trouble.....I love the thing....its a peppy little gun for sure....I have a feeling the goon will be getting it eventually.
Looks like a sheriff's/storekeeper's model without provision for an extractor rod.
If so, treat it nice, it is one of the less common versions.
If so, treat it nice, it is one of the less common versions.
brushhippie
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JohnnyCremains
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There's a guy named Sal Lanara that fixes 1877s and 1878s if you can't get it. He and his brother run this place:
http://davelanara.homestead.com/
You can find a thread where he advises me on the coltforum about troubles I had with one. I couldn't get it working 100% correctly so I sold it.
But here is the thread:
http://www.coltforum.com/forums/col...1877-lightning-little-more-success-today.html
http://davelanara.homestead.com/
You can find a thread where he advises me on the coltforum about troubles I had with one. I couldn't get it working 100% correctly so I sold it.
But here is the thread:
http://www.coltforum.com/forums/col...1877-lightning-little-more-success-today.html
The dates on the frame are 1871 1874 1875.
Anyway here are closeups of some of the parts. Come to think of it, all these parts are "repro" so it's not surprising it needs a bit of fine tuning. Specifically: the cylinder stop: it seems we need to file that down a bit so it has more room to do its thing - i.e. it seems very tight at the moment. I'm also wondering if it needs more of a notch for the spring to engage (red arrows).
Anyway here are closeups of some of the parts. Come to think of it, all these parts are "repro" so it's not surprising it needs a bit of fine tuning. Specifically: the cylinder stop: it seems we need to file that down a bit so it has more room to do its thing - i.e. it seems very tight at the moment. I'm also wondering if it needs more of a notch for the spring to engage (red arrows).
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brushhippie
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The dates are patent dates...no big just curious....this site will tell you by serial number when yours was manufactured...if you care to know.
http://coltparts.com/Dates_of_Mfg.html
http://coltparts.com/Dates_of_Mfg.html
Thanks for the serial # link. I was travelling and just now got a chance to look at it. The answer seems to be 1893.
brushhippie
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Nice....yours is older than mine...mine is a 1897!...Love the old stuff! I am lucky I guess...mine functions perfectly. Good luck with your repairs, I have really enjoyed mine.
RC's right on.............like an old friend of mine so pointedly stated, he'd never seen an old Smith OUT of time, nor an old Colt in!!!
Any chance someone with a working Thunderer could do a short video? With a focus on the stop/sear/related springs: take it apart, show how the parts look in a functional gun, put back together. This would such a service to the universe in my opinion.
I did look on You Tube. For example, there's a guy who shows a nice view of the parts but claims he has no idea how they go together. I'd make the video myself if we ever get this one working.
I did look on You Tube. For example, there's a guy who shows a nice view of the parts but claims he has no idea how they go together. I'd make the video myself if we ever get this one working.
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