U.s. Lf&c 1917

[content]

Hello friends and neighbors,, recently picked up a triangular bladed, U.S. LF&C, 1917, Trench knife.

I need a scabbard, if you know of a better than average source plz let me know.

Also wondering on the legality of using this knife for HD.

Thanks,, content

 

[rcmodel]

This company makes an accurate reproduction sheath.

http://www.pflco.com/militaria.htm#scabbard

It is very unlikely you will ever find an original WWI sheath without a knife already in it.

Using it for HD should present no problems.
It would seem to be no different then grabbing a kitchen knife, claw hammer, or baseball bat if that's what you had close at hand in your home.

I would not recommend carrying it out in public though.

rc

 

[content]

TY RC my thoughts exactly,,, plz tell me this is your nightstand knife!

So far repro.is all I've found but I'll keep looking.

 

[hso]

Why would you want to use a collectable piece of militaria for HD when there are plenty of repros or better modern options?

 

[content]

Are the repros better quality?

 

[content]

The reason I ask is my current HD knife choices are the:

Eickhorn Solingen (Germany) Sykes Fairbairn Dagger 6 1/2"+ (with aluminum alloy handle)

One I consider a quality "repro" ( I did put grip tape on the hilt)

and the:

Fame Chile, made ,,,,Chilean Military Corvo.....12" blade

Not an original field knife but Military grade and high quality IMHO.
(looked over the C.Military site, watched the one you tube vid but would very much like to find training vids or info for using the Corvo)

At present I prefer the hammer hold for both, striking low, serrated edge up with the Sykes, curved edge up with the Corvo.

The 1917 is my first with knuckle capabilities.
Sadly I have yet to look up the MoA of this one.

Thanks for any tips/interest

 

[AlexanderA]

What's all this about using knives for HD? Seems like they would be worse than nothing, if (as is likely) the intruder is armed with a firearm. (He would shoot a knife-armed homeowner for sure, whereas he might not shoot someone who was not presenting a threat to him.) Get a gun. Or, failing that, get strong locks, strong doors, good lights, etc. Even a baseball bat would be preferable to a knife.

 

[Sam1911]

Can't say as I've ever considered having a "home defense" knife. Why would I ever want to get that close to a home invader? If I have time to reach for a weapon, it will be a GUN.

 

[content]

what is your last resort weapon....gun as hammer....a bandana and a Corvo can be quite effective my friend.

 

[Sam1911]

My last resort weapon? Probably the 11th round on the shotgun, and then using the shotgun as a club. (I'd rather have a 36" long swinging bashing weapon than a "c'mere and let me poke you" weapon...)

I don't imagine a scenario where a) I haven't solved the problem after 11 rounds of buck and slug, and b) I go lay hands on another weapon, and c) that other weapon isn't ALSO a gun.

 

[content]

Not to get too far from Non firearm weapons into tactics.
In my limited experience,,, (no real life, armed attacks) I would be better served, at in room distances(my house is not very large), to have a quality blade available if both my guns jam/misfire.

Home invasion, 3 to 5 man rush, a third gun could possibly get into one of their hands.

Just how I think,, hope you find what works for you.

The 1917 would be more of a punch and stab weapon than I am used to, this will be an interesting search.

I can only hope they don't get past my 10, 870, 12ga. slugs and the 8, .357SJHPs coming from the 327NG.
The 870 as a club is a good thought! Might even put the "breacher" choke tube back in!!!
I like it.

Sam, do you have a bayonet on your shotgun? Or perhaps most barrels are too thin.

 

[hso]

Firstly, that's a lousy weapon as knives go. Spike knives were intended to punch through heavy German overcoats in close quarters trench warfare. They're good at that, but not much else (other than being great military collectables if you have an original) since they make small wounds.

Secondly, using a valuable military collectable over another knife like any of the USN MkII clones by KaBar or Ontario (and I'm not even a fan) is putting that inferior, but valuable, collectable in the roll any number of other knives would perform better.

Thirdly, You got a Corvo? Cool!!! Another very interesting knife that isn't terribly practical (like the Fairbairn-Sykes) defensively.

 

[Sam1911]

No. Never wanted anything to make the shotgun any longer, or more likely to get stuck in the wallboard as I move. And if I want to harm anything in front of the muzzle, I'll just pull the trigger.

