Cannonball888
Member
My ex-brother-in-law is a DEA agent. He told me about DEA trainees almost accidentally shooting themselves. He carries an issued pistol but doesn't know jack about guns.
UGHH!! The Ignorance!!
- Thread starter Realbigo
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pbearperry
Member
I give firearm safety courses to civilians,and most don't know revolvers from semi autos.So what's the point?To be a cop you have to know every make and model of gun out there? Get real guys.Cops does not = gun experts,no more than gun experts = cops.
MTMilitiaman
Member
Conspiracy? Conspiracy is JFK or Area 51. I don't know about any conspiracy here, just a trend amongst hot-shot know-it-all typically hyper-aggressive cops with holier-than-though attitudes to make glaringly obvious mistakes and blatant failures to follow basic gun safety rules. But hey, what do I know? I am not the "only one professional enough in this room to handle this -bang- ow..." nor am I am the one parading around on national TV misidentifying one of the most easily recognizable firearms on the street. Next time this DEA has any question about the identity of a firearm, he can take a picture of it on his cell phone and send it to his 11-year old son to look up on GTA IV. Then he can open his mouth like the world isn't actually spinning so much faster than he can comprehend.
I don't expect cops to know every make an model. I wouldn't expect an average cop to recognize a KelTec. But a Mac 11 is right up there with a Tec 9, AK, and M16 as the most recognizable and prolific designs to hit the street since the Tommy Gun. What irks me is the cop pretending he knows what he's talking about when everyone at home is embarrassed for him. He should have just said "I am not sure what this is, some sort of machine pistol or carbine." No one would have held that against him and he wouldn't have ended up obviously clueless but too naive or arrogant to realize it.
I mean I am not a zoologist, but to me, this:
looks less like this:
than this:
looks like this:
I don't expect cops to know every make an model. I wouldn't expect an average cop to recognize a KelTec. But a Mac 11 is right up there with a Tec 9, AK, and M16 as the most recognizable and prolific designs to hit the street since the Tommy Gun. What irks me is the cop pretending he knows what he's talking about when everyone at home is embarrassed for him. He should have just said "I am not sure what this is, some sort of machine pistol or carbine." No one would have held that against him and he wouldn't have ended up obviously clueless but too naive or arrogant to realize it.
I mean I am not a zoologist, but to me, this:
looks less like this:
than this:
looks like this:
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Officers'Wife
Member
An auto mechanic 'should' know how many computers are in the vehicle they are repairing, even though he may not know the diff between a byte and a hangnail. And while a surgeon need not know how a scalpel is made he should know the diff twixt a scalpel and a probe. And while many soldiers do not know the nom beyond their specific training all but a selected few know the diff twixt a sidearm and a grenade launcher, as well as how to find the safety on an unfamiliar weapon system.
While your defense of LEO's is admirable, consider this. If a medical lab tech couldn't tell the difference between flu antibodies and HIV antibodies would you want her filling out your test results? Or for that matter would you want an LEO that doesn't know the diff between hemp and catnip in your mother's herb garden?
I think what the past and present law enforcement are responding to on this thread is the nitpicking. In a perfect world LE would never make a mistake...medical doctors would not kill patients due to malpractice...automobile mechanics would diagnose mechanical problems right the first time. This does not always happen! We are human and prone to mistakes. Every single person in every single profession makes mistakes.
All professionals have to deal with criticism and some of it is constructive. I understand civilians have every right to protest if they feel they have been wronged. I'm a big supporter of the 1st amendment. However, some complaints are so petty they become ridiculous. A harmless mistake is just that...a harmless mistake. Those who expect perfection who are not perfect themselves dwell in the realm of hypocrisy.
All professionals have to deal with criticism and some of it is constructive. I understand civilians have every right to protest if they feel they have been wronged. I'm a big supporter of the 1st amendment. However, some complaints are so petty they become ridiculous. A harmless mistake is just that...a harmless mistake. Those who expect perfection who are not perfect themselves dwell in the realm of hypocrisy.
t165,
I never said ILEAacademy. I was VA State Police. Now I'm a combat veteran, a college student, a Security Consultant, and a budding Journalist. I have this nagging desire to see the truth spread, even if it's ugly. And when a Federal Law Enforcement Officer is caught falsifying evidence, either accidentally, or on purpose, it needs to be brought out into the open. I think that when a LEO makes a mistake, people need to know. It sounds an awful lot like you are one of those who think that the ends always justify the means. Maybe you considered it OK when the FBI lab continued to give false scientific Ballistics testimony after their testing methods were proved to be in error. When the CIA dropped the ball all through the 90's on terrorism maybe you were glad that they managed to cover their collective butts instead of admitting to their errors, and fixing the problems. People F- up and make mistakes. It's a fact. We are all very painfully aware of it. Guilty people go free all the time on BS technicalities that shouldn't matter with the crimes that they have committed. But instead of making excuses for some hapless guy in N.Jersey, If you are an active Federal LEO, maybe you should drop a call that someone might need a refresher course on firearms before some lucky defense Attorney sees the same thing I did, and some scumbag gets back out on the street again because of it. I've had a bit of experience w/ members of the DEA, CIA, FBI, ATF, ICE, Secret Service and the US Marshals service, and I'm quite aware that they are far from perfect, but they have a responsibility to the American people to be as close to it as they are able.
