What if you owned Colt and, wanted to make revolvers again?

[Mr_Mike]

My understanding is that they left the revolver business due a loss of profits in a market dominated by S& W, Ruger and, Taurus.

If you were the head of Colt, what would you do to get back in the game?

Bring back the old favorites, or come up with something new? Keep the snake names? How about a Colt Mamba? Could the old names be used for new revolvers? Perhaps the Cobra II to compete with the Ruger SP101?

How about an Anaconda in .45 acp? Of make a dedicated .45acp frame without the gap between the frame and, cylinder. How about a concealed carry style Python, or King Cobra in .45 acp?

 

[Ala Dan]

Well, I would line me up some good qualified Smith's (gunsmith's that is)
and get at it; while try'in too be better than the old company~!

Yes, I think I would take a close look at the manufacturing process- and
determine which equipment would be useful (or salvageable); and what I
would need to replace. I think I also would look up some of the "old heads"
that worked on the production line, and speak with them 'bout how I might
improve on the quality of the old Colt's of yester year.

 

[larry starling]

Bring back the Python made with modern C-N-C machinery so as to make it affordable. Let's face the average Joe isn't going to pay $1000+ for a wheel gun. Bring back the Anaconda and the King Cobra! and a modern replacement for the Detective Special as well.......

 

[Eightball]

Use coil springs, for starters. And get things so that the machining was superb, bring back the deep bluing, and offer custom shop stuff.

But first I'd fix all the other issues Colt has had over the years, and make their ARs "normal," and sell things to the public again. But that's a different rant.

Back on topic--maybe offer different "grades" of things, rather than only "incredibly expensive" options.

 

[PotatoJudge]

They'd need designs that use modern, less expensive lockwork. Something easy to clean, tune, and customize would give them an edge. A gripframe more like Ruger SP101 or Dan Wessons would be nice for grip versatility and interchangeability. They would be most likely to make money with the D frame, internal or bobbed hammer, aluminum frame, matte blue or stainless, with a decent front sight (tritium, fiber optic, or interchangeable inserts like Dan Wessons). Next, they should come out with a workhorse 357 offered in a nice blue or stainless, full and half underlug, offered in 6 or 7 shot. The frame should be designed with the heft and handling of a K frame but the durability of an L frame. They can fill the gaps in the S&W line and have the advantage of non-crush fit barrels and no lock.

 

[Hawk]

First: Order up a harsh and realistic appraisal of existing tooling and fixtures. Make sure the stuff applicable to the more automated portion of the product line is servicable. Analyze the old stuff that produced parts needing hand fitting for upgrade to CNC, EDM etc.

Have some desk signs printed up stating: "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over while expecting a different result". Hand one to every senior staff member that elects to go along with the relocation and is worth taking.

If the Python equipment can't be reasonably updated to eliminate 80% of the hand work, try to sell the name and fixtures to someone into boutique arms. Resurrecting the Python as before is a non-starter, refer to desk sign.

Relocate. South Dakota, Montana, Texas - anywhere that's more gun-friendly, less heavily taxed and, while we're at it, "right to work".

Parachute out any whiners.

Strike a deal with some foreign plastic fantastic, hire real salesmen and snatch back a chunk of the police market while Gaston and S&W are having lunch. Alternatively, hire (steal) some designers, maybe from Beretta, Apple and Frog Design (think outside the box) and implement locally with polymer and drop-in parts. Don't let anyone forget institutional procurement is low-bid driven and nobody will pay extra for a picture of a horse eating a stick.

Get ISO9001 cert.

Provide multi-tiered revolvers with the base line price competitive with current S&W. Anybody wanting a royal blue can pony up (oops, pun) for custom shop upcharges.

It'd probably be best to consider jettisoning the Python as a sop to current collectors - a new version, indistinguishable from the last, would hose the collector market and probably annoy everyone that paid 1600.00 for a 700.00 handgun. Or keep it as a boutique offering with nosebleed pricing.

 

[Johnny Guest]

Colt's revolvers resurrected?

Surely, a worthy endeavour. About the first thing they'd have to do is leave Connecticut and go somewhere the unions wouldn't be determined to kill the goose laying the golden eggs.

