Titegroup & 45ACP velocity too high

[wrknhrd2]

I loaded some 45ACP and the velocities seem unusually high, looking for any feedback or if anyone else has noticed the same phenomenon.
The rounds were made using Hornady load data. Shot out of a TRP 1911
Missouri Bullet Co 230g LRN, Titegroup 4.5g, CCI LP primers
OAL 1.245, Lee factory crimp die.
My velocities 2 tests, 10 rounds each
Winchester brass 873 fps ave
R-P brass 872 fps ave
Hornady lists 800 fps with 4.6 g titegroup, and 850 fps with 5.0 g. both lower than my velocities. I confirmed my powder charge and OAL, I am wondering if the LEE FCD could cause this difference ?? Thanks for feedback

 

[ljnowell]

What gun and barrel length where the test loads in the manual shot from? I've seen 50 fps variance from gun to gun without a problem.

 

[wrknhrd2]

Springfield TRP 5" barrel, maybe I am overly "concerned" over normal variations ??

 

[Havok7416]

I wouldn't worry about what amounts to a small difference in velocity like that. The book is not always spot on depending on the gun and other potential variables.

 

[BigBore45]

its because its a lead bullet. they are faster than copper jacketed most of the time.

 

[Archie]

Not unusual

The velocities you list (872 - 873) are close to the data specified in the U. S. Army Field Manual listing small arms velocities. So if they shoot properly (function and accuracy), I would leave well enough alone.

The danger sign is when the measured velocities are radically greater than what you expected. Since the 'expected' velocity (per your loading manual) is 800 fps, you are getting about 9 % more than 'expected'. That doesn't strike me as a 'serious' overload. On the other hand, I would NOT increase that load, either. The results - in terms of velocity only - are just what you want. Does this lot of ammunition seem to be hotter than normal? Cases ejected much further than normal? Cases bulged or otherwise beat up? Recoil or muzzle blast out of line, so to speak?

Others have given reasons for the difference in velocity. The very short reason for the difference is you were not shooting the same pistol, with the same lot of ammunition fired, on the same day with the same climatic conditions (temperature, humidity and so forth) as the testing recorded in the manual.

Your use of the Lee FCD could be a variable. So could the use of bullet. As BigBore said, lead typically shoots faster. Other variables may be the actual bore diameter difference between your pistol and the test device. Or the lot of powder. Or the weather.

If it's any comfort I have a collection of fifteen or so pistols in .32 ACP. I have fired all of them with the same lot of commercially (factory) loaded ammunition, chronographing the results. All of them have close to the same barrel length; ranging from almost 4.5 inches to about 3.3 inches. Velocities (average) range from 860 fps to 666 fps. Skipping a lot of pointless detail, the velocities do NOT match up with the barrel lengths in all cases. I have noted the fastest shooting pistol has the tightest chamber.

The advertised velocity of this ammunition is 900 fps. So nothing ever exactly matches up as expected. Getting close is all one can expect.

 

[Slamfire]

I wouldn't worry about what amounts to a small difference in velocity like that. The book is not always spot on depending on the gun and other potential variables.

Agree, the loading manual should be viewed as a guide. You are using different equipment, powder lot, primer lot, and bullets.

I try to keep my hardball equivalent ammunition just at 800 fps. I have chronographed factory ammunition that was closer to 900 fps, but I don't want to beat up my pistol or my self. I have created ammunition with 230 LRN bullets that functioned the pistol, down around 650 fps. So it sort of depends what you are looking for.

The more you test, the more you will see slight differences. It is the huge differences that should cause concern.

 

[Hondo 60]

As long as you're not seeing over pressure signs I wouldn't worry.
Your data is essentially the same as mine.

Things to watch:
very flat primers
sticky extraction or cases stuck in the barrel

Others can chime in on more things to watch.

 

[wrknhrd2]

Ok, I feel better hearing from more experienced reloaders, and I learned a few new things like lead shoots faster (thanks BigBore) and same load can have velocities vary over a fairly wide range even with guns having same barrel lengths (thanks Archie). So much yet to learn !!

 

[243winxb]

230 gr maximum load at Hodgdon. Titegroup

Lead 4.8 - 855 fps.

Full metal jacket 4.8 -818fps 5" barrels.

 

[BigBore45]

your welcome. And also welcome to THR. 243winxb got ya on track there. your real close to the book now.


here is a helpful link for hodgdon powder Winchester powder and imr powder: http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/

 

[Hondo 60]

Oh, ya, welcome to the addic .. oh, I mean hobby
Ya, that's it hobby!

 

[Toprudder]

As long as you're not seeing over pressure signs I wouldn't worry.
Your data is essentially the same as mine.

Things to watch:
very flat primers
sticky extraction or cases stuck in the barrel

Others can chime in on more things to watch.

I believe that by the time you have flattened primers in 45acp, you are long past the point of going over pressure. 45acp is a low pressure round.

Ken Waters, in his "Pet Loads" book talks about measuring the case expansion of factory ammo in a given gun, and use that as a benchmark for max pressure. If I were to try a powder for max pressure, that is what I would do. As it is, I go by published data and chrono my ladder loads. If I reach a higher than expected velocity, I stop.

Some people will watch for how far the cases eject. Again, use factory ammo as a benchmark. I'm not sure, though, that all powders for a given pressure will eject the cases the same distance. I expect some fast powders - which will give lower velocity for a given pressure - won't eject cases as far for a given max pressure.