After seeing several hits, I dropped the thing and used my Colt M357 and finally put the customer down. Earlier I had seen it fail to penetrate heavy brush, logs and other obstacles -- penetration is a must in a combat weapon, especially in jungle.
It's going even faster than Tokarev, and that stuff is horrifically penetrative. The 30Carbine jackets don't come apart at those those speeds do they (I figured they didn't to abide by Geneva)? Unless those guys were imbued with caliber-selective bullet-blocking Boxer magic, I just don't understand the under-penetration thing --unless of course you are comparing it to the far more powerful 30-06 which has more "interesting" effects on soft tissue in addition to penetration that a pistol-range round simply can't compete with (357 may, too, since it is borderline rifle rather than borderline pistol power). In that case, it's kind of apples/oranges, and an orange was needed instead of an apple in your particular situation.They are right fast.
"But submachine guns were really intended to be cheap and easily mass produced."
On that Suomi M31; pretty much that entire receiver (the torch cut piece) was machined from a single massive forging. They bored out the interior of the tube with some crazy stepped reamer, machined the sides of the lower and the tube profile, turned the endcap threads and barrel shroud lugs, riveted on the stock tang and the front/rear faces of the magwell, polished everything to the point no tooling marks or rivets are visible, then oven-hardened the steel to something like 60 Rockwell before bluing them. The bolts were around 70 Rockwell.
For what was basically a piece of pipe, a lump of steel, a barrel, and a spring, the Finns really threw everything at it. But, they ran fantastically, would hold 10" groups at 20 meters on full auto, and contributed greatly to the upper body strength of the Finnish fighting force
TCB
*Maybe not the Japanese; did they ever make an SMG?
I'm sure many through and through wounds have been inflicted by the .30 carbine. But this guy kept moving after being hit repeatedly.
So you fly the collection of randomly moving parts, huh?I have a number of M1/M2 Carbines.
At work, in front of my helicopter, doing my Sergeant Schultz impersonation with my friends MP40.
All my life people have asked me, "Why would you jump out of a perfectly good airplane?"
This episode was not to mix "apples and oranges", which I assume meant M-1 Carbine (lower powered short rifle) against the M-1 Rifle (different caliber & more powerful -.30-06). The main point being the M-1 Carbine, although being a good carbine, it has its limitations. Everybody knows the M-1 Garand is a more powerful standard "battle" rifle, especially in the WWII & Korean War periods. The M-1 Carbine was to be a "personal defense weapon", to replace the standard handgun of the period (1911 .45ACP), in certain instances. "Powerful", as it relates to the 9mm, equates to the larger (.38 cal.) hole, compared to .30 cal. one. The carbine's velocity is 1,990 fps., and 9mm 1,110 to 1,500 fps. Slightly higher speed not the deciding factor. Possibly more later.
)
). That said, I am also certain that small piercing rounds like 30 will have a less than dramatic effect on a target, regardless of what they are doing to its insides, compared to a larger one (combination of momentum transfer and target's awareness of an injury both causing more obvious external reactions). It's not like a 9mm FMJ at 50yds is gonna make a guy do a backflip by comparison, though That's a 206L4. The Bell 206 was a fine machine. I have about 16,000 hours in the B, L, L1, L4 models and another 6,000 hours in other helicopters and airplanes. Much of that time was flying over the Gulf of Mexico. Even though I had a number of major mechanical failures my bird never put me in the water. Always ran long enough to get me to shore or a oil platform.
