What to tell employer who wants me to move to California

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mountainclmbr

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I have been under increasing pressure from my employer of 21 years to move from Colorado to California. I know they have no obligation to employ me. I also will not ever live in one of the people's republik states, never ever. I have to travel to CA, NJ, NY, MD all the time for business. It is torture for me. My travel causes hotel taxes to go to those socialist governments. I take my own food to avoid funding the commies any further with the taxes they charge. I have been thinking of ways of informing my employer of my distaste for communism so they will stop prodding me. Some thoughts are more tactful and possibly will make them think I am not firm in my beliefs. Other thoughts would slap them in the face. Here are some thoughts ranked from gentle to slap:

1. Too many people, taxes and home prices too high, Boxer, Feinstein, Pelosi. Enough said?

2. No way! I have a M1A and CCW here and I won't depart with the communist's contraband list for less than $5 mil with no strings attached for work tenure. I will quit immediately too :)

3. You move to N. Korea first you Stalin worshiper #@!*&%.

Any other thoughts? I could retire today in my late 40's, but would like to work a few more years. I find it ironic that I work in the defense industry that is supposed to protect individual rights and freedoms, and I am being pressured to move to a quasi-communist state.

What would others do?
 
Just say "NO" , I'd rather be homeless than live there . Did a TDY job there for a week in Orange county a couple years ago and have refused such job offers since ...
 
Simply tell him that you have been to california before and you do not feel safe in that area (whatever area he wants you to work in) and that you will have to respectfully decline, because your safety and your families perceptioin of a safe area comes first. He might not agree with you, but its hard to argue with
 
Compromise?

Why not tell your boss that you would be willing to compromise and move to Nevada? You'd be close enough to do the job, but you'd be far enough away to enjoy the freedoms we have here in the "Battle Born" state!
 
JLStorm's idea sounds pretty good. Honest (at least I assume you have your CHL & M1A for self-defense, among other reasons), nonconfrontational, and valid. Would that work?
 
Tell them you won't go because you believe that any move would jeopardize your overall health and well being and therefore would not serve your best personal interests. Is that straying too far from the truth? :)
 
mountainclmbr wrote:
No way! I have a M1A and CCW here and I won't depart...
Click to expand...

Hey, you've got Denver. From what I hear that's as bad/worse than CA. No AWs, no handguns in city? [I may well be wrong...]

Basic fact corrections:
  • If you're concerned only w/M1As in CA , they're legal here with muzzle brakes - though 10rd mags only for new residents. Gun stores are lined up w/M1As and Mini14s.
  • Many areas of CA do issue CCWs. http://www.Calguns.Net and packing.org will offer more info in Legal forums on where your best CCW opportunites are.

You can actually mask your concerns about a CA move with cost of living discussions and relevant necessary increases to maintain 'standard of living'. Complain about the poor school systems in the area where your existing salary would buy you housing. (In some areas your salary might well not buy you housing at all other than a small 1br condo.)

Expect to add at least 35+% (or more, depending on area and occupation) to maintain a rough living standard parity in near-metro areas That covers the higher taxes, higher housing costs etc.

You might be in a good position in arguing this too, since apparently it's worth it to move you - as opposed to dumping you and hiring a Californian in place. They may realize (perhaps you might help remind them) that the financial issues they face won't change if you get subtracted from the equation: they're still gonna have to pay CA pay for anyone they get if they're working here, and if they pay CO pay for work in CA they're gonna get substandard short-term employee (unless they go with a part-time contractor).



Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA
 
Say no if you don't want to go. As a young man I was told I would have to move or else one time. I moved alright, but where I chose & not where they wanted to send me. Cut in pay? Yes sir. Free man & not their slave?? Yep(wish we had a flag Icon) Lost another job due to another, "not gonna do that" at any wage. Another cut in pay? Yes sir. Did my kids go hungry? no sir. Any regrets at 56 yr (and I will never be able to retire) & 4 grandkids later? NO SIR not one. Our Forefathers pledged their lives, "their fortunes", & their sacred honor for the rectitude of the Declaration of Independence. They all lost their fortunes, (you wont) many their lives, but not a one lost their honor. Your choice in the end. Lots of things worth more than money. You already know that.
 
All kinds of reasons for not going to CA without bringing up guns.

What would the house which you presumably own now cost in CA? What would your pay increase have to be just to cover the mortgage, insurance, etc. That oughta shut 'em up. You should not have to lower your standard of living (didn't say quality of life) for your employer without compensation. Its call a job, not peonage
 
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You need to do a cost-benefit analysis. It's no good saying that you'll damage (or even destroy) your long-term earning potential and career prospects because of your dislike for a Socialist-type state. There are various options open to you.

