"Unregistered ammunition?"

[Old Dog]

Pennsylvania guy with no criminal record gets busted in D.C. ...

With a Glock 23 pistol, a Bushmaster Carbon-15 ... and according to the story on MSN, apparently no .40 S&W ammo, but he did have a few (30) rounds of 7.62 to go along with some .223. Aside from not having a license, he's popped for "unregistered ammo." WTH? There's such a thing?

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ma...ter-guns-found-in-car/ar-BBBJwq5?ocid=SK2FDHP

"Police had been told Moles had a Glock 23 pistol and a Carbon 15 Bushmaster rifle, an incident report said. Officers saw one of the guns in his car and found a second firearm in the glove compartment.

Moles also had 30 rounds of 7.62mm ammunition and 60 .223-caliber rounds, the report said. He was charged with two counts of carrying a pistol without a license and possessing unregistered ammunition."

 

[Jeff H]

Lesson number 1: Know the laws of the areas you are traveling before you go there.

 

[<*(((><]

http://smartgunlaws.org/ammunition-regulation-in-washington-d-c/

I'm glad I live in a free state, it's not worth any amount of money to live in a state that strips it's citizens of their freedoms.

And like Jeff H said better know the gun laws in states that you are visiting and taking firearms along. I always check handgunlaw.us before heading out with firearms on trips.

 

[reddog81]

Based upon a quick look at good 'ol wikipedia it sounds like you have to have a firearm registration in order to legally have ammo. So the ammo isn't really registered itself. Ridiculous law either way

 

[Crunchy Frog]

From what I understand the definition of "ammunition" includes a fired case or shotshell hull.

 

[Old Dog]

I also found it interesting that the guy had some spare 7.62 rounds but no mention of .40 ammo for his G23 ... could have just been sloppy documentation by the arresting officers or the (expected) inaccurate and uninformed media reportage ...

 

[Acera]

From what I understand the definition of "ammunition" includes a fired case or shotshell hull.

Search for and read the story of Mark Witaschek.

D.C. is a whole level of stupid on so many fronts.



.

 

[Decoy80]

Our poor leader's of this Country are in D.C. too.
I wonder how much crime isn't happening in the Capital due to the sad fact that they would keep our Constitution on display there without reading it regarding the rights of the Citizens.
You would like to think that the Capital City would hold it dear as most people do. I am saddened by this post but thanks for the information.

 

[22250Rem]

From what I understand the definition of "ammunition" includes a fired case or shotshell hull.

That was my understanding as well. I recall the story of a D.C. resident who was visiting relatives in another state and had gone out shooting with them. An empty rifle casing wound up in his jacket pocket and wasn't discovered until he was back home in D.C. . Then it was placed on his desk top; and some time later the police were at his home for an unrelated reason. While at his home they saw the empty casing on his desk and promptly arrested him. I don't recall how the matter was finally resolved but I still can't believe he got arrested for an empty shell casing. No live ammo; just one fired rifle casing.

 

[Prijador]

For extra credit, you can look up the surprisingly lenient plea deals given to some actual drug dealers with illegal firearms in DC...

 

[grampajack]

Our poor leader's of this Country are in D.C. too.
I wonder how much crime isn't happening in the Capital due to the sad fact that they would keep our Constitution on display there without reading it regarding the rights of the Citizens.
You would like to think that the Capital City would hold it dear as most people do. I am saddened by this post but thanks for the information.

I think they rather enjoy the irony.

 

[jonnyc]

"ammunition collector’s certificates"???
I've been collecting ammo for over 45 years, never heard of one of those!

 

[Tirod]

First, the cops were alerted to him by a "tipster," whatever that is, so they knew he was in town. As if checking into Trump Hotel wouldn't get you immediately vetted by the Secret Service being on the premises. Second, looking over the car, officers "saw" a weapon. In DC. Apparently in open view.

"Unregistered ammunition" isn't the story here. However, there are indications someone isn't thinking thru what they say and do to a logical conclusion about consequences.

Circumstantial? Liberal acquaintance SWATs him out of opportunity and the cops just say "we saw guns?" There's a serious lack of background and it will take weeks to fill in the facts.

 

[Sav .250]

Lesson number 1: Know the laws of the areas you are traveling before you go there.

That`s an absolute! I guess the obvious escapes a lot of gun folks..............

