What caliber would penetrate a windshield?

[leadcounsel]

Fiction.

I've personally fired 9mm and .45 through windshields. Due to the angle bullets tend to deflect to an extent.

The reality is that slower, heavier bullets actually perform better at angled windshield penetration. Faster lighter bullets still penetrate, but not as reliably and tend to deflect more.

 

[mgregg85]

I remember watching Future Weapons show and the host said that 5.56x45 would just bounce right off car windows. Sounded like pure BS to me but then again, i've never shot at a car window before. I think that was the episode featuring the 6.5 grendel.

 

[oldfool]

most any centerfire round... and quite frequently even rimfire rounds ... will penetrate windshields, if hit pretty much square on. Anybody who ever shot up a junk car knows that. Some handgun rounds may not have a lot of spiz left after, but most centerfire rifle rounds do. Car doors are about as tough as soda pop cans.

Vehicles make for lousy cover in a gunfight
find a tree instead

 

[Hatterasguy]

Its hit and miss with a lot of variables. Still being inside a car that's not mobile is just about the worst place to be in a shoot out.

Overall rifle rounds have a much better chance of chewing up a car by default since they have more power. I have seen some nasty after action photo's of a Suburban that was chewed up with 5.56 rounds and they had enough balls to still turn the drivers head inside out and exit through the windshield after going through the truck and a few seats. I have seen the same with .30 carbine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ummnOoSfd54
OTOH you can fire a lot of rounds and have almost no affect.

 

[alohachris]

But when it's raining, the .45 ACp will penetrate right through a windshield due to the hydrostatic shock...

 

[Justin Holder]

I've put .22lr though several windshields (goofing off as a youngster with friends at a local junk yard).

I second this.

 

[devildave31]

The Texas DPS used to issue .357 Magnums and they loved them. Worked well on people as well as car doors and windshields. They went to Sig P220s in .45, and liked the .45's performance on people, but it sucked on car doors and windshields. So they switched to .357 Sig, which replicates the performance from a 4" revolver of the 125g .357 Mag loads.

Apparently, it works just fine going through cars, windshields, and people. I know of one where the shot penetrated the rear windshield, the headrest and whacked the BG in the head. Sig P226, .357 Sig.

If I remember corrctly, this was why .38 super was developed. Originally the .45 did well against unarmored troops in the open, however some of the people being fought against in The Phillipines would wrap vines around their torsos for armor and in the jungle even small (4 in) trees were stopping .45. the .38 super was desined to penetrate light armor, (cars, trees, etc.) specifically to fill that niche. It was originally desined for a 1911 pistol for the military.

 

[gym]

It depends on the angle that the round hits the winshield at. 38's have deflected off and 22's have penetrated, all depends on the angle of entry.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

O.K. So far, it all depends on the angle. It also all depends on the velocity. But it also ALL depends on the mass. AND the bullet style. But don't forget about the glass composition. It also ALL DEPENDS on that, too.

 

[gym]

Yep that's about it SDM. It all depends

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

I thought I'd be a lot older before I had to rely on "Depends"............

 

[Buck Snort]

Many years ago I lived in Visalia, CA and there was a "Stop & Rob" grocery just down the street from my apartment. One nite a couple of guys pulled a stickup and jumped into their car to make the gittaway. The clerk stepped out the front door and directed a 38 spec. round at the fleeing car only to have the bullet richochet off the rear window, fly down the street, blow through a bathroom window of another apartment (not mine), and land in the sink whilst a guy was shaving. Needless to say he was a bit surprised by that turn of events.

 

[Cards81fan]

The proof is in the pudding:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjxxQXxdd3k

This is video from a tactical training class here in Oklahoma (no affiliation aside from the guy holding the class, Wes Elliot, was my CHL course instructor). My understanding is that these were all duty weapons, so mostly 9mm or .40 here in OK. Maybe a .45 or .357 SIG in there.

 

[doc2rn]

I have accompanied a friend to shoot at the fron half of a chevy van. Every round went through the windshield as ironman has stated. .22 lr, .22 wmr, .223, 38 spec, 357 mag, 30-30, and 25-06. The .22 lr was the jaw dropper as everyone thought it would bounce off, but it went through clean and it also will penitrate a door.

 

[Kachok]

The 5.56 does not bounce off a windsheild, it breaks it but has heavy deflection. Basicly it won't be headed the same difection after going through, glass deflection is exactly like brush deflection, it you want to avoid it here are the 4 steps. 1 use a larger caliber. 2 use a flat nose bullet 3 use a HEAVY bullet 4 use low speed bullet. The 223 breaks all these rules so hence its deflection it really bad. The .50 Baowolf does it all right and will maintain a reasonable level of accuracy shooting through brush, glass, and people LOL Why do you think the 30-30 and 45-70 have been around so long? Heavy, flat nose, low speed bullets. Hunters call them brush guns.