First, where would they move you? If it's to an urban nightmare like Los Angeles, I'd be very hesitant, but that's because I hate megalopolises (or should that be megalopoli? :D ). On the other hand, if you can live somewhere more attractive, that's not so bad.

Second, you don't have to stay there. If they move you, how long would the move last? Permanent (i.e. until you retire)? A few years? Get more info. If they want you to move permanently, you can at least plan on retiring in due course and getting the heck out of Dodge at that point.

Third, what about cost of living compensation? Your COL will certainly be much higher in CA. If your employer is willing to adjust your compensation accordingly, this won't be a problem. If they won't do this, you will have serious economic consequences.

Fourth, CA may be bad in terms of its government and policies, but how much will these affect you? I'd hate to put my children into the CA school system, but if you don't have school-age children, this isn't a factor. If you have private health insurance, you don't have to rely on State medical assistance. All these are factors to consider.

Fifth, as far as firearms are concerned, yes, you'll face restrictions in CA: but these can be worked around. Live in a county where you can get a CCW permit - it's valid in the rest of the state as well. Buy defensive weapons that are legal in CA, like the Kel-Tec SU16, instead of the banned AR15. Live with magazine limits - ten rounds should get it done, if you have an effective caliber. Leave the rest of your firearms with a trusted friend until you can move back to civilization.

It's no good having a knee-jerk emotional reaction to CA. I'd hate to live there myself - but if it were necessary and in my long-term best interests, I'd put up with it for a few years, if I had to.
 
Ask your boss why is it that so many businesses have moved out of CA !!
 
I don't have a solution to your problem.
I just find it interesting that someone else dislikes California as much as I do.
I live almost within sight of it. I only go there if I have to and then try not to buy anything for the same reason as you: I don't want any of my money to go to a communist regime or the people who vote for them.
I thought I was the only one.
I have lived in California. I wouldn't go back. Well, I guess I shouldn't say that I wouldn't. I wouldn't go back if my pay was doubled. I would probably go back for no less than 500k/yr. I only have another seven years to retirement and I plan on moving as far away from California as possible. This is no joke: when thinking about a place to retire, I am placing the greatest weight on how many kalifornians are moving to that area. If a large number of kalifornians are moving there, I don't want to be there. They have ruined Southern Nevada like locusts.
For those from California, I am sorry, this wasn't intended as a personal attack: it is just my personal opinion based on my personal experience. For me, this goes a lot deeper than just people's political philosophy about gun rights.
 
Long ago and 3 different employer's / carreers ago I learned that your family and your lifestyle are more important than who you work for.

An employer will keep you on the payroll as long as it benefits them PERIOD.
They can drop you like a hot potato with no reason and even if you are a stellar performer.

Your quality of life and your family are much more important.

Send your resume to their Competitor.

Never EVER depend on one employer for your career, you make your career!!!
 
Master Blaster is 100% correct. You need to do what is best for you and your family, and not your employer. Remember, you can always get another job, you can't always get another family.

If I was in your situation, I would first start looking around and circulating your resume. That's your fall back position, in case you are given a choice of moving or losing your job, or you are fired for not being a "team player" and doing what they want you to do.

Next, I would lay out the arguments against you moving as logically and free of emotion as you can. The biggest argument you can use is the cost to your company. It take A LOT of money to move, so let your company know that you intend for them to pay the complete cost of your move. Next, compare salaries and cost of living, and then tell your company that you expect a xx percent increase in your salary, due to the higher cost of living. In other words, you expect the move to be financially beneficial to you, not to harm you.

Also, if you are married, and your wife works, she's going to have to give up her job and try to find another. You may ask for assistence for her finding a job, compensation for her lost wages, or a job for her with your company (I don't recommend the last one though.) Again, you don't want to take a financial hit because they want you to move.

billwiese's suggestion to remind them that its going to cost them a lot, regardless if they send you, a coworker, or hire a native Californian is a good one to throw in at the appropriate time. This may make them pause if they are angry and just want to fire you for not doing what they want.

When you're discussing this with your company, don't get angry or hostile no matter what they do.

Please let us all know how this turns out.

Warren
 
Over the years, I have turned down several offers to edit magazines in NYC and Los Angeles.

I just tell them on the phone that there is no need for me to travel there to talk with them. I simply would not live there.

No need to go into details. I just say that I couldn't live in crowded places like that. I prefer the quality of life elsewhere.

Forks in the road of life. Pick one, and never look back.
 
1. Too many people, taxes and home prices too high, Boxer, Feinstein, Pelosi. Enough said?

2. No way! I have a M1A and CCW here and I won't depart with the communist's contraband list for less than $5 mil with no strings attached for work tenure. I will quit immediately too

3. You move to N. Korea first you Stalin worshiper #@!*&%
Click to expand...
Why don't you give him this answer? Maybe turn on the tears too.
 
after 9 years in Montana, I'm not sure I could ever live anywhere else except maybe Wyoming

(relative) freedom is addictive, once you get a taste of it

places like CA, NY, NJ, etc ... i'd rather die than go there :(
 
Well, having been moved from Ohio to Florida at the Taxpayers expense, I would be hard put complain about the politics. Both States Suk.