 

[mnrivrat]

There are no American's in position of authority in DC .

And to add insult to injury - some of them humanoids with authority lie !

 

[Jack B.]

There was a time ( maybe still is) in D.C. the capital of our nation that if you got caught with even an empty shell it was illegal. No gun ,no loaded ammo , just an empty shell case. I know I used to live there. I moved. I think since the Heller decision it may not be that way anymore. I won't go there anyway.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

I have long heard that possession of an empty cartridge case w/o a permit is a criminal violation in New York, especially NYC.*

Wasn't there a case where D.C. argued in court that lead balls for muzzleloaders were ammunition and required possession of a firearms license?

Yes, boys and girls, there are parts of the the USA where possession of empty cartridge cases** and round lead balls is a criminal violation, when it is perfectly legal in most of the US. Not even getting to the subject of live ammunition.

To be in criminal violation of these malum prohibitum laws you don't have to do any acts that are malum in se. Prohibitions make criminals of people who have done no acts harmful to others. The prohibitionists pretend their restrictions prevent bads acts by bad people when they simply don't. As most comments in this thread demonstrate, it does the dignity of the law no good to pass useless or harmful legislation.

___________________________
* I suggested to my son when he and the DIL were going to Niagra Falls NY and Canada that they get a rental car. We used his truck as a benchrest on the mountain and there are probably cartridge cases in unknown places all over that truck. BTW (a) the rental car had much better gas mileage and (b) they found Canadian hospitality friendly just like Southern hospitality but a different accent.

** .17 Mag empties held in pliers make great disposable punches for making extra holes in leather belts or straps using a tent peg mallet and old phonebook for backing. My leather repair kit includes .17 Mag empties.

 

[rscalzo]

I have long heard that possession of an empty cartridge case w/o a permit is a criminal violation in New York, especially NYC.*...

More urban legend.

https://safeact.ny.gov/ammunition

There are fire codes relating to the storage of components such as powder and primers. the problem is that some dealers will not ship to NYC. Same in MA.

 

[Decoy80]

Who's to say what's coming.
The Ligators that write legislation that is not clear and well defined, with grey area's that leads to litigation, Have in both Country and my State wrote legislation that requires the Citizens to buy insurance.
Those folks Litigators and Insurance companies produce nothing toward our Gross National Product. In my hop. We as citizens are like a hound dog covered in ticks.
At some point the ticks will weaken the poor dog until he dies if they are not picked off his back.
Common sense ain't so common anymore. If I was sitting in D.C. at this moment I would have many more counts of unregistered ammunition than life itself

 

[GBExpat]

Pennsylvania guy with no criminal record gets busted in D.C. ...

An adult "gun-guy" who lives in PA and is not very aware that DC is a no-gun zone?

Nah ... I don't buy it ... or that it is a simple "oops" on his part.

All of us gun-people within travel range of DC know that, at a bare minimum, it is a place to NOT take a firearm.

Something else is at play here ...

 

[Cannibul]

The vast majority of gun owners don't visit firearms related forums and are ignorant of the laws regarding the most basic aspects of firearm ownership. Most don't have a CHL/CCW/LTC and have never taken what little training is required in some states.

Even among that small number who visit firearm related forums there's a surprisingly large number who aren't conversant with basic firearms law. Just start a thread about shipping a firearm, or purchasing a firearm out of state.

To many people they falsely assume that since their driver's license is good everywhere and their car is legal everywhere that firearms can't be any different. If we had not let our Rights slip away this would be a non-issue.

 

[ATLDave]

If the law is the same as when I went to school there, even empty shell casings count as ammo and had to be "registered" in D.C.

Pure idiocy.

 

[Jack B.]

If the law is the same as when I went to school there, even empty shell casings count as ammo and had to be "registered" in D.C.

Pure idiocy.

Amazing. The Capital of the United States. If I didn't know better I would think it's just a joke.

 

[ATLDave]

I did all my higher education there, and then high-tailed it back home to GA for a reason! (Several, actually.)

 

[GBExpat]

The vast majority of gun owners don't visit firearms related forums and are ignorant of the laws regarding the most basic aspects of firearm ownership. ...

While that is probably true, sadly, with all of the news stories in the recent past relating to DC & Guns one would really have to have their head firmly ensconced in the sand to not know that DC + gun is a potential prison-term just waiting to happen.