Hello everyone, Just getting into casting my own for plinking and some hunting with a handgun. I'm using range lead and everyone knows that it could, and is just about anything. But I'm determined to venture the road of casting on a budget. Where would i be able to get the tin that's needed in my mixture? any ideas or sources? (cheap, maybe free)Thanks for any help.
What type of tin for casting?
- Thread starter torker32
- Start date
- Status
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
50/50 bar or solid core wire solder from the hardware store is the most easily available source of tin. But it ain't cheap.
Wheel weight metal is just about perfect from the get-go and requires no additinal tin to cast great bullets.
As for range pick-up bullets and adding tin?
You don't know what alloys you have mixed together after you melt a bunch of mixed range bullets, so how do you know how much tin you need to add to them? Or even if you neeed to add any at all.
Pure tin is most commenly added to pure lead from drain pipe, cable sheathing, shower stall drain pans, etc. where you know with certainty you started out with pure lead.
rc
Wheel weight metal is just about perfect from the get-go and requires no additinal tin to cast great bullets.
As for range pick-up bullets and adding tin?
You don't know what alloys you have mixed together after you melt a bunch of mixed range bullets, so how do you know how much tin you need to add to them? Or even if you neeed to add any at all.
Pure tin is most commenly added to pure lead from drain pipe, cable sheathing, shower stall drain pans, etc. where you know with certainty you started out with pure lead.
rc
Thanks for the reply rc, In your answer would i be better off using a hardness tester to get the BHN ? Would this help in any way to determine the mixture? I'm kinda in the middle of knowing not how to determine the mixture. The lyman casting book has helped some. as per your advice to me in another thread. I'm thinking on maybe just starting from new materials. Thanks rc..
snuffy
Member
Check out any local radiator repair shops. They sometimes have solder drippings they will give away, or sell. Don't go much over $1.50/lb because it's usually only 50% tin. Most new car radiators are plastic, so that source may be gone soon.
Look into yard sales, or flea markets. Try to find pewter kitchen stuff, like mugs, pitchers, or table ware. Pewter is up to 85% tin.
Now for the lead-free solder sold at hardware stores. Be sure to read the percentages and content on the roll of solder. Get the stuff that says 95% tin- 5% antimony. You don't want copper as the 5%, but 5% silver is okay.
Look into yard sales, or flea markets. Try to find pewter kitchen stuff, like mugs, pitchers, or table ware. Pewter is up to 85% tin.
Now for the lead-free solder sold at hardware stores. Be sure to read the percentages and content on the roll of solder. Get the stuff that says 95% tin- 5% antimony. You don't want copper as the 5%, but 5% silver is okay.
I shoot Lyman's #2 alloy almost exclusively and I make that from wheelweights and lead-free plumbing solder. If you do the math, you'll see that the price of the tin is lower than with 50/50 solder. Add a 1lb roll of plumbing solder to 19 lbs of wheelweight. One pound of solder to 19 lbs of range scrap will give you something inbetween 1:20 alloy and Lyman #2. That will be adequate for most handgun bullets.
If you ever go to a flea market/swap meet look for old banged up pewter bowls/plates/pitchers ect. By law it can not be called "pewter" unless it is at least 82% tin. Modern pewter is completely lead-free through and anything made since the 1970's can be expected to be 97% tin, 3% antimony. You can also pick up slightly used rolls of solder too, that the seller wants to get rid of for a dollor or two.
Adding at least a little tin (say 2%) increase bullet QUALITY greatly because it has better flow properties. It also hardens the alloy, though not as much as antimony does.
Make sure you flux well just before adding your tin, and flux again immediately after adding it. The tin will tend to separate over time, especially if your alloy is above 750 degrees. It will be a grayish scum floating on top of the lead. Don't scape this off! Flux it back in to maintain the highest tin concentration.
Good luck,
Michael
If you ever go to a flea market/swap meet look for old banged up pewter bowls/plates/pitchers ect. By law it can not be called "pewter" unless it is at least 82% tin. Modern pewter is completely lead-free through and anything made since the 1970's can be expected to be 97% tin, 3% antimony. You can also pick up slightly used rolls of solder too, that the seller wants to get rid of for a dollor or two.