The Gunlaws are a little better here in FL, but places to shoot are expensive and range limits tight. (No natural backstops, like quarries, hills, mountains, canyons, etc. just a bulldozed burm and elevation limits. Not to mention the HEAT and indoor ranges w/o A/C, did I mention the HEAT?

Now, if I was an executive type with options I'd start asking if the California operation was cost effective, but I know defense plants must be kept in CA for political purposes. Does you company have other places which would be more to your liking?

Geoff
Who notes it's HOT outside and I just did the lawn in the HEAT. :evil:
 
I'd not give any concrete reasons, but I would tell 'em FIRMLY that you're not interested in moving you-n-yours to CA. Slapping them with the reasons doesn't help, After all, it won't make them change their business practices, and it's not likely to do much good in any other way.

MasterBlaster brings up a good point. I almost moved to San Diego once, a long time ago. Beautiful place, but I couldn't see living there working for the same company for the next forty years and there weren't many other employment opportunities in my field in SD. I turned down the offer. Sure enough, within two years the company was sold and the whole lot of San Diego-based engineers were on the street. Most of 'em wound up commuting all the up to Long Beach or further noth just to have a job. Yuk.
 
A long time ago, a major entertainment company you'd recognize wanted me to move to the NYC area.

I had a frank chat with them, pointing out that the idea had two unnavoidable deal killers for me, that of the insane cost of living, (which they offered to fix, somewhat), and that of an insane quality of life.

We didn't compromise, we synthesised, so that we each got what we wanted.

They wanted (and got) my services, with the understanding that a lot of it would be rendered from my home office, and that I'd be available as needed in person if they picked up the transpo and hotel tab. They kept their COL adjustment.
 
I think you have to make a cost/benefit analysis on a personal level.

I think most companies are well aware that sending an employee to CA will probably require a substantial relocation allowance and a pay raise just to be able to keep up with your current standard of living.

There is a some chance once you get there you may be stuck there for a while. They will probably not want to pay to send someone to replace you in 2 or 3 years. You might even decide you like it once you get there. people adapt to lots of things when the weather is nice year round.

There is also the problem that many companies look at a CA pay scale and won't even talk to potential employees from CA because they think their pay expectations will be so high. This is more of a problem than a lot of people realize. it is probably less of a problem for your situation since you may be high enough up the food chain that these kind of things are understood.

I know of a guy who got sent to CA with a nice relocation bonus (taxable I think) so he could buy a house there. Tiny little 3 BR 2 bath with no garage and no yard - $400k and change. He came back 5 or 6 years later with $500k in his pocket - profit and equity from the sale of the house. I doubt the RE boom in CA can continue like that for much longer. It could actually drop, and leave you upside down on a mortgage, making it very difficult for you to leave CA at all.

In the end, a lot depends on how much the company really wants you there. If they really want you there, and you refuse, it will almost certainly harm your career. maybe not catastrophically, but it will hurt. It could turn out to be the chance of a lifetime, giving you exposure that might enhance your career prospects by an incalculable amount.

If they want you there for a few years and then you can move elsewhere, you will need to balance the effect on you and your family that the few years will cost versus what you potentially could gain from the move.

If they expect you to stay there indefinitely, you may have to make a tough choice if you decide in the end you do not want to live there permanently.
 
My employer wants me to move to Los Angeles. My house here would not be affordable in California. I have a little over 1 acre bordering national forest. Elevation is 8600 ft with uninterrupted views of about 60 miles of the continental divide from south of the Indian Peaks wilderness area to north of Rocky Mountain National Park. House is 3 levels with about 3200 sq ft and a wrap around redwood deck of about 1800 sq ft. The cost of replacing home and lifestyle in CA would be prohibitive. The benefits? Probably relocation assistance and some sort of small bonus. Maybe small salary increase, but probably no more than 10-15% due to pay scales. I am sitting pretty much at the top for technical positions so no possibilities of promotion unless I go into management. So cost is very high and benefits very low. It would take alot of money to get me to move to LA. I already have to travel there a couple of times a month and I absolutely hate it the entire time. My quality of life is more important than almost any offer that could be made. I seriously doubt my company would replace me as I am extremely busy and no one else in the west coast division does what I do. It just annoys the daylights out of me that they keep pestering me about moving. The division I work for thinks I could help them grow faster since most development of commercial and military satellites is in CA. I think the solution should be that these companies leave CA. I don't understand what business analysis would cause you to have a business there.
 
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