What is going to come of our 2nd amendment?

[beeenbag]

I was looking at a poll I started along time ago, and is titled what is your age group and what do you carry.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=730140&page=12

My concern is this... the vast majority of the voters on that poll are 50+ years of age. That is a big concern, not that I do not feel very fortunate to have so many members with such wisdom and years of experience, but the shear lack of youth involved in our cause.

What will happen to the 2nd amendment with so many anti 2A politicians and a youth that is not involved?

What are some suggestions to get the younger populace involved?

I am a high school teacher and do everything I can to involve my students in not only politics, which I think is important to our very structure, but pro 2A causes. I let my entire class take the afternoon to watch the S. 649 debate and vote, and let them see my enthusiasm when it got voted down.

We really NEED to get our youth involved.

 

[Gun Geezer]

I think it is lost. As you note, in a couple of decades there just will not be any of us left. I hate to be pessimistic, but that's what I think.

Many reasons. Kids don't hunt that much. Leases are sky high. Too many "soccer moms". Fewer places to shoot. The list goes on. The Gun Culture is vanishing slowly but surely.

To get the younger ones interested, you'd need to attach an App to it. Or get to see how much we do for conservation and "the environment".

 

[HexHead]

The electorate has changed. Ronald Reagan couldn't get elected in the current environment. "The Greatest Generation" is dying off, being replaced each year with new voters fresh out of 13 or more years at the hands of leftist liberal indoctrination from the halls of public education.

 

[Krozi]

I'm 21 years old and very pro-2nd amendment. My friends are all pro-2nd for the most part (the rest just need a little persuasion and range time). More and more young people are getting into firearms and the shooting sport. I wouldn't check off everyone in my age-group. Lots of people are realizing how firearms have been demonized and the facts are on our side. I'm located in Florida.

Of course you still have the brain dead sheep, but they have always been around or we wouldn't be in the trouble we're in.

 

[Baron66]

It's because you are on THR!

Start that poll on AR15.com and you will get a million votes from gun guys in their 20s.

Gun sales are at a all time high; it's not just the old farts buying them. It's just that the old farts hang out here because all the rules keep the young ruffians away. 20 year olds don't generally like rules.

I am 36 by the way.

 

[NavyLCDR]

Personally, I don't think there is any hope for saving any part of the Constitution. In the next 100 years we are going to see the collapse of the Federal government the same way the Soviet Union collapsed. The Federal government has already outgrown it's resources and it is only a matter of time.

 

[HammsBeer]

I think Baron66 has it right. The age group of THR seems much older than other gun forums, or the younger crowd has other things they'd rather do than sit on a forum all evening. Heck most of the people I see at the range or the gun counters are younger types, and I'm 35.

But keep in mind that younger shooters (including myself) also have a different set of values and beliefs than the older 50+ crowd, but some of the rhetoric of the NRA often overlooks that, and it alienates the younger shooters that they desperately need to accommodate instead.

 

[monotonous_iterancy]

It's just that the old farts hang out here because all the rules keep the young ruffians away. 20 year olds don't generally like rules.

Hey, I resemble that remark!

Really though, I like this place. It's not full of nonsense, and collectively I'm sure the members here know just about everything about every gun ever made. I learn a lot here.

But keep in mind that younger shooters (including myself) also have a different set of values and beliefs than the older 50+ crowd, but some of the rhetoric of the NRA often overlooks that, and it alienates the younger shooters that they desperately need to accommodate instead.

I find that interesting. What rhetoric are you talking about?

 

[barnbwt]

"I think it is lost. As you note, in a couple of decades there just will not be any of us left. I hate to be pessimistic, but that's what I think."

