What state can military legally buy in?

[Jdude]

I am trying to determine what states I can purchase a firearm in. I am stationed in Colorado, yet pay taxes to Arizona and vote in AZ elections.
The FFL dealer in CO just had me put the address of my house in CO. This successfully passed NICS and I was on my way with a new money hole. When I visit AZ, will I be able to purchase firearms in that state as a resident there? Or do I only retain voting and tax rights when ordered elsewhere by the military?

Finally, does being a federal employee allow me to purchase a firearm from a FFL in any state?

Thank you for your answers.

 

[Jim K]

If you are on active duty with the armed forces, you are considered a resident of the state in which you are stationed or to which you are TDY. You are also still a resident of your home-of-record state, so you can have it either way, depending on where you are at the time. But if you are from TX and stationed in CO, you can't buy a handgun in AZ without having it go through a dealer in CO or TX.

Jim

 

[Jimmie]

Do you have an AZ ID? My DL is not issued in the state where I live - it's issued by my home state. If I buy in my home state, I show my DL. If I buy where I live, I show my orders. In the other 48 states, I'm SOL.

 

[cdrt]

From the BATFE website:

(B2) From whom may an unlicensed person acquire a firearm under the GCA?
A person may only acquire a firearm within the person’s own State, except that he or she may purchase or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun, in person, at a licensee's premises in any State, provided the sale complies with State laws applicable in the State of sale and the State where the purchaser resides. A person may borrow or rent a firearm in any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes.

Since CO and AZ are contiguous states, it should not be a problem for you to buy in either state. Not sure why the previous post mentioned Texas, since you're not there. It would help in AZ if you have an AZ driver's license or other form of ID besides your military ID and a local current AZ address.

Under current employment rules as I understand them, you are not a federal employee. That would mean you have a GS rating, etc. You are a member of the military which means you are employed by the Army, Navy, etc. not Federal Civil Service. Based on your question about federal service, the short answer, I believe to your question, is NO, but you can just like anyone else, buy from an FFL in another state as long as you have the firearm shipped to an FFL in your residence state. Which is what you could do if you find a gun in AZ and the local dealer there won't sell it to you without shipping it to CO and your FFL dealer there.

Does all that make sense?

 

[Jdude]

cdrt, That answers my question exactly. I still have my AZ ID, so that should solve any remaining problems. Thank you all for your quick help.

 

[RoadkingLarry]

Unlesss things have changed in the last decade on this... If you are active duty depending on the state you are living in, you are indeed considered a resident of the state you are stationed in AND you can still be a resident of your "home of record" state if you maintain dirivers license and tax payments (if applicable). (you still only get to register to vote in one location) Thats the way I did it anyway. I was able to buy guns in California, Connecticut and oklahoma while I was on active duty.

 

[DMF]

According the ATF FAQs on their website, given the information you presented in the original post you may only purchase firearms in CO.

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b11

"(B11) What constitutes residency in a State? [Back]

The State of residence is the State in which an individual is present; the individual also must have an intention of making a home in that State. A member of the Armed Forces on active duty is a resident of the State in which his or her permanent duty station is located. If a member of the Armed Forces maintains a home in one State and the member’s permanent duty station is in a nearby State to which he or she commutes each day, then the member has two States of residence and may purchase a firearm in either the State where the duty station is located or the State where the home is maintained. An alien who is legally in the United States is considered to be a resident of a State only if the alien is residing in that State and has resided in that State continuously for a period of at least 90 days prior to the date of sale of the firearm. See also Item 5, “Sales to Aliens in the United States,” in the General Information section of this publication.

[18 U.S.C. 921(b), 922(a) (3), and 922(b)(3), 27 CFR 478.11]"

Because you do not live in AZ and commute to CO for your daily duty station, you cannot buy guns in AZ. An example of an active duty military member being able to buy handguns in two states would be someone living in Council Bluffs, IA, but whose duty station on active duty is about 15 miles away in Offutt AFB, NE.

However, as I've often advised before, if this more than a hypothetical I suggest you consult with an attorney who is experienced in the area of federal and applicable state and local firearms laws.

 

[DMF]

Unlesss things have changed in the last decade on this... If you are active duty depending on the state you are living in, you are indeed considered a resident of the state you are stationed in AND you can still be a resident of your "home of record" state if you maintain dirivers license and tax payments (if applicable).

Nothing has changed, but there is a difference between how residency issues are handled with regard to taxes, vehicle registration, etc, and how residency is defined by the GCA for the purposes of buying a firearm.

 

[xd45gaper]

you know you dont have to pay taxes (federal or state) cant remeber which if you are a resident of AZ being active duty military!! off topic just noticed you said you paid taxes to the state of AZ if you dont know about it already i would check into it if i where you

 

[mobeewan]

I know for a fact that if you are in the military and stationed in Virginia, but are a "resident" of another state in order to purchase a firearm you have to present a copy of your signed orders to the FFL dealer. I have seen this stated by the employees in gun shops and by liscensed dealers at gun shows. If you do not have your orders then they cannot sell to you. If you are truely a Virginia resident and are stationed in Virginia they can sell to you without a copy of your orders.

