Unburnt powder question

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I say, if it's an accurate load, don't worry about it. Unburned powder isn't an issue unless it binds the gun up.

There are reasons to use a powder that leaves some unburned flakes.
If you have the powder already, that's reason enough to use it. Other reasons might include how it shoots, if it is historically correct for the cartridge, if it's better for cold weather or hot weather depending on when you shoot.
 
Thank you all for the input and discussion. Sorry I went silent, work got busy and stressful for a few days. Fwiw, I did up the load a bit and crimped a little more and it seemed to help with burn efficiency (though groupings look about the same) I will keep at it…
 
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I don't know if I get your point exactly, but differences in velocity from one round to another affects the Ransom Rest movement the same way it would affect a person. Faster/slower speed (dwell time) = more/less recoil = more/less Ransom Rest or hand/arm movement.

You are absolutely correct. The difference is that the ransom rest is a machine and the recoil tension spring is consistent, the grip/grip pressure is consistent, trigger pull, yada-yada-yada.

For some odd reason humans tend to change their grip/grip pressure when 1 round goes pop, the next 2 go BANG and the 1 after that has a ppsst pop to it. This change in grip has an affect in the dwell time of the bullet.

Anyone that's shot nra bullseye for awhile knows how important consistent ammo is when shooting rapid fire sets.
 
For some odd reason humans tend to change their grip/grip pressure when 1 round goes pop, the next 2 go BANG and the 1 after that has a ppsst pop to it. This change in grip has an affect in the dwell time of the bullet.

Anyone that's shot nra bullseye for awhile knows how important consistent ammo is when shooting rapid fire sets.

How much of a difference in velocity is required for shooters to be able to tell the difference between rounds all loaded the same?
 
How much of a difference in velocity is required for shooters to be able to tell the difference between rounds all loaded the same?
I dont think that's how people know. The recoil impulse is the way a shooter would know and that's a wildly different indicator from round to round in different calibers and different people.
 
For some odd reason humans tend to change their grip/grip pressure when 1 round goes pop, the next 2 go BANG and the 1 after that has a ppsst pop to it. This change in grip has an affect in the dwell time of the bullet.

Does a firmer grip increase or decrease the dwell time? This, I presume, translates into - does a firmer grip increase or decrease velocity. I assume dwell time is negatively correlated with velocity, with a longer dwell time meaning a slower velocity.
 
How much of a difference in velocity is required for shooters to be able to tell the difference between rounds all loaded the same?

Why you asking me??? You have a ransom rest and posted the difference in velocity is meaningless!!!
 
Why you asking me??? You have a ransom rest and posted the difference in velocity is meaningless!!!

You're saying shooters can tell the difference and adjust their grip which changes dwell time. How much difference is required before they adjust their grip? And see question in post #33. Thanks.
 
Why you asking me??? You have a ransom rest and posted the difference in velocity is meaningless!!!

I'm referring to mechanical accuracy and have provided a link that tests it.

You're referring to shooter effects of differences in recoil. Surely you have some evidence to support your claim.
 
You're saying shooters can tell the difference and adjust their grip which changes dwell time. How much difference is required before they adjust their grip? And see question in post #33. Thanks.

Never even came close to saying anything near that Why you put words in someone mouth is beyond me.

Why don't we get together and do a little shooting. I'll gladly supply the firearms and ammo. I'll use my standard bullseye load in one of my 1911's. You can use the same 1911 and I'll load it up with a combo of target loads, ball ammo, p+ ammo and dummy rounds.

Lets see how consistent you are. I'll gladly bet whatever you want a point on the target scores!!!!
 
I'm referring to mechanical accuracy and have provided a link that tests it.

You're referring to shooter effects of differences in recoil. Surely you have some evidence to support your claim.


Why do you keep wanting to go down this rabbit hole!!!

The proof itself is in that you have to use a mechanical rest to test a load.

Show me average shooters that can take a double stack, single stack, revolver, etc of loads from mind to wild including 40% duds loaded up and keep the shots on center just like a ransom rest shooting tests for accuracy.

Why on gods green earth do shooter spend tons of $$$$ on accurate loads/consistent loads for the competitions they compete in???

Why the heck do people/countries/teams use eley 10x for pistol competitions when they could be using walmart bulk packs because the ransom rest and you say so!!!!