I never said ILEAacademy. I was VA State Police. Now I'm a combat veteran, a college student, a Security Consultant, and a budding Journalist. I have this nagging desire to see the truth spread, even if it's ugly. And when a Federal Law Enforcement Officer is caught falsifying evidence, either accidentally, or on purpose, it needs to be brought out into the open. I think that when a LEO makes a mistake, people need to know. It sounds an awful lot like you are one of those who think that the ends always justify the means. Maybe you considered it OK when the FBI lab continued to give false scientific Ballistics testimony after their testing methods were proved to be in error. When the CIA dropped the ball all through the 90's on terrorism maybe you were glad that they managed to cover their collective butts instead of admitting to their errors, and fixing the problems. People F- up and make mistakes. It's a fact. We are all very painfully aware of it. Guilty people go free all the time on BS technicalities that shouldn't matter with the crimes that they have committed. But instead of making excuses for some hapless guy in N.Jersey, If you are an active Federal LEO, maybe you should drop a call that someone might need a refresher course on firearms before some lucky defense Attorney sees the same thing I did, and some scumbag gets back out on the street again because of it. I've had a bit of experience w/ members of the DEA, CIA, FBI, ATF, ICE, Secret Service and the US Marshals service, and I'm quite aware that they are far from perfect, but they have a responsibility to the American people to be as close to it as they are able.
Now a lower class of individual might take offense to this, but this is THR and we don't call each other nasty names.
Castrolr1
Member
back to the original topic. I was watching that show the other night, and they took a .25 auto off this guy. The arresting officer made sure to let the viewing audience know that it's a small bullet but it does lots of damage because it bounces around and destroys your organs. WTH..??
Officers'Wife
Member
Hi T165
Very true, and each and every profession can and is taken into civil court without question. Except one gleaming example- to sue an LEO for malpractice one must first gain permission from the government to do so. If the medical profession were granted the same immunity health care costs would plummet and morticians' dreams would be wearing 'MD' behind their names.
That said, while the guilty may be released on technicalities when the innocent are released on technicalities they are rarely able to repair the damage to their reputations.
Item last- I'm sorry to hear you left law enforcement. Your lack of arrogance is a breath of fresh air that profession desparately needs.
Selena
Very true, and each and every profession can and is taken into civil court without question. Except one gleaming example- to sue an LEO for malpractice one must first gain permission from the government to do so. If the medical profession were granted the same immunity health care costs would plummet and morticians' dreams would be wearing 'MD' behind their names.
That said, while the guilty may be released on technicalities when the innocent are released on technicalities they are rarely able to repair the damage to their reputations.
Item last- I'm sorry to hear you left law enforcement. Your lack of arrogance is a breath of fresh air that profession desparately needs.
Selena
Realbigo...I have never condoned law enforcement at any level falsifying evidence or lying under oath. You must have read something on a different post and confused that with my statements. I'll go back and read my posts on this thread but I think you are mistaken. When law enforcement officers are caught commiting crimes they should be arrested and prosecuted like any other person in any profession. There is a name for law enforcements officers who commit crimes...they are called "criminals". One past officer I worked with for years recently got out of prison. Somehow he wound up hooked on meth and became one of the biggest thiefs in town to satisfy his habit. My arguments are for those who point out petty harmless mistakes and try to belittle law enforcement officers to satisy some grudge they are carrying around. If you read between the lines on anti-law enforcement posts you can tell they have had an experience which left a bitter taste in their mouth. Then it seems they color all LE with the same brush and like nothing better than taking shots at the profession as a whole.
As for the "butt crack" picture I thought it was funny. And I didn't call anyone anything. The actual moderators who run THR haven't said anything. If you are offended then you can tell on me if you want.
I guess if I have violated a posting policy I'll take my punishment like a man.
I get to your part of the country every 2 years or so. Beautiful country. While we may not agree on some things I wish you success in your endeavors.
One of my instructors at ILEA I mentioned (Paul Whitesell) resigned from the Indiana State Police several years ago and went back to college. He earned a degree in psychology and then gained employment at the police academy as an instructor. He is now the Superintendant of the Indiana State Police. He did well.
To Officer'sWife...I don't understand what you mean about asking permission to sue LE officers. Are you talking about the requirement to file a tort first? Judges have immunity and prosecutors have what I think is called limited immunity. Cops get throwed under the bus left and right.
As for the "butt crack" picture I thought it was funny. And I didn't call anyone anything. The actual moderators who run THR haven't said anything. If you are offended then you can tell on me if you want.
I guess if I have violated a posting policy I'll take my punishment like a man.I get to your part of the country every 2 years or so. Beautiful country. While we may not agree on some things I wish you success in your endeavors.