I agree about using a lot of CNC work to reduce the hand fitting. I am really not qualified to propose economic solutions for the fine old company. I CAN make some suggestions about products:

By all means, produce the Python and keep the Single Action Army. Both need to incorporate all the modern cost-saving techniques.

For the concealed carry consumer, They really need to revive the D-frame line, in both all steel (Detective Special and Police Positive Special) and in light alloy versions (Cobra and Agent, each with both two- and three-inch barrels.) I think I'd issue all the double action guns in "Field" or "Service" grade at minimum cost, and also in a high polish "Custom" grade for a significant premium. I think there are many who would like to carry a Colt but don't want to pay for a collectors' item.

I'd start out with only blue and nickel platel, and see if there's enough market demand to bring out stainless steel versions. Another way to reduce production cost on the SAA would be to offer a version in a dull gray finish with "distressed" stocks, one piece wood and also black hard rubber showing a lot of wear. I believe this latter version would get a lot of play from the SASS contestants.

To begin with, I'd NOT produce the Anaconda, King Cobra, Diamondback, Trooper, nor Officers Model Match. Let the Python be the only adjustable sight revolver for the first several years. Less machining and fitting with non-adjustable sights.

Not a revolver, of course, but I hope that Colt's is setting up to issue a Centennial 1911, very plain and tastefully done with a small rollmark but no stupid plating or etching. Perhaps a GI version and a commercial version, too. And while I'm straying over to autoloaders, I'd love to see Colt's produce a alloy framed version of the 1908 Pocket Model .380.

Best,
Johnny

 

[Beagle-zebub]

Maybe this is a bad idea, but I think that Colt might be able to attack the market for double-action .44 magnums. The S&W 629 is a smooth revolver, but is not built for "Ruger only" loads; the Ruger Redhawk is, but its one spring functions as both hammer and return, while the improved Super version is just plain ugly. Dan Wesson is out of the market of ultra-strong .44s, and I don't think that buyers would confuse the quality-level of Colt versus that of Ruger. This is kind of the niche that Dan Wesson had, but (I'm guessing) they didn't have the name-recognition among non-experts that Colt, S&W, or even Ruger does, in addition to Dan's machines wearing out and silhouette shooters moving on.

 

[TimboKhan]

If you were the head of Colt, what would you do to get back in the game

If I was the current head of Colt, I would fire myself immediately and make room for someone with vision.

Honestly, Colt infuriates me. They are COLT for crying out loud! Why Colt isn't a viable name in the modern handgun market absolutely boggles me. I know they went through a rough patch, but they are the original 1911 makers. They are the original SAA makers, The Python and all the rest are legendary guns. Everyone knows the Colt name, and I do mean everyone. I simply fail to understand why someone hasn't purchased Colt, said "Get out" to all the apparent defeatists there, and revitalized a great American company. I would happily buy Colt, but you either have to be a military or a government contract to merit attention. Honestly, I know that they are producing guns for us civilians, but I don't remember the last time I saw a new Colt.

Very frustrating.

 

[Boats]

First, re-open the revolver division in some other state

Second, scrap all of the old designs as unworkable at targeted price points.

CAD clean sheet designs with retro Colt design touches, but total drop in modularity. Design the parts so that finish fitting is held to a minimum. Keep the cylinder going the "wrong" way, keep the cylinder release shaped like it was, (I for one like it a lot).

Let the past die. New Models require new names. This serves to minimize market confusion over older era revolvers versus new production as well as downplay inevitable comparisons between, say, old and new Pythons.

I do have an exception:

New Service=Duty framed .357 Mag on par with 586/686 and Ruger GP-100 series. My naming exception and the model I would start with.

Magnum Carry=Old Detective Special size. This name barely got used before the demise of Colt's revolvers.

Saddlebred=Hunting/Defense revos of .44 Mag or larger.

Thoroughbred=Custom shop small script stamp for hand massaged revos across all frame sizes. Guaranteed accuracy verified by Ransom rest included with the stamp.