I'm the last one to say DON'T have a blade around. I just can't imagine that being better than lots of other choices.

And "rushed by 3-5 guys" who DON'T flee while you expend ammo in their direction? TWO guns worth of ammo? I know it is a tough sell to dig deep into probabilities and likelihoods ... but wow, maybe I'm a fatalist but I don't believe I'll still be in fighting condition at that point. Win or lose will be decided by the time the ammo's gone.

But, that's not a reason not to keep the cool old knife around.

 

[content]

No respect for the Corvo...ok

The fight in my head includes malfunctions and also the possibility of not getting more than a few shots off.
The thought of using the shotgun as a club....well... an empty shotgun would do but one with a "dud" round chambered or even a jam might not work out so well.

I hope you win with one shot and never have to experience a jammed or "dud" round, or if you do, there is more time/distance available to correct the problem than there would be to utilize a blade.

 

[hso]

Oh no, I have a lot of respect for the Corvo, but not as a practical knife.

I collect knives and study them and their history and any interesting and unique knives with their own unique history are GREAT in my opinion. I'd love to have a Corvo, but as a collectable instead of a practical knife. Same for the 1917. Same for the WWII Fairbairn-Sykes. Love them, but as historical niche knives.

I'm envious you have a Corvo, when I don't.

 

[AlexanderA]

It's worth pointing out that the original use of the M1917 and other trench knives was offensive, not defensive. The idea was that you would silently take out sentries, etc., on trench raids and other close encounters. If stealth was not necessary you would just use firearms.

 

[Jim Watson]

Trench raids in WWI were a particularly brutal part of an already horrific war.
Knives, clubs, and pistols were favored for maneuverability in a trench. I once read of a trench pike made out of a bayonet on a pick handle; handier than a bayoneted rifle. Or just take the pick.
Was the Webley bayonet much used? Probably not, but they were thinking hard about the subject.
Looking today, I found mention that the practice was so common that there were cutlery workers released from the French army to make knives. Old spike bayonets shortened to dagger length were popular.

 

[content]

TY for the input ,, I'm sure you know why I asked my first question.

Any time I am lucky enough to find something like the U.S. LF&C 1917 it stays quite handy for a time. If I had, had a break -in, in the last few days and probably the next month or so, the 1917 would be close at hand.

Carried it with me to the kitchen for late night coffee, a few times ,,,,, if someone had burst in the back door (slim chance) it would have been in my hand.

I try to learn what I can, where I can.

 

[content]

Mods.... if you want to move this somewhere else...feel free.

I agree trench warfare is as ugly as it gets, in the mind of someone like me that has never been to war.
Talking to a friend last, night as he remembered the Battle of the Citadel, any battle qualifies as ugly. Some times the silence between battles is worse. He remembers the K-Bar serving him well.

My Winchester, 1897, 12ga. Trench Shotgun, even ,,,at close to 100years old, with me at 52yrs old, can run four rounds of #6shot before the first hits the ground.
Still the military thought it was better to add a bayonet instead of even more shells.(part of this thinking might have been the quality of shells at the time,,, but that is another story) and most probably carried a bladed last resort weapon too.


As Jim points out,, hand to hand combat weapons were an "As You Like It" tool.
What ever made sense or felt right to the user.
As hso points out,, heavy, long winter coats were the "necessity" that bred the "invention" of the spike blade, knuckle protecting 1917 trench knife.

When I first obtained the U.S. L.F. &C. 1917 the only use I could see was to chip ice for my drinks(done and done).
I like to utilize my finds and smile when I think of some soldier,possibly an ancestor (not in this case, blood test on the blade revealed nothing), using the same tool for the same purpose.

After actually holding one and getting the feel of the 1917, I think it is the only knife I have that might penetrate a melee vest. There are three such vests for sale at a local pawn shop right now and they don't stick around long.

...hso ----I checked the link you supplied when I first researched the Corvo,,, would you plz let me know if you have found anything else.

The only thing I've found on my own is the Chilean Military web site(a small part of the vid has some wild slashing but little else) and a youtube vid of the field type with a longer tip.
Scimitar is close but too long.
Ty for any tips