Whats best for night time (low light) defense?

[TimeIsRunninOut]

I am looking into night sights, lasers, flashlights and/or combination configurations. Night sights vs standard sights, lasers vs no-laser, flashlight rail-mounted vs hand held. All the handguns I have owned only gave lasers for options, therefor I stayed with iron sights.

 

[rcmodel]

I like night sights, Trijicon or Meprolite, but I don't have them on all my guns by any means.

To me, the single most important thing to take to a low-light gunfight is a good Surefire or other 100+ lumen TAC light. And not mounted on the gun.

You have to be able to see & identify the target before you should even think about pointing the gun at it.

And one of those lights will blind an opponent in dark conditions to the point he can't open his eyes and look directly at it. They are so bright it hurts!

rc

 