Adding at least a little tin (say 2%) increase bullet QUALITY greatly because it has better flow properties. It also hardens the alloy, though not as much as antimony does.
Make sure you flux well just before adding your tin, and flux again immediately after adding it. The tin will tend to separate over time, especially if your alloy is above 750 degrees. It will be a grayish scum floating on top of the lead. Don't scape this off! Flux it back in to maintain the highest tin concentration.
Good luck,
Michael
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
Under-size bullets can be caused by several things.
1. Too cool mold blocks or alloy causing incomplete fills. Are your grease grooves and base edge sharp and completely filled?
2. Removing the ladle from the sprue plate before bullet cools enough to stop sucking more alloy into the mold. You can also pour a puddle on top of the sprue plate if using a bottom pour furnace to provide sufficient alloy to complete the fill as the bullet cools.
3. Not enough tin and/or antimony. Wheel-weights will produce bullets weighing more and casting smaller than with #2 alloy. Pure lead even more so.
Bullets cast in Linotype will be a larger diameter but weigh less.
rc
1. Too cool mold blocks or alloy causing incomplete fills. Are your grease grooves and base edge sharp and completely filled?
2. Removing the ladle from the sprue plate before bullet cools enough to stop sucking more alloy into the mold. You can also pour a puddle on top of the sprue plate if using a bottom pour furnace to provide sufficient alloy to complete the fill as the bullet cools.
3. Not enough tin and/or antimony. Wheel-weights will produce bullets weighing more and casting smaller than with #2 alloy. Pure lead even more so.
Bullets cast in Linotype will be a larger diameter but weigh less.
rc
243winxb
Member
To make a larger diameter bullet, add antimony or linotype.
Zeke/PA
Member
I have been down that road , believe me and I have cast several thousand
.38 cal bullets using 50/50/ lead /tin ingots to ATTEMPT to cast good bullets.
If you insist on "casting your own" it's one thing BUT I have graduated to purchasing bullets from Missouri Bullets.
No muss, no fuss, the price is right AND the quality IS consistent.
.38 cal bullets using 50/50/ lead /tin ingots to ATTEMPT to cast good bullets.
If you insist on "casting your own" it's one thing BUT I have graduated to purchasing bullets from Missouri Bullets.
No muss, no fuss, the price is right AND the quality IS consistent.
bullseye308
Member
50%tin Them is some expensive bullets. Got any of that mix left?
Maj Dad
Member
I bought some gen-u-wine linotype (and I mean linotype as cast by the linotype machine with letters, etc.) from Missouri Bullet Co. a few months back - check with Brad & see if he's still got it. He will help you figure out alloys & how to mix up your own, and he also sells ingots of Lyman #2 and other excellent bullet lead to match your shooting. Good company, good guy, and very reasonable prices (their service rivals any company on earth, and that's not hype).
www.missouribullet.com/
www.missouribullet.com/
evan price
Member
Print or type metals are great sources of tin. Linotype is still available, but it has less tin by weight than other type metals.
Type shops also used Monotype, which was hand-arranged individual letters. They have more tin than lino.
The best ones are Foundry Type, which is usually large, individual letters. They have the most tin, since they were intended to be ordered from a type foundry and used for long term. Also some specialty items (like the letterhead of the paper) were cast in foundry metal.
If you see strips of lead with whole words and sentances cast into it- LinoType = Good.
If you see small pieces of lead with individual letters or punctuation- MonoType = Better.
If you see large blocks of lead with individual letters or pictures- Foundry Type = Best.
Another good source besides solder, is Babbitt metal. Before roller bearings were common, or the multi-layered style of engine bearings, they used to be poured out of an alloy with lots of tin. Low speed babbitt has about the same tin as type metals. High-Speed Babbitt has lots of tin, up to 90% in some cases. There is often copper or other metal in a babbitt alloy, but used in small quantities to sweeten a pot of boolit metal it won't matter.
Sometimes you luck out and find billets and ingots of Babbitt from sawmills, machine-repair shops, antique tractor shows, etc.
IMHO- and I use range scrap and wheelweights- if you are using range scrap, just assume it's pure lead, and add 2% tin by weight. Sure, it's not scientific. Sure, there's probably other metals in there. But if you get a little more or less it won't affect you that much. A touch of tin helps bullets get nice fillout a lot.
If your range uses a lot of jacketed bullets odds are it's as close to pure lead as to not matter anyway. If they also allow cast boolits in there you'll be getting antimonious lead, probably wheel-weights.
Antimony is what makes lead hard, and can get harder by water-quenching.
Tin makes lead flow smoother when melted, so that it will fill up the mold better.
Well, they also have other properties, and do the same things somewhat, but simply put, that's why we want tin and antimony in lead for bullets.
If you're casting .38 specials, .45 acps, and other slow moving projectiles, you can get by with less antimony and tin. 50-50 mix of range lead and wheel weights is great for that.
If you are casting 9mm or .357 or something like that, higher velocity, straight wheel weights, maybe water quenched if needed, will do the trick.
Type shops also used Monotype, which was hand-arranged individual letters. They have more tin than lino.
The best ones are Foundry Type, which is usually large, individual letters. They have the most tin, since they were intended to be ordered from a type foundry and used for long term. Also some specialty items (like the letterhead of the paper) were cast in foundry metal.
If you see strips of lead with whole words and sentances cast into it- LinoType = Good.
If you see small pieces of lead with individual letters or punctuation- MonoType = Better.
If you see large blocks of lead with individual letters or pictures- Foundry Type = Best.
Another good source besides solder, is Babbitt metal. Before roller bearings were common, or the multi-layered style of engine bearings, they used to be poured out of an alloy with lots of tin. Low speed babbitt has about the same tin as type metals. High-Speed Babbitt has lots of tin, up to 90% in some cases. There is often copper or other metal in a babbitt alloy, but used in small quantities to sweeten a pot of boolit metal it won't matter.
Sometimes you luck out and find billets and ingots of Babbitt from sawmills, machine-repair shops, antique tractor shows, etc.
IMHO- and I use range scrap and wheelweights- if you are using range scrap, just assume it's pure lead, and add 2% tin by weight. Sure, it's not scientific. Sure, there's probably other metals in there. But if you get a little more or less it won't affect you that much. A touch of tin helps bullets get nice fillout a lot.
If your range uses a lot of jacketed bullets odds are it's as close to pure lead as to not matter anyway. If they also allow cast boolits in there you'll be getting antimonious lead, probably wheel-weights.
Antimony is what makes lead hard, and can get harder by water-quenching.
Tin makes lead flow smoother when melted, so that it will fill up the mold better.
Well, they also have other properties, and do the same things somewhat, but simply put, that's why we want tin and antimony in lead for bullets.
If you're casting .38 specials, .45 acps, and other slow moving projectiles, you can get by with less antimony and tin. 50-50 mix of range lead and wheel weights is great for that.
If you are casting 9mm or .357 or something like that, higher velocity, straight wheel weights, maybe water quenched if needed, will do the trick.
Zeke/PA
Member
Bullseye308,
As a matter of fact I do.
Years back I acquired a quanity of 50/50 solder in bar form.
I of course used this alloy and pure lead to cast mostly bullets for the .38 Special with decent results.
I purchase bullets from Missouri Bullets these days however.
As a matter of fact I do.
Years back I acquired a quanity of 50/50 solder in bar form.
I of course used this alloy and pure lead to cast mostly bullets for the .38 Special with decent results.
I purchase bullets from Missouri Bullets these days however.
qajaq59
Member
Before you head out to buy any expensive tin, try casting the lead you have. It may be ok as is.
bullseye308
Member
Zeke, unfortunately I am not in a position to make you a fair offer, but if you list it for sale someone will, and that money could well buy you a bunch of Missouri Bullets.
- Status
Similar threads