 

[Virginian]

First thing would be to find me a location that had a good workforce availability and was willing to give me a big tax abatement for opening shop there in a non-union environment.
After we get rolling, if the employees want a union that is fine with me, but I do not believe in closed shop. Hopefully I could be a good enough employer that they would no feel they needed one, but having been in a union I don't have a problem with the better ones.
Then decide how much equipment was left/available and how much was worth moving.
Do not need as many 'smiths as workers. To train a person to be the world's greatest barrel installer doth not make them a 'smith, etc.
Try to get some pictures of some government officials in compromising situations so I can get one of those hog at the trough contracts.
Start making Pythons, King Cobras, Anacondas, Detective Specials, SAAs, 1911s, and Mustangs available to John Q Public with higher quality, better service, and lower prices.

 

[EddieCoyle]

I guess I'll be the turd in the punchbowl:

First, move to a place where labor is cheaper. Labor will also be unskilled, so be prepared for a period of time where quality will suffer while everybody learns how to make revolvers.

Second, make a huge investment in machinery and equipment which will be nearly impossible to recoup, given the fact that the competition is incredibly well-entrenched. This will be doubly difficult after we get an early (and difficult to shake) reputation for poor quality (see above).

Third, redesign the lockwork to make it easier to manufacture. Be prepared for everybody with a keyboard complaining that "we don't make 'em like we used to" because skilled hand-fitting contributed to the feel of an old Colt, and that will be gone forever.

It's fun to think about, but Colt is not going to get back into the mass-produced DA revolver market. Joe Average is not going to spend any extra money to buy a Colt that's no better than a S&W or Ruger (or even a Taurus). The best we could hope for is that Colt decides to produce a limited number of DA revolvers in their custom shop for sale to enthusiasts like us. These would be expensive "boutique" guns, and we'd buy them.

 

[MrBorland]

Joe Average is not going to spend any extra money to buy a Colt that's no better than a S&W or Ruger (or even a Taurus). The best we could hope for is that Colt decides to produce a limited number of DA revolvers in their custom shop for sale to enthusiasts like us. These would be expensive "boutique" guns, and we'd buy them.

But Joe AboveAverage might just buy a Freedom Arms double action revolver, which is why I think FA ought to consider tapping into this market. Boutique? Yup? Expensive? Undoubtedly. Durable, high quality, highly accurate and American? You bet.

 

[slzy]

no tax abatement,big or small.

 

[researchdoc]

Get Dick Morrison back from Taurus. Bring back old favorites such as Python. Introduce new lines of CCW and Big Hunters. Watch the prices but don't sacrifice quality.

 

[tinygnat219]

Simple. Cost containment would be the biggest thing. I'd move the factory out of Connecticut and out of New England entirely, and to a state where I wouldn't have to deal with complete union dominance yet still had skilled labor. There are many such places throughout the Rust Belt where GM and Ford left factories to rust and die. Maybe somewhere else like Arizona, or VA.

Invest in some serious CNC machinery, and start making two models of revolver that I know would sell, the Python and the Detective Special out of both Stainless and Carbon Steel.

For the next step, I'd look at places where the market is underserved, like the slim single stack 9MM concealable market, and introduce an affordable reliable, pretty looking 9MM compact priced maybe a hundred bucks more than the PF-9. Have to be competitive on price, otherwise you fail.

For the third, start bringing back some of the classic designs: the Woodsman for one, others escape me right now.

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

Third, redesign the lockwork to make it easier to manufacture.

They already have - had - such a lockwork, the coil spring/transfer bar action of the Trooper MKIII, King Cobra, etc.

 

[Master Blaster]

They could start making colts again, how about an SAA at an affordable price that uses CNC machining to compete with Ruger?

They shouldnt try to make Rugers or smiths they should use the anaconda, trooper mkIII, and King Cobra designs and modern machining techniques, and make some custom shop pythons as well.

Ruger already makes Rugers better than Colt will be able too. Colt needs to make a Colt that is maybe $100-$200 more than a similar Ruger, and has extra finnishing done to it.

They need to make some guns that are shooters rather than closet filler/ collectors. That would mean getting some shooters out there in different competitions so the public can see their guns.

Guys Like Miculek, and Doug Koenig.

