Was the M1 Carbine a more advanced weapon than the Garand?

[Vern Humphrey]

I have used the carbine in combat -- as an Adviser to the ARVN on my first tour, it was my issue weapon. Mine got wrapped around a tree, and I borrowed a Garand from the ARVN.

The Garand is superior in combat:

PENETRATION is the key to combat effectiveness. People WILL get behind things when you are shooting at them, and you need a rifle that will shoot through barriers.
People hit with the Garand tend to stay hit. With the carbine, not so much.
The Garand is much more accurate -- the carbine's method of attaching the stock results in poor accuracy.

IF Ordnance had specified a cartridge similar to the 5.56X45mm (.223 Remington) and had the carbine built for that, it would have been a better weapon.

 

[cluttonfred]

Thanks, Vern, first-hand experience is invaluable in this sort of discussion. I am curious, would you have taken a 1911 pistol over that M1 Carbine, since that was the alternative in WWII?

I have used the carbine in combat -- as an Adviser to the ARVN on my first tour, it was my issue weapon. Mine got wrapped around a tree, and I borrowed a Garand from the ARVN.

 

[Mr. Zorg]

I wonder if combat officers had the latitude to select a Garand or Thompson / Grease Gun if they so desired in WWII?

 

[Poper]

It's a bit like asking whether asparagus or avocados are a better vegetable.

Well, seeing as how avocados are fruit, I guess the asparagus wins that debate by default, does it not?

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Thanks, Vern, first-hand experience is invaluable in this sort of discussion. I am curious, would you have taken a 1911 pistol over that M1 Carbine, since that was the alternative in WWII?

That would be a tough choice -- although at the time I carried a privately-owned Colt M357, and that was the gun I used when the carbine failed to put down a VC at close range.

 

[cluttonfred]

Interesting, were you able to use hollow points or soft lead bullets in revolver rather than FMJ ball?

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Interesting, were you able to use hollow points or soft lead bullets in revolver rather than FMJ ball?

I took about 500 handloads with me -- and kept my mouth shut about what I was carrying.

But if you're interested, a hollow-base wadcutter, loaded backward and propelled by all the Unique you dare will do the job.

Leads the barrel something fierce, though

 

[cluttonfred]

Interesting, thanks Vern.

 

[AlexanderA]

I wonder if combat officers had the latitude to select a Garand or Thompson / Grease Gun if they so desired in WWII?

Once they got into combat, anything was possible. My late father-in-law, who was a sergeant in the North African Theater, was initially issued a Thompson but swapped it for a Garand the first chance he got. He said that in North Africa, you needed the range. (He was injured when the motorcycle he was riding skidded on an oil slick, ended up in a British military hospital in Egypt, was recruited there by the OSS, and was dropped behind German lines in the Balkans. That's where he won a Silver Star.)

 

[mgmorden]

From a technological standpoint, absolutely. Honestly the M2 Carbine (select fire update to the M1 also introduced during WW2) would have effectively been a modern assault rifle if they'd have just went with a slightly more powerful cartridge.

 

[kBob]

This thread begins to remind me of one of my Grandparents sayings,

"... and if a Toady Frog had wings he wouldn't aught'na bump his tail so much!"

-kBob

 

[Vern Humphrey]

This thread begins to remind me of one of my Grandparents sayings,

"... and if a Toady Frog had wings he wouldn't aught'na bump his tail so much!"

-kBob

Or if he had a square rectum and a muddy apatite, he could make bricks and become building contractor.