I assume this is the same throughout the entire country. I don't know how it could be different in only one state since it is a federal transaction when selling a new gun.

 

[Colonel]

See cdrt's post #4 above.

 

[DMF]

See cdrt's post #4 above.

See DMF's post #7 above, because cdrt is wrong. However, as I said don't just take my or cdrt's word for it, consult with an an attorney who is experienced in the area of federal and applicable state and local firearms laws.

 

[trueblue1776]

I don't want to say anybody is wrong...

I've purchased (multiple) guns in two states other than my home state while active duty. Most dealers want a copy or permanent orders putting you in that state. I'm a Californian and I have bought guns that are illegal in CA, but since I don't plan on going back, it doesn't matter. There are dealers in Alabama who will take a military ID (no orders), it's much more relaxed down here.

I don't know how that measures up to the laws, seeing as it's reality and all.

 

[.455_Hunter]

When I was in the Army, I purchased guns in the following states:

Colorado- Home of Record (Colorado DL as proof, both handguns and long guns)

Maryland- Assigned to Aberdeen Proving Ground for Ordnance Officers Basic Course (TDY orders as proof, long guns only)

Kansas- Permanent Duty Station Fort Riley (orders as proof, both handguns and long guns)

This was 1998-2002, so maybe stuff has changed since then......

 

[1911 guy]

Done this before.

Take your drivers lisence, military I.D. and photocopy of your orders to the gunshop. Buy a gun. That simple. You can buy in your home of record and/or the state where you are stationed.

 

[Jdude]

DMF, thank you for that. If I see something in AZ that I absolutely cannot pass up, I'll either have it shipped to a CO FFL or contact an attorney for assistance, depending on how bad I want it "right now". For the time being, I am going to write a [polite] nastygram to my elected meatheads expressing my opinions on the subject.

 

[striker3]

Jdude,

If it is illegal then there are probably quite a few military members as well as FFLs that are guilty. It is a very common practice for military members to buy firearms in their Home of Record state. All it takes is a drivers license with a physical address in the state to fulfill the FFLs residency check.

 

[DMF]

Fellas, what people sometimes get away with and what actually is legal are two very different things.

However, riddle me this: If Jdude is stationed in CO, has a residence in CO and his home of record is AZ, but he no longer resides in AZ what address would he put on a 4473 when asks for his "Current Residence Address" in block two when attempting to buy a gun in AZ?

Keep in mind it states in the definitions section of the 4473 the definition of state of residence is: "State of Residence: The state in which an individual resides. An individual resides in a State if he or she is present in a State with the intention of making a home in that State. If an individual is a member of the Armed Forces on active duty, his or her State of residence is the State in which his or her permanent duty station is located. An alien who is legally in the United States is a resident of a State only if the alien is residing in the State and has resided in the State for at least 90 days prior to the date of sale or delivery of the firearm."

Now anyone care to point out what portion there, or in the link to the FAQs on the ATF website I provided earlier, allows for someone to use an old address at which they don't actually reside from their military home of record when completing an ATF Form 4473 Block 2 for Current Residence Address.

Again, don't just take my word for it I suggest you consult with an attorney who is experienced in the area of federal and applicable state and local firearms laws.

As I said there is a world of difference between what people sometimes get away with, and what is actually legal.

 

[trueblue1776]

However, riddle me this: If Jdude is stationed in CO, has a residence in CO and his home of record is AZ, but he no longer resides in AZ what address would he put on a 4473 when asks for his "Current Residence Address" in block two when attempting to buy a gun in AZ?

It can be either, you are a legal resident of both states. But, for tax purposes you are a resident of your home state.

I'm sure there are hairs to be split, thank god most FFLs make it quick and easy for military guys.

 

[ilbob]

The answer is not all that simple.

Take everything stated in this post with a grain of salt, as IANAL.

You can only buy handguns in your own state.

Used to be that federal law prohibited out of state purchases of long guns except in contiguous states if the state of residence specifically allowed it. That provision has since been stricken. There are still a few states that prohibit their own citizens from buying out of state, or only allow it from contiguous states.

Dealers are only allowed to sell to people who can legally purchase firearms. If your home state prohibits you from buying a long gun out of state, you are out of luck. Since the rules are so variable, many dealers just make up stricter rules than are actually the law to simplify their own lives.

For instance, IIRC, Illinois dealers can legally sell long guns to the residents of 40 some states (don't quote me on the number).

I am not entirely sure what the law is on Illinois residents purchase of long guns out of state. I think the law still says you can buy in contiguous states, but does not prohibit you from buying in non-contiguous states, so presumably you can buy long guns in any state that will sell to you. I think you still have to wait 24 hours to take delivery.

Its pretty convoluted, so I may have some of the details wrong.

 

[trueblue1776]

You can only buy handguns in your own state.

I've bought three pistols from FFLs out of state.

 

[DMF]

It can be either, you are a legal resident of both states. But, for tax purposes you are a resident of your home state.

Again, the issue of "home of record" in the military, state taxes, etc, are completely irrelevant. What matters how federal law, spefically the GCA, defines residency for the purposes of purchasing a firearm.