 

[Shadow 7D]

Go look up Buick of Truth
they work and go mostly through, and they DID it, not theories, those are nice, but like wishes, don't hold much water.

 

[sig220mw]

I helped a guy break his driver side window one morning. He had been drinking and locked himself out. We took turns banging on that window with his tire tool for probably 45 minutes. I was wishing that I had a pistol when he finally managed to break it. That blasted tempered glass is tough. We probably could have done it quicker with a sledge or other heavy hammer.

It made me much more skeptical of the television shows that show some one easily breaking a car window.

 

[millertyme]

but any type angle thet will not

So, any angle like 91 degrees. Even a right angle is still an angle.

If I fire my M1 Garand at an angle oblique enough to the windshield the bullet will skip off the glass

This is probably the most correct answer. As for the cop, well, they're cops, not physicists. Go ask a community college physics professor to model it for you. I imagine a .177 caliber BB gun would go through a windshield at the propers angle.

 

[coloradokevin]

There are other variables than caliber involved in answering this question. Bullet construction/design also plays a big part.

Honestly, based on what I've seen the 9mm and .45 are both about equally suited for shooting through windshield glass using the standard duty loads that most LEO's carry. I've attended one of the ATK Wound Ballistic workshops in the past (ATK owns Speer/Federal), and we fired 9mm/45/.223/12ga slugs through windshield glass at calibrated ballistic gelatin.

Windshield glass isn't a great medium to shoot through, but our data put the 9mm and .45 on a nearly equal playing field during these tests. If you REALLY want windshield penetration, try carrying a 12 gauge slug gun... In our slug test the projectile went through the windshield, passed through the gelatin block entirely, and then struck the ceiling armor in our range, 20 yards away.

The 5.56 does not bounce off a windsheild, it breaks it but has heavy deflection. Basicly it won't be headed the same difection after going through, glass deflection is exactly like brush deflection, it you want to avoid it here are the 4 steps. 1 use a larger caliber. 2 use a flat nose bullet 3 use a HEAVY bullet 4 use low speed bullet. The 223 breaks all these rules so hence its deflection it really bad.

While I agree that the heavy and slow bullet (12 gauge slug) performed better in these tests than the fast small bullet (.223), I have to say that our tests showed minimal deflection with the .223. The problem we experienced with the .223 was more related to bullet failure, as some of the bullets ultimately came apart in the gelatin block, thereby limiting penetration. In our case the expensive bonded bullets performed best, though we didn't test FMJ bullets (which my department doesn't allow). Still, the bullets impacted where they were intended to on the gelatin block, after having penetrated the glass.

 

[Harley Quinn]

OP and 45 cal, it is notorious for not penetrating in many tests...FMJ designed "pistol bullets" are not good for it either according to many...
Jim Cirillo book is good one...
http://www.amazon.com/Jim-Cirillo-Modern-Day-Gunfighter-Gunfighting/dp/087364896X

Dated though, his design of bullets for going through windshields, 38 cal...

Semi wad cutter designed fairly hard lead is good, sticks and goes through, must be moving at a good clip, 357 SIG in pistol are good imho...

Catch 22 situation about weight, speed and design, why so many LEO have gone the 40 Cal ...
Shooting at windshields is not a good thing, movies are for hollywood...

Regards

 

[Diggers]

Here are real test results for this question.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/buickot2.htm

After you look at this, go to the main page and look at all the other car shooting tests. Interesting to see.

 

[Kachok]

Exactly like I said the slower heavier larger claiber will have less deflection, although I would not call this a true scientific test the results are consistant with what hunters have known for many years. Copper shotgun slugs and .50 cal handguns will make minced meat out of temperd glass, as will a .700 Nitro

 

[gym]

I didn't know we were relying on it, I thought it was just an arbitrary question, SDM

 

[mokin]

Back in high school some friends and I shot up an abandoned car. We started with our .22s and worked our way up to an 8mm Mauser and a 12 guage. I don't remember anything having trouble penetrating body panels and even the .22s penetrated the windshield when the angle was correct. All it took was one .22 shot to spiderweb the entire rear window. All the centerfire rounds penetrated both sides of the car and, near as we could tell, bumper to bumper if the engine didn't get in the way. Too much fun that day.

As the OP we were to young to carry handguns....