Virginia CCW Permit process - need some help

[lucky_fool]

I'm currently talking with Delegates Scott Lingamfelter and Bill Janis about potential legislation that would add a penalty for localities who do not issue a concealed handgun permit within the 45 day limit established by law. I'm recommending a full refund of all application fees.

Right now Virginia law states that the local court must issue or decline the permit within 45 days of the application, but there is no penalty for noncompliance. There is some good - if you have not been approved or declined within 45 days the court clerk is to notarize your appplication to serve as a de facto permit, but that requires yet another trip to the courts building. This means you have to take more time off work to go to the court, which not everyone has the luxury of doing. I'm thinking that getting your $50 back would just about cover the hassle.

I'm trying to find specific examples of the permit process taking over 45 days to send to the delegates. I have a couple, but more is better. If you folks in Virginia have any specific stories of the permit process taking longer than it should have, please send them my way.

 

[scout26]

How about a penalty also ?? Like something in the $250 - $500 dollar range. And a written explanation/apology for the delay.

 

[Hobie]

How about talking to VCDL? They likely can provide all the answers to your questions.

 

[Leatherneck]

Second Hobie's motion. Phil Van Cleave should be aware of where the slow spots are--Henrico County comes to mind.

My personal experience with PW County has been acceptable.
TC

 

[countertop]

It took 50 days for me to get mine in Fairfax. Its in violation of the law, but being a lawyer, I didn't think it was an unreasonable delay.

I know some localities are pretty bad - Arlington/Alexandria and down by Newport News/Virginia Beach area. Check in with VCDL, they can help you out (and might have advice on the strategy to pursue).

I like the idea of a penalty - make it mandatory - only concern there (and with getting money back or challenging the court) is you then need to sue the court your self. What are the chances of a judge ruling against himself???

 

[John Hicks]

Also in FFX Co. Submitted on Jan 6, picked up permit on Jan 23. Granted, that was a renewal from an older Arlington permit (thank God I moved out of that liberal hellhole -- they actually fingerprinted me, which FFX does not require).

The refund idea seems the most fair. Any additional compensation would not make it through the legislature.

 

[lucky_fool]

Thanks everybody. I'll probably send Phil an email later, but it's looking like this will have to wait until next year since the deadline for new legislation has passed. That's what I get for waiting until the last minute.

What got me started on this was my permit application taking 52 days to get approved. I know that really isn't much over the deadline, but you guys pay your county property taxes a week late and see if you don't get penalized for it. What's good for the goose ought to be good for the gander.

Also, since VA is a shall-issue state with the same requirements for a CHP as a gun purchase (plus a training requirement), the permit background check shouldn't realistically take much longer than the NICS check. Forty-five days should give them plenty of time.

Leatherneck, I'm in Henrico. I can vouch for them being slow.

 

[mtnbkr]

Second Hobie's motion. Phil Van Cleave should be aware of where the slow spots are--Henrico County comes to mind.

My personal experience with PW County has been acceptable.
TC

PW/Manassas rocks. When I went for my 5yr update, they were friendly and helpful and I got my new permit in about two weeks.

Chris

 

[Bubbles]

...it's looking like this will have to wait until next year since the deadline for new legislation has passed...

Actually the deadline was last Friday.

Don't wait until next year to start writing this bill. Once the session is over the folks at VCDL and any interested Delegates will have more time to help draft it. Then they can submit it at the start of the 2007 session.

 

[Smurfslayer]

Who would be the 'criminal' ?

If you are going to assert a penalty for a violation of 18.2-308, by statutory construction, wouldn't it be a class 1 misdemeanor (as the 'default' penalty in the first paragraph) ? Here is the current problem.

There are too many chefs in the kitchen in the VA 'shall issue' law. The clerk receives the application, and some clerks put restrictions on when they will accept them. Some then "pipe out" the application(s) to the sheriff, PD, or commonwealths attorney... or all 3. Assuming it comes back from one or more of those with no objections, it gets put in a stack waiting for a judge to sign.

I would like to see a penalty assigned to the failure to issue on time, on a graduated scale. First, however, we need to reduce the amount of issuance time to under 40 days. I think 30 is reasonable. There is no jurisdiction processing so many permits that they are unable to meet a deadline, it's simply that they are too lazy to do it. If they exceed the statutory limit for issuance of the permit, the locality should be compelled to refund the applicant's fee for the application, plus a fee for every day beyond the statutory limit has passed. Oh, and we should get a "court processing fee" of $75 as well, just like traffic court

 

[scout26]

We're having a similiar problem in Illinois with FOID cards. Here's the legislative solution:


http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/BillStatus.asp?DocTypeID=HB&DocNum=136&GAID=8&SessionID=50&LegID=14312

$500-$1000 per DAY

 

[hugh damright]

If my County was delinquent in giving me a CCW permit, would an individual such as the Clerk of Court have to pay the fine out of his own money, or would the County have to pay the fine out of the County budget? I am thinking that it wouldn't provide much incentive for an individual to get with the CCW program if he delayed the process and others had to pay a fine.