One of my instructors at ILEA I mentioned (Paul Whitesell) resigned from the Indiana State Police several years ago and went back to college. He earned a degree in psychology and then gained employment at the police academy as an instructor. He is now the Superintendant of the Indiana State Police. He did well.
To Officer'sWife...I don't understand what you mean about asking permission to sue LE officers. Are you talking about the requirement to file a tort first? Judges have immunity and prosecutors have what I think is called limited immunity. Cops get throwed under the bus left and right.
Realbigo...I have never condoned law enforcement at any level falsifying evidence or lying under oath. You must have read something on a different post and confused that with my statements. I'll go back and read my posts on this thread but I think you are mistaken. When law enforcement officers are caught commiting crimes they should be arrested and prosecuted like any other person in any profession. There is a name for law enforcements officers who commit crimes...they are called "criminals". One past officer I worked with for years recently got out of prison. Somehow he wound up hooked on meth and became one of the biggest thiefs in town to satisfy his habit. My arguments are for those who point out petty harmless mistakes and try to belittle law enforcement officers to satisy some grudge they are carrying around. If you read between the lines on anti-law enforcement posts you can tell they have had an experience which left a bitter taste in their mouth. Then it seems they color all LE with the same brush and like nothing better than taking shots at the profession as a whole.
As for the "butt crack" picture I thought it was funny. And I didn't call anyone anything. The actual moderators who run THR haven't said anything. If you are offended then you can tell on me if you want. I guess if I have violated a posting policy I'll take my punishment like a man.
I get to your part of the country every 2 years or so. Beautiful country. While we may not agree on some things I wish you success in your endeavors.
One of my instructors at ILEA I mentioned (Paul Whitesell) resigned from the Indiana State Police several years ago and went back to college. He earned a degree in psychology and then gained employment at the police academy as an instructor. He is now the Superintendant of the Indiana State Police. He did well.
To Officer'sWife...I don't understand what you mean about asking permission to sue LE officers. Are you talking about the requirement to file a tort first? Judges have immunity and prosecutors have what I think is called limited immunity. Cops get throwed under the bus left and right.
As for the "butt crack" picture I thought it was funny. And I didn't call anyone anything. The actual moderators who run THR haven't said anything. If you are offended then you can tell on me if you want.
I guess if I have violated a posting policy I'll take my punishment like a man.I get to your part of the country every 2 years or so. Beautiful country. While we may not agree on some things I wish you success in your endeavors.
One of my instructors at ILEA I mentioned (Paul Whitesell) resigned from the Indiana State Police several years ago and went back to college. He earned a degree in psychology and then gained employment at the police academy as an instructor. He is now the Superintendant of the Indiana State Police. He did well.
To Officer'sWife...I don't understand what you mean about asking permission to sue LE officers. Are you talking about the requirement to file a tort first? Judges have immunity and prosecutors have what I think is called limited immunity. Cops get throwed under the bus left and right.
MTMilitiaman
Member
That would depend how easily your feelings are hurt
And uh, no, sorry, computers aren't my thing.
I know sometimes when I am on a laptop such as now I'll click "Post Reply" and get a message saying something like '90 seconds are required between posts. Please post back in _____ seconds.' But I was under the impression that was supposed to make it pretty difficult to double post.
And uh, no, sorry, computers aren't my thing.
I know sometimes when I am on a laptop such as now I'll click "Post Reply" and get a message saying something like '90 seconds are required between posts. Please post back in _____ seconds.' But I was under the impression that was supposed to make it pretty difficult to double post.
Carl
Member
There's a big difference between simply not knowing what a certain firearm is, and confidently calling it something completely different.
What seems less professional.
*Man holds up an 1897 Winchester Trench gun in 12 ga*
"Oh yeah, this is a shotgun of some kind...not sure but I know it's at least a twelve gauge, says so right here on the side of the frame"
or
"This full auto Remington 8 gauge is capable of shooting through three police cruiser engine blocks and a concrete wall with ease."
Now what sounds less professional?
To most people uneducated with firearms will believe the guy that seems to know what he's talking about, whether he actually does or not. It's dangerous misidentifying guns on TV where impressionable people on the fence about gun control are watching.
What seems less professional.
*Man holds up an 1897 Winchester Trench gun in 12 ga*
"Oh yeah, this is a shotgun of some kind...not sure but I know it's at least a twelve gauge, says so right here on the side of the frame"
or
"This full auto Remington 8 gauge is capable of shooting through three police cruiser engine blocks and a concrete wall with ease."
Now what sounds less professional?
To most people uneducated with firearms will believe the guy that seems to know what he's talking about, whether he actually does or not. It's dangerous misidentifying guns on TV where impressionable people on the fence about gun control are watching.
You have to remember that the first qualification for a federal agent (or deputized state or local LEOs, which to be fair, are some of the people on the show) to be on one of these shows, is to be stupid enough to say yes, when they are looking for volunteers for it. After that, anything is possible.
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