 

[woad_yurt]

Colt's name alone gives that company a leg up. Think of the name recognition; Colt could bring in new customers. Way back, Colt was known for serviceable, utilitarian products. The SAA was a tool, not a luxury. The same goes for the 1911. Why does a new Colt WWI replica cost $1000? Does it really have to cost that much? I'd consider buying something from them if it weren't priced so high. More reasonably priced 1911s or SAAs would sell like hotcakes. The most important move would be for them to open the windows and to get some fresh air in there.

 

[Hawk]

I'm sometimes taken aback but what I see in the ATF's domestic production reports. Colt might already be considered a "boutique" producer -

They made around 15,000 pistols in '06, contrast to Kimber at 60,000 or S&W at 223,000.

The put out just over 3,000 revolvers.

Market share in semis is around 1.5% and 0.8% in revolvers - counting only domestic production. Factor in Glock, XDs, Taurus and Ubertis and market share is likely under one point. Well under one point.

Dang. Didn't these guys used to have the lion's share of the market?

 

[woad_yurt]

A boutique producer! That was the phrase I needed. They should try making service weapons again. They'd sell. Lay off a few of the jewelers and hire some more people who can mill steel.

 

[Hawk]

Colt's name alone gives that company a leg up. Think of the name recognition; Colt could bring in new customers. Way back, Colt was known for serviceable, utilitarian products. The SAA was a tool, not a luxury. The same goes for the 1911. Why does a new Colt WWI replica cost $1000? Does it really have to cost that much? I'd consider buying something from them if it weren't priced so high. More reasonably priced 1911s or SAAs would sell like hotcakes. The most important move would be for them to open the windows and to get some fresh air in there.

Funny things abound about brand recognition and loyalty, at least anecdotally, in my little circle.

If one pays more for a 1911-ish product whether by STI, Baer, Brown or whatever as opposed to a Colt offering it's pretty much assumed that the buyer simply wanted such a product and was willing to pay for it. There will be the occasional observation that "you could have gotten a Colt for that", but such observations will be relatively rare.

However, if one purchases a Turnbull or STI single action for the same, or slightly over, Colt pricing there will be numerous observations that "you could have gotten a Colt for that". Renderings of horses eating sticks will be invoked and hosannas to resale will be sung.

If anybody understood how such things worked, and I don't think anyone does, most especially Colt's, they could derive more benefit from the loyalty being applied to their 15,000 per year semiautos rather than their 3,000 SAAs. Regrettably, no one understands how such things work or how their 1911 might be made to benefit from the warm glow that surrounds their SAA.

Some marketing sort should do a thesis on the phenomenon and perhaps turn it to advantage. What did they do with the SAA to inspire such loyalty (or what did they do with the 1911 to squander the loyalty)?

Perhaps simplistic but it occurs to me they could cash in the exuberance generated by the SAA by making more of them, provided they could do so without compromising current quality. Seems demand exceeds supply at least by a little bit.

 

[Colt46]

New Frontier

Modernize it with coil springs, but an Adustable sighted SAA would be a fine addition to any lineup.

 

[18DAI]

If Colt made revolvers without two piece barrels, or idiot locks, they could not keep up with the demand. This "average joe" would buy more than a few. So would many others.

I need a new Detective special, a Magnum Carry, and a Diamondback in 38 would be nice too. I wouldn't care if they were CNC made or had MIM in them either. TJ

 

[Fburgtx]

The Python's lockwork never was all that durable (compared to S & W's) and is still considered to be quite difficult to fix when problems arise. There's a reason why they developed the Trooper and the Anaconda. Cheaper and easier to produce. That still didn't make them competitive against S & W. The thing is, they don't have to compete in the law enforcement market anymore. Now, DA revolvers are a collector/shooter item (and can demand higher prices).

Considering the decline in S & W's fit and finish over the years, I think there would be some market for some limited offerings. I don't think that anyone would pay big money for a Trooper, but they might for an Anaconda (and they had the easier to produce lockwork). As for the Python, with all the work required to properly tune the things (think expensive labor), the prices would have to be pretty high. Maybe a Diamondback .22??????