You really should take a minute out of your busy day and truly think about why shooting teams, governments, competitors go thru the trouble of finding the most accurate /consistent ammo they can.

Unlike you the rest of the word realizes it might not end well if you use ammo that has inconsistent ignition to compete with.
 
You wrote:
For some odd reason humans tend to change their grip/grip pressure when 1 round goes pop, the next 2 go BANG and the 1 after that has a ppsst pop to it. This change in grip has an affect in the dwell time of the bullet.

From your subsequent responses I gather that you're only speaking of extreme cases, from dud to +P.

You've not addressed the question in #33 of how grip affects dwell time. What are your thoughts on this.

From my understanding competitors look for consistently accurate ammunition. Consistent velocity for a given load is less of a concern if the ammo shoots well.
 
You must think you question in post #33 is something special. I have no idea why you either can't or choose not to answer this question yourself. Perhaps a little less typing and more reading would be a better approach to figuring it out. You know the 1 mouth 2 ears thing??? You should be looking up "Burkett Timing Drill"

That's just it the whole conversation started around you stating the a load with unburnt powder/inconsistent load means nothing to accuracy because my ransom rest told me so.

You stated:
"From my understanding competitors look for consistently accurate ammunition. Consistent velocity for a given load is less of a concern if the ammo shoots well." If you don't compete in anything with pistols/revolvers then why are you telling others what does or doesn't affect accuracy??? Some times 1st hand knowledge is best, you might consider trying things out for yourself.

Dwell time & grip pressure:
The burkett timing drill is designed to aid in finding the correct grip pressure for the shooter/firearm/load. Along with teaching the shooter to create what's known as a accuracy cadence with that firearm/ammo combo. Kind of hard to correct "tipping" or vertical stringing when your ammo doesn't feel consistent.

Myself, I've spent a lot of time using/shooting 357mags over the decades. Not only in revolvers I shoot a lot of 357mag ammo in a contender. I use the contender as a training tool for not only a consistent grip pressure, the duration that consistent grip pressure needs to be. Or what's known as follow thru. Follow thru of a shot/there's another new term for you to look up.
My contender chambered in 357mag setup as a training tool for targets @ 50yds. The idea is to hit a 2" (actually 50mm) 10-ring.
Bn5IL3b.jpg

At the end of the day a shooter uses grip pressure to hold the firearm so that the independent act of pulling the trigger doesn't affect accuracy. The shooter uses that same grip pressure to keep the firearm on target/to the poa. How long the shooter holds that grip pressure is affected by the dwell time of the bullet creating what known as follow thru. How strong or weak a load is mandates how much grip the individual shooter has to use keep the firearm on target.

Huge difference between the raw accuracy of a load and the usable accuracy of that same load. Here's 13 targets that have test loads that will hold the 10-ring on an nra target @ 25yds. They were shot with 7 different bullets and 5 different powders. Some powders/loads burned clean, other not so much with unburnt powder and soot on the case mouths.
BAyAIIY.jpg

In the ransom rest world they are all equal, that raw accuracy thing. For a shooters standpoint, I'd only use 2 of those 13 test loads for competition. The rest are for shooting dirt clods @ 20 paces.
 
You must think you question in post #33 is something special. . . .

There’s nothing special about the question. I’m simply trying to understand what you wrote, of how grip affects how long the bullet is in the barrel.

The Burkett Timing drill, as you note, is to help a shooter find the right grip for them to aid in fast recovery to get the sights back on target. But I don’t see how that affects bullet dwell time.

Agreed that one wants to maintain good follow through until the bullet exits so that any untoward movement does not change trajectory from shot to shot. This was never doubted. It does not address the question.

“How long the shooter holds that grip pressure is affected by the dwell time of the bullet creating what known as follow thru. How strong or weak a load is mandates how much grip the individual shooter has to use keep the firearm on target.” This address how long the follow through should be. But follow through does not address how the grip affects bullet dwell time.

You wrote, “This change in grip has an affect in the dwell time of the bullet.” This claims a cause/effect relationship that how you hold the gun will change the bullet dwell time - how long the bullet is in the barrel.

If that’s not what you intended to say, just say so.

Here’s another way to make this simple. Given your claim, would a strong grip increase or decrease bullet dwell time compared to a weak grip? What evidence supports that?

If you don’t know, or you misspoke, just say so. If you know the answer, please share it. I'm probably not the only forum member who would like to learn.
 
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