In times like these, it is important to remember there have always been geezers like these

Young folks have always been more liberal and irresponsible (I say this as a 27 year old) and gradually grow conservative and curmudgeonly when responsibility and liability begin to eclipse the folly of youth. The current generation are ripe for rebellion against statist norms since their interests have been so poorly served by at least the last three generations, and they are gradually becoming aware of this. At the same time, statist arrogance is rapidly exceeding its grasp in a multitude of offices. I forsee a decade-long wave of libertarian thought being in vogue, before the usual suspects once again start peddling clever ideas to help us help ourselves, socially and morally. I think both Great Society programs and Culture Wars will be increasingly denounced, at least until people remember how good they feel. We gunnies merely need to get our piece of the pie suitably ensconced before the pendulum swings back, so we don't have to worry about losing ground after the next inevitable round of assassinations or civil unrest yet to come (we also need to defend against ourselves, since many of our own always demand 'saving' when the going gets tough)

"But keep in mind that younger shooters (including myself) also have a different set of values and beliefs than the older 50+ crowd, but some of the rhetoric of the NRA often overlooks that, and it alienates the younger shooters that they desperately need to accommodate instead."
"I find that interesting. What rhetoric are you talking about?"

I'd like to know, too. The NRA is actually quite unique in how disciplined and focused it is at staying on message. You're probably thinking of many of the other organizations that try to pad their numbers and elicit donations by seizing on gay marriage, abortion, immigration, and all manner of wholly unrelated baloney that's great for whipping up a pointless tizzy that accomplishes nothing. These groups can never please everyone for trying, so they remain divided and unproductive. If you are objecting to the NRA's supposed 'fear mongering,' you'd do well to recall their organization is almost wholly responsible for that weapons ban never making it out of the Senate last year; there is much to be fearful of when RKBA advocates aren't loudly and obnoxiously doing their jobs.

The main thing the NRA does that I suspect ticks off most would-be supporters, is letter-bomb them with solicitations hundreds of times a year. Whether a dollar spent hustling through direct mail raises more than a dollar in donations, I can't say, but it sure seems like a waste of effort.

TCB

 

[medalguy]

I agree with NavyLCDR. The Constitution has a sunset somewhere in the not too distant future. The educational system in this country is definitely left-leaning and it is surely but not so slowly brainwashing our children to the point where they believe businessmen are evil, corporations are evil, guns are evil, and the government is going to save them, the environment, and the world.

The increase in "entitlements" (God how I despise that term) is also taking a toll on the thinking of people in this country. Nearly all the people on the entitlement programs know where their bread is coming from, and they are not going to do anything to change that. Did you see that Elizabeth Warren has proposed a bill that will tax wealthy individuals and use the tax revenue to pay off the student loans of young people? A college grad is said to earn $800,000 more than a non-graduate over a lifetime. Surely during that lifetime a graduate could find a few bucks to toss towards their loan. Oh no, they are not going to vote against that bill.

 

[Skribs]

Personally, I don't think there is any hope for saving any part of the Constitution. In the next 100 years we are going to see the collapse of the Federal government the same way the Soviet Union collapsed. The Federal government has already outgrown it's resources and it is only a matter of time.

The problem is it has been perverted and corrupted from what it once was. It was originally intended as a tool to limit the power of the government so they couldn't interfere with our lives. Now, the government treats it like the pirate's code (it's more like a set of guidelines).

Big government essentially is telling people "we know better than you how you should live your life." They are essentially saying "you're too stupid to run your own life, so you need us to run it for you." I've actually heard a liberal tell me she thinks that the average person is too stupid to vote and so we should go back to a monarchy like we had when we were colonies.

What we need is a new constitution. One that makes sure that our laws are written such that a 3rd grader could understand them, instead of requiring a law degree to even attempt to interpret what those forty-five pages of legalese say. One that makes it clear that the rights of the people shall not be infringed, that that statement is absolute, and that any perversion of that statement is tantamount to treason. One where if you say "I support the Constitution, but...", then you are immediately removed from candidacy and/or office. One where hopefully more than two parties have power.

 

[Mauser lover]

I'm twenty... I like these rules!
I would put myself under the pro second amendment category...

We don't need a new constitution. We need fewer politicians and more statesmen who love their country.

"Curmogenly"? (Spelling?) I like it!

 

[Bexar]

If we lose the next two elections, 2014 and 2016 it's over. When the Democrats get a SCOTUS appointment because one of the older conservative justices leaves it'll be thirty years before we get another chance. We are going to lose because we're split between factions but the Democrats vote as a block.

Enjoy them while you can. The only thing that might save us is conservatives all vote Republican...but they won't so it's adios-a-bye-bye to the 2nd Amendment.

 

[barnbwt]

"We don't need a new constitution. We need fewer politicians and more statesmen who love their country."

