Utah's famous "Super Dell" up on weapon charges

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George Hill

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http://kutv.com/topstories/local_story_151193027.html

Super Dell up on charges. Dell “Super Dell” Schanze is up on charges for threatening to use a deadly weapon during a fight. Be sure to watch the video clip attached to the story because it shows Dell's side of the story, which the obviously biased reported tries to minimize.
Here is my take: Dell had every right to pull a gun if he really pulled the gun. He was obviously threatened and had ample justification to defend himself and his daughter. These guys who confronted him and blocked him in had absolutely no right to do anything that they did. If they observed Dell driving in a manner that is unsafe, then they should have called the cops instead of acting like vigilantes and threatening violence against Dell. For those outside of Utah, yes, he really does act and sound like that. He is well known here in Utah for running “Totally Awesome Computers” a chain of computer shops that build some pretty decent if not overly hyped PC systems. Dell is also known to give $100 discounts to people who have CCW permits. Dell also owns “Totally Awesome Guns and Range”. The name is a total exaggeration of the gun shop and range... but they do stock some fine hardware and they even have a couple guys there that actually know what they are talking about . Dell also holds a class 3 FFL and is a collector of select-fire hardware. His voice and his mannerisms are totally annoying, and he is a hugely arrogant SOB. However, I do not think that he is irresponsible to the point of driving 75MPH and brandishing a weapon just for the thrill of it.
He is alleged to have driven too fast, but the guys that were confronting him... when was the last time they had their radar unit calibrated and certified?
What? You mean to tell me they don't have a radar unit? So how did they know he was driving 75MPH?
Since when is it kosher to confront someone by blocking them in, yelling at them, and then picking up a big rock and threaten people with it? That smacks of utter fecalmatterfromabull right there. Completely asinine.
This has been refered to the DA's office, which is probably just following procedure... but here is what the DA should do first thing in the morning: Drop all charges against Super Dell Schanze, and file some against the jackholes that thought they could act like Super Heroes.
At least that is my opinion, I could be wrong.
 
Seems like a pretty funny guy on the video. He really knows how to ham it up in front of the camera. I bet his commercials are humorous.

Sounds like a (somewhat) clear case of self-defense to me. I'd be interested in seeing the records of the people who blocked him in and confronted him. I'd be willing to bet that at least one of the hotheads has been hauled in before on violence-related charges.
 
Henry, now there you go again. Sounding like that sissy El Tejon with "only two boxes on the form, which do you want to be perp or victim." :rolleyes:

We all know that having a CCW not only gives you superhero powers but also immunity from the criminal code of your state. The guys at the gun shoppe told me just to walk away and I know they have done far more criminal trials than anyone else.
 
The guy is a complete moron.

He draws a gun because someone is threatening to break his tail lights? Unless I missed it, there is no evidence but Dell's word that he himself was being threatened with the rock. If so, he should have called the cops.

I do agree the guys who confronted him needed to back-off and call the cops, though. They had no business doing anything but making the call to the police.

And George, come on, you don't need a radar gun to know when somone is speeding down a residential street. Is this guy your friend?

All parties involved need some sort of punishment so that cooler heads may prevail in the future.

Finally, how did the moron get charged with reckless driving when no police officer directly observed the act?

Sawdust
 
Its a travesty of justice that the guys acting like vigilanties and threatening someone with a rock gets to charge the evident victim of road roage.
 
The instigator picks a rock up and threatens Mr.Dell and or to destroy his property, not to mention he was illegally detained I would pull a gun out too, but I would have called the Police.
 
I can't blame him for carrying, he's not liked by most of the populace here; not that I can blame anyone for carrying... :) I can't stand him or his commercials, a more annoying commercial you'll rarely see. From the details I've heard, they never once threatened him or his daughter. No, they shouldn't have threatened to damage his car, but IMHO drawing his weapon was out of line. He shouldn't have been doing 65 in a residential area, they shouldn't have followed him and threatened to damage his property, and he most definitely should not have drawn his weapon and aimed it at someone threatening only to break out a tail-light. He should have called the police, and drawn only if a threat was made upon him or his daughter.
My thoughts are only based on that I heard they never threatened him or his daughter, if that's not the case, my feelings would definitely change, regardless of my personal dislike for him.

--Edited to clarify
 
As far as Dell goes, his commercials are over the top and annoying, and his personality kind of washes over you like an alchohol bath on an open wound. I've heard less than flattering accounts of his actions from a person that knows him. He comes across as pompous, arrogant, and rude, and that may have added to the attitude these people had when confronting him. They see him doing something they view as wrong, and because of who it is doing it, it becomes somehow worse in their eyes. They get all riled up, round up the posse, chase him down, box in his vehicle and threaten him. One of them picks up a large rock, there is disparity of force, he has his young child with him. I'd say he was justified in pulling a gun, regardless of any feelings I may have had about him in the past.
 
I don't know...but if 3 men were approaching my car with one guy holding a rock poised to throw it at me. I would have drawn my weapon too. My daughter would come first. I don't think I would stand there and try and figure out the intentions of the guy with the rock. I'm not a mind reader. How do you expect Dell to know that guy was planning to bust out his tail light or his daughter's head. Only fault I see that Dell did is drive too fast in a residential zone. Not enough in my book to have three guys approach and threaten him.

I can't fault Dell for not calling the police too. In the heat of the moment. He probably had one hand on his daughter and one ready to pull his firearm. No time to do so. Maybe while he was in his car, he could have, but he was probably busy driving and more concentrating on not getting killed.

On a tangent though, can't fault Dell for his choice in CCW. 10mm Glock. My kind of man. :evil: :evil:
 
Sounds like he is doing a good amount of CYA in the interview. He points out that he was blocked in, handicapped, and approached aggressively by three men. One of which was armed with a blunt object. He also had his daughter with him, which would compound the problem of trying to flee due to circumstances.

If the guy with the rock would have been within swinging distance, Dell could have shot him and been within the law in Florida.

I can't say that I agree with that action or that it is justified though. But I wasn't there either. So I am not going to guess at what I would do in that situation.

It is good to hear that the crimes he is charged with are misdemeanors at least. If he gets a good lawyer, I bet he can make his case pretty tight (although not seamless) and beat the charges. It seems that he can afford one.

I agree that everyone involved should be given something to think about though. The guys who chased him down weren't justified in their actions. But who knows, maybe Dell flies through that neighborhood twice a day like that and they were getting fed up with him endangering the lives of everyone he comes across. If that was the case or something like it, they should have just videotaped him and made the authorities savvy.
 
It's hard to tell what really happened, but I had a hard time with a cop I saw interviewed about the case. He said that Dell was not justified drawing his weapon in that situation.

If I'm being approached by 3 grown men and one of them has a rock, my gun's coming out too.

He may have been speeding, he may be annoying and a jerk. The guy still has a right to defend himself.

The angry residents should have called the cops and not approached the vehicle.
 
One more thing. Schanze was ticketed for wreckless driving?? Based on what folks in the neighborhood said? Did an officer clock him speeding?
 
This is too funny, in one thread you commend a guy who you think was keeping law and order because he had a gun while doing it, and in this thread you defend a jackass with a gun and not the citizens who are trying to protect their neighbor because the jackass has the gun this time. Anyone see a pattern here? You guys have lost all objectivity, as long a gun is used you think its good. You make the O.J. jury look fair. Have you guys gone MAD??? Do you think this attitude is going to help keep our gun rights, or will you be exposed for the biased gun toters that turn people off to guns? Check your 6 on that!
 
Pythonguy,

I don't know this Dell, nor do I care to.

But these lewd fellows of the baser sort overreacted when they ran him off the road, one carrying a rock. Of course I do not have all the details. As myrockfight (now that name is ironic in this thread :D ) pointed out perhaps he flies through that neighborhood twice a day, and they just got fed up. Somehow though I would bet that would have made the news article.

No, more than likely these were a bunch of puffed up blow hards, but who knows they may have flipped and started beating the guy...and his daughter.

As for Schanze overreacting? No, I don't think so. Have you been in such a situation? I have. The only difference is it happened to me 10 years ago before common cell phone use. And at night. If you feel threatened a gun is a lot faster to pull than a call to 911. And it's not like his 10mm would put him on hold. Likewise Schanze didn't shoot anybody or anything. Looks to me that he used the gun properly as a deterrent to possible violent crime.
 
???

This is too funny, in one thread you commend a guy who you think was keeping law and order because he had a gun while doing it, and in this thread you defend a jackass with a gun and not the citizens who are trying to protect their neighbor because the jackass has the gun this time. Anyone see a pattern here? You guys have lost all objectivity, as long a gun is used you think its good. You make the O.J. jury look fair. Have you guys gone MAD??? Do you think this attitude is going to help keep our gun rights, or will you be exposed for the biased gun toters that turn people off to guns? Check your 6 on that!
Click to expand...

pythonguy

Is that a comment directed toward everyone who posted or someone in particular?

Personally, I always try to make a point of looking at thinks objectively. But that doesn't make anyone right or wrong. They either broke the law or they didn't. It is a matter of fact, not perspective.
 
