Video Captures Dramatic L.A. Shootout

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I can see 120 or so reasons why all officers involved need to be fired. That video shows just how STUPID that group of officers are. They are not police material, nada, nope.


And we are supposed to be ok with officers like this having the authority and discretion to search our vehicle, homes, person. We wont even bring up the use of tasers.
 
Guy Guys...only a fool would fail to see that there are many many many things to be learned from this... and that is the way with most things.... AND, there is a BIG difference between theory and experience... and usually when theory speaks to experience, or experience speaks to theory... you have sparks....and we all lose, by missing to learn something new..... We are all faceless here, and in person, I would guess we all would agree more...and ALL come away better men.
 
I can see 120 or so reasons why all officers involved need to be fired. That video shows just how STUPID that group of officers are. They are not police material, nada, nope.
All of 'em? Gee whiz, that seems so ... harsh ... Tasers? I didn't see any tasers on the video ...
Anyway -- here we have it, folks; the definitive answer from one of our experts. Case closed, no further posts necessary.
 
i cna't believe there is argument over this.
to quote master blaster-
4. know your target and what is beyond

UNARMED suspects. UNARMED- the only reason they fired, the cops fired at each other, and fired back. and back.
UNARMEDUNARMEDUNARMEDUNARMEDUNARMEDUNARMED
UNARMEDUNARMEDUNARMEDUNARMEDUNARMED

Stopped vehicle!!! even better! now everyone will want to pull over when the police flag them down!
dont worry, pull over, you WILL be SHOT.

LA man, got to love it. sadly, a good deal of this rests on the crazy gangster menality that has these cops so hopped up in the first place
 
Lunaslide & Vernal

What experience and training do you base your assessments on?
 
It doesn't take advanced training or years of experience to know you don't shoot across a roadway when your colleagues are standing on the other side of the street. I think the crazy guy who cuts my grass in a red top hat knows better than that.
 
I've noticed a tendency on the board for a lot of folks to jump all over these kinds of events and start screaming "police state." I'm as nervous as the next guy at the idea of a police state. I've never been a cop. Never been on the giving or recieving end of angry fire, thank God. But I can see how something like this happens.

These guys were (according to the news report I saw) responding to a report of a guy with a gun . They had been chasing the guy for a long time. He stopped because the cops used the spike strips. Cops approach the car. BANG! Round goes off. You've been to all the training that we all have been to, or read about, or whatever. Action beats reaction. OODA loop. Keep shooting until the target stops. You have like 12 cops there. They pull their guns and keep shooting. 120 rounds adds up in a hurry. Can anyone honestly say that in that circumstance they would take their time and wait and verify the threat (keep in mind that you are already behind action now. Someone may be shooting at you), or would you pull your weapon, trust that your partner knew that there was a threat, and empty your magazine?

It isn't right, and it isn't smart, but it happens. I've met my share of JBTs, but most of the cops I know and have met are just guys and gals doing a very, very tough job and trying to go home to their families. The problem, IMHO, isn't one of "cops can be trusted and people can't" but one of politicians who write laws that make cops into super-heros. Don't take out your anger on the police who enforce the laws; take it out on the pols who make the laws that say cops can be trusted with guns and citizens can't, or whatever.
 
I can see 120 or so reasons why all officers involved need to be fired. That video shows just how STUPID that group of officers are. They are not police material, nada, nope.
Wow, that sure is some vision. I guess you vision is much better than your typing because you didn't even write one of your 120 reasons for us. On this board you need to put up or shut up, for a lack of better words.

How did they know the guy was unarmed Thorn? Oh that was after the fact. The guy had bad luck that they were looking for a shooting suspect when he started driving erratically all across the neighborhood. Again, bad luck does play into these scenarios. He made a bad call on when to run from the cops. It happens.

Don't take out your anger on the police who enforce the laws; take it out on the pols who make the laws that say cops can be trusted with guns and citizens can't, or whatever.
I couldn't have said it better myself. Welcome to THR gcerbone. Please stick around.
 
Just a thought on the number of rounds fired.

Perhaps the officers thought that their pistols should have stopped the SUV and/or the driver.

When this didn't happen with a small number of rounds they continued to shoot. Applying more of the same while hoping for a different outcome.

I get the impression they have had little or no training on what to expect when attempting to defeat auto bodies and glass with small arms. I could be wrong, but I don't think so.

I would hope when the dust settles this will become a mandatory training video. There is much to learn from this incident.

flatdog
 
I haven't really been following this case, but was the guy in the SUV the guy that they were actually looking for, or was he just unlucky enough to be breaking the law in a similar vehicle?
 
I haven't really been following this case, but was the guy in the SUV the guy that they were actually looking for, or was he just unlucky enough to be breaking the law in a similar vehicle?

If it's the latter...that's gonna be a nasty lawsuit for the deparment.
 
He was just unlucky enough to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. However, he failed to stop, even when hastily barracaded by patrol cars and he was found to be under the influence of something, so I would seriously doubt he is going to be filing any kind of lawsuit. The initial cop that fired probably did have reason to fear for his life. I think they are going to rule it as justified based on that and the general nature of police backing each other up just turned it into a 120 round barrage. Tough luck, but good luck you only get hit 4 times and live!
 
I think that it's LA County Sheriff, not LAPD as some have stated.
LAPD just would have used their flashlights on the guy :D :D :D
 
The title of this thread should be changed from:

Video Captures Dramatic L.A. Shootout

To:
Meet the Worlds Luckiest LEOs
Bunch of LEOs shooting in the direction of each other and only one got hit(other than the suspect)??? These guys need to either go to church and thank the big guy or dump their paychecks on the lottery.
 
Pronunciation: 'shüt-"aut
Function: noun
1 : a battle fought with handguns or rifles


I don't think "dramatic L.A. shootout" fits.
 
Personally, I don’t blame the deputies for their poor performance all that much. Their boss is either a fool or a liar, so why should I expect them to be well trained?

~G. Fink
 
How did they know the guy was unarmed Thorn?

whaaaaat?


ok i guess if guy is running you can shoot him.
i guess if someone is a shooting suspect, cops are now authorized to kill suspect on sight (whether or not they have actual proof they got the right guy, or guy is even guilty) even if he is not violent when police find him.

EVEN with all that aside-
the guy did finally stop, and where is him acting like he's gonna shoot??

i just hope none of us ever look to much like a shooting suspect or happen to be driving the same type car as one.
sure, maybe this guy deserved it, but do you really want cops being the judges, shooting like that? i can't believe anyone is going to any trouble to defend these horrible examples of well trained officers.
 
i just hope none of us ever look to much like a shooting suspect or happen to be driving the same type car as one.
You convienently leave out the fact that they chased him for 20 minutes and he failed to stop before they finally shot at the vehicle. I can look like shooting suspect or drive a shooting suspects car all I want because when a cop car pulls up behind me with its lights on and over the loud speaker tells me to stop, I will stop and comply with their requests. Imagine that.

i can't believe anyone is going to any trouble to defend these horrible examples of well trained officers.
I know, I shouldn't let facts get in the way of this cop bash.
 
We just had an officer involved car shooting up here in Kern County. Here is an exerpt from the local news paper.
Shooting death of suspect ruled within policy in sheriff's review

An officer-involved shooting that resulted in a man's death was ruled within department policy by the Kern County Sheriff's Department, according to a Wednesday news release.

Larry Don Tripp, 45, was shot to death just before 4:30 p.m. on May 1 by Sheriff's Deputy Victor Garcia and two California Highway Patrol officers in the Lake Isabella area.

Tripp had led officers on a car chase and rammed into Garcia's patrol car. The CHP has not yet announced the results of their shooting review of their officers' actions.
Now they haven't released the details yet, but they have been showing footage on the local news. There are two bullet holes in the front windshield, that is it. Also you can clearly see his squad car is directly broad side in the path of the suspect's Ford Ranger truck.

You see in Kern County our officers know how to shoot. They don't take a whole magazine from 10 officers to wound the guy. It just takes one to three officers, some well placed shots, and the vehicle stops. So yes it might be hard to stop a moving vehicle, but it is most certainly possible.

I will try to post more on this if the info becomes available. I think it is an interesting contrast to what happened in LA County only 100 miles away in Kern County.
 
El Rojo....yes it worked, this time, does it work every time... no...nothing does... the CHP normally uses "enough" gun. and as always, you fire until the threat is no long a threat....be it 2 or 200.
 
Action beats reaction. OODA loop. Keep shooting until the target stops.
I don't know much about the incident and have no comments regarding it. But I would like to point out that the above statement is a mischaracterization of the OODA loop.

Boyd himself considered "orientation," not "action" (especially uncoordinated action), to be the most important of the four phases he defined.
 
i have to admit that was a very bad case of crossfire. i watched the video twice and saw officers on both sides of the street shooting as the vehicle crossed the plane where the officers would place each other in opposing backdrop.

luckily no officers were killed. i hope LASD has a training bulletin on this one!
 
I am tired of this OODA loop crap. The OODA is for military applications. wonder why the cops are using it. Couldnt be police going military on us.

The OODA loop (Observe, Orient, Decide, and Act) is an information strategy concept for information warfare developed by Colonel John Boyd (1927-1997). Although the OODA model was clearly created for military purposes, elements of the same theory can also be applied to business strategy

http://www.valuebasedmanagement.net/methods_boyd_ooda_loop.html
 
I am tired of this OODA loop crap. The OODA is for military applications.

It would seem the OODA loop applies to any process involving Observation, Orientation, Decision and Action - in other words pretty much 99% of the processes involved with life on this planet.

wonder why the cops are using it. Couldnt be police going military on us.

The link you provided even mentions it being applied to business strategy. Is this an example of our commerce becoming militarized or is it possible that a strategy based on such simple building blocks can be broadly applied to a wide range of things?

Tell me, did you really fail to grasp such an inherently simple alternate explanation or do you take some joy at being an outlandish satire of those who have concerns about law enforcement abuse of power?
 
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