I do personally think we're about 'ripe' for some means of washing away the two hundred years of ill-gotten 'precedent' that now governs our nation; the core document is as fine as every (the only part I still think was probably stupid was the bit about the VP being the runner-up in the election; but after the last few elections' absolutely visceral and vile combat, I think forcing the top two idiots into enjoying each others' company for four years is just what the doctor ordered)

TCB

 

[Nar]

I just want to say, I am 21, I carry and vote and am active.


I also get a lot of people around me to see my point of view, not easy seeing as i spend a fair amount of time on a collage campus but if i can get at least one person to understand a year then it is progress. this year i have taken two new people to the range.
Don't think all is lost.

 

[Midwest]

My two cousin in-laws are interested in firearms. One turned 21 and immediately got his carry permit. The other is 18 years old. She already asked about firearms and something for protection, I suggested she get a shotgun. She will likely get her carry permit when she turns 21.
.

 

[Bobson]

It's because you are on THR!

There's probably a lot of truth to this.

The poll doesn't show that the majority of gun enthusiasts are 50+ years old; it only shows that a majority of those who carry a firearm (one qualifier) who are also members of The High Road (second qualifier) are 50+. You're losing sight of a great deal of people who either, A) Didn't respond to the poll because they don't carry a gun, or B) Didn't respond to the poll because they never saw it.

If there are X number of gun enthusiasts in America, and only half carry a gun, you're left with X/2. If only 1/4 of those people use THR regularly, you now have 1/8. That means for every million gun enthusiasts in America, we only see 125k of em. And that's probably a pretty high estimate.

And while I remain on THR primarily because of the culture of respect here, I suspect there are many, MANY gun owners in America who will shy away from this board for the same reason.

That being said, I'm also in the camp of those who believe this country is on a downward spiral and it's only a matter of time. I wouldn't bet ten bucks that my grandkids will have the right to own firearms. Or if they will, they won't be living in a country named America.

I'm 28, BTW.

 

[larryh1108]

It's brainwashing that starts in the grade schools. Guns are bad.
Point your fingers like a gun and you get expelled.
Chew your poptart into a gun shape and you get expelled.
Wear an NRA tshirt and get expelled.
You get the idea, guns are bad. Guns are evil. Guns are the reason for so many deaths.

It won't be long before these children are the lawmakers. They've had a lifetime of seeing, hearing and reading about how guns are bad. What do you expect to happen?

It's a sad part of the fight we are having.... not having control over what they do at the schools. You can go to the school board and try to change their thoughts on the "gun culture" but you will meet stone walls of people who already grew up fearing guns. We may be the last bastion of true gun freedoms. It's sad.

 

[Bexar]

He electorate has changed. Ronald Reagan couldn't get elected in the current environment. "The Greatest Generation" is dying off, being replaced each year with new voters fresh out of 13 or more years at the hands of leftist liberal indoctrination from the halls of public education.

Yep... The media not only the news media but the entertainment media are brainwashing our kids and grandkids every day. Erin Burnette of CNN acted like someone had shot her dog when some guy was describing an AR-15. When he said the rifle could put bullets in a two inch circle at a 100 yards she blanched and said..."Oh my God...a two inch circle." like it was an evil thing. (Actually, it is...that kind of precision sucks. ) Nevermind P. Morgan and his everything including the guy beat to death with a shovel news report was an AR-15 shovel. He may not have been fired, by the way, because of his anti-gun position but because the London Police were investigating him for illegal phone eves dropping activity. Right before he was cut loose the London police were grilling him on the cell phone taps.

I was watching a cop show shoot em up the other day and right before the bad guy shoots the other guy in his home he states the "You have a gun in your home for defense but despite the fact that gun is more likely to be used against the homeowner..."

Yep too...Also, in schools. Our Daughter came home from her third grade school one day and saw me cleaning my shotgun after a hunt. She said "Guns are bad." This despite her enjoying tremendously hunting and fishing with me. The source of that indoctrination...her school teacher.

And last but not least...there is a ton of money to be made via donations for the anti-gun groups. They are huge tax-exempt businesses sucking hundreds of millions from well-meaning little old ladies that will donate to save anything these people have tapped into. Those marketing groups know exactly who those people are and contact them monthly to stick the needle in them.

You want to see who is behind all of this gun-control bs. Follow the money...simply follow the money.

 

[Bexar]

It's brainwashing that starts in the grade schools. Guns are bad.
Point your fingers like a gun and you get expelled.
Chew your poptart into a gun shape and you get expelled.
Wear an NRA tshirt and get expelled.
You get the idea, guns are bad. Guns are evil. Guns are the reason for so many deaths.

It won't be long before these children are the lawmakers. They've had a lifetime of seeing, hearing and reading about how guns are bad. What do you expect to happen?

It's a sad part of the fight we are having.... not having control over what they do at the schools. You can go to the school board and try to change their thoughts on the "gun culture" but you will meet stone walls of people who already grew up fearing guns. We may be the last bastion of true gun freedoms. It's sad.

Yep...but watcha going to do?

 

[Al Thompson]

Holy Cow, what a bunch of Debbie Downers!

I work at a LGS and weekly I see new folks who want to gain proficiency with firearms. Compared to the early 1990s, collectively we are in a much better place.

The glass is half FULL and rising.

 

[HexHead]

Personally, I don't think there is any hope for saving any part of the Constitution. In the next 100 years we are going to see the collapse of the Federal government the same way the Soviet Union collapsed. The Federal government has already outgrown it's resources and it is only a matter of time.

The best thing that could happen to this country at this point is for it to break up into several countries like USSR did. I don't know about you, but I'm sick and tired of people along the coasts and in states like IL, who's values are as different from mine as apples and coconuts, having any say whatsoever how I lead my life.

 

[Walkalong]

Some of those new to the game do not realize how much we have gained since Willie left office.

But sure, if we sit back and whine, never going to vote, never support pro gun politicians, whatever side they may be on, and simple don't get involved, yes, our 2nd amendment and our gun rights would go away.

The cost of freedom is constant vigilance and hard work to keep it.

Some of the good news is that many here and all over the country are indeed working hard to keep our gun rights.

 

[HexHead]

What we need is a new constitution.

That's insane. Do you really want our current Congress making up a new Constitution? Think about that for a moment. There's nothing wrong with our current Constitution, other than the amendments that have been added to it. The Founding Fathers in their wisdom got it right the first time around.

 

[benEzra]

Younger people are *more* pro-RKBA than older people in this country. Yes, a lot of older gun enthusiasts are aging out, but there are a whole lot more coming in.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/165563/remains-divided-passing-stricter-gun-laws.aspx

To the older members here, don't get pessimistic. The country as a whole is more pro-RKBA than it has been since the 1950s or 1960s, and the shift in the numbers is even more dramatic when it comes to defensive-style firearms vs. purely hunting guns. In 1959, 60% of American adults said they would support a ban on handguns; that number in 2013 was 25%.



Younger people are also less likely to support banning nontraditional-looking guns than older people are.

Gun control in this country is mostly driven and funded by wealthy elites in their 70s and 80s (Dianne Feinstein is almost 81, Michael Bloomberg is 72). Bloomberg is spending $millions trying to sell authoritarian nanny-statism to younger people, to try keep his movement from dying out with his age cohort, but there are not a huge number of young gun-control enthusiasts who aren't paid mouthpieces of the older set. There *is* a huge number of younger gun enthusiasts.


To the older members here, don't get pessimistic; look around and see if you can pass the torch. Find a younger family member or coworker who is interested in shooting and mentor them. If you are into hunting, take them hunting; if they are into video games, let them shooting something they are familiar with from that genre (for my son, *the* gun on his bucket list is a PPSh, because he is a huge WW2 buff thanks to Call of Duty 2 and 3). Don't shun the younger folks at the range or resent them for different tastes or styles; engage and befriend them and pass your knowledge along.

While you're dong so, remember that women are more likely now than in the past to be interested in personal gun ownership and CCW, so don't stereotype people's interest by their gender. Also remember that younger gun owners are a lot less likely to be social conservative and more likely to lean independent/libertarian, so don't tie the RKBA to SoCon issues; that is a big turnoff for many people of my generation (Gen-X) and younger.

Yes, we are facing a very powerful and very well funded clique of authoritarian control freaks on the political front, but there is reason to be optimistic from a cultural standpoint, I think.