About all I can say is that . . . we really don't know the REAL story, and news reports are notoriously unreliable. As has already been mentioned, how was he charged with reckless driving if there was no collision and no police to witness the alleged offense? He was driving at 50-100 MPH? Which was it, 50 MPH or 100 MPH, there's a big difference, and what was the speed limit? How was his speed measured? If the guy drives through there recklessly often, how come the locals didn't call police and have them stake it out, especially if his schedule is reasonably predictable? Exactly how did locals go about blocking him in, and did they actually threaten him, with one of them carrying a big rock?

Again, news reports are notoriously unreliable, and we don't actually know what happened . . . but if 3 men were approaching me uttering threats and threatening me with a rock, I'd consider myself in immediate danger of grave bodily harm and act accordingly.
 
76-2-402. Force in defense of person -- Forcible felony defined.
(1) A person is justified in threatening or using force against another when and to the extent that he or she reasonably believes that force is necessary to defend himself or a third person against such other's imminent use of unlawful force. However, that person is justified in using force intended or likely to cause death or serious bodily injury only if he or she reasonably believes that force is necessary to prevent death or serious bodily injury to himself or a third person as a result of the other's imminent use of unlawful force, or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony. (2) A person is not justified in using force under the circumstances specified in Subsection (1) if he or she:
(a) initially provokes the use of force against himself with the intent to use force as an excuse to inflict bodily harm upon the assailant;
(b) is attempting to commit, committing, or fleeing after the commission or attempted commission of a felony; or
(c) (i) was the aggressor or was engaged in a combat by agreement, unless he withdraws from the encounter and effectively communicates to the other person his intent to do so and, notwithstanding, the other person continues or threatens to continue the use of unlawful force; and
(ii) for purposes of Subsection (i) the following do not, by themselves, constitute "combat by agreement":
(A) voluntarily entering into or remaining in an ongoing relationship; or
(B) entering or remaining in a place where one has a legal right to be.
(3) A person does not have a duty to retreat from the force or threatened force described in Subsection (1) in a place where that person has lawfully entered or remained, except as provided in Subsection (2)(c).
(4) For purposes of this section, a forcible felony includes aggravated assault, mayhem, aggravated murder, murder, manslaughter, kidnapping, and aggravated kidnapping, rape, forcible sodomy, rape of a child, object rape, object rape of a child, sexual abuse of a child, aggravated sexual abuse of a child, and aggravated sexual assault as defined in Title 76, Chapter 5, and arson, robbery, and burglary as defined in Title 76, Chapter 6. Any other felony offense which involves the use of force or violence against a person so as to create a substantial danger of death or serious bodily injury also constitutes a forcible felony. Burglary of a vehicle, defined in Section 76-6-204, does not constitute a forcible felony except when the vehicle is occupied at the time unlawful entry is made or attempted.
(5) In determining imminence or reasonableness under Subsection (1), the trier of fact may consider, but is not limited to, any of the following factors:
(a) the nature of the danger;
(b) the immediacy of the danger;
(c) the probability that the unlawful force would result in death or serious bodily injury;
(d) the other's prior violent acts or violent propensities; and
(e) any patterns of abuse or violence in the parties' relationship.

As with most self defense cases...it comes down to the famous "reasonable man" standard. I'm not a lawyer, expert or otherwise...but all things being equal...if the stories presented are true, it would seem that the only reason Dell is charged with anything is because he let the other guys report the incident first.

One skinny guy (allegedly with crippling injuries) with his 8 year old daughter in tow, who is boxed in by 3 angry guys (one of whom picks up a sizable blunt weapon in a threatening manner) would seem to be justified in producing his legally owned and carried firearm to ward of the threat. What should he have done?
 
WOW, Dell appears to be an Clown :) , but honestly, I think that if I had back problems and was messed up as he claims to be, I would do whatever I had to to rid myself of the road raging thugs. :cuss:

I have to wonder, what is this dude's problem though...carrying a 10mm Glock in his front pocket :what: ...While driving a jag :neener: ...buy a holster you obviously have money... please before you lose the bum leg because you accidentally shot yourself. :banghead: .



(Edited for Art's Grandma)
 
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The reckless driving charge is nuts. No cop, no radar, no offense. You can't charge on a subjective perception of speed.

Three guys come at you, one with a rock, you're justified in drawing a weapon. It's not your job to decipher the possible motives of those packing the rock and attitude.

How there is any inconsistency in objectivity in defending Dell I don't quite see? We KNOW he was confronted by three idividuals, one with a weapon. We have no idea if he was speeding or what the three individuals said or intended. All we have is their claims, and we already know they are in the wrong in having pursued, restrained and intimidated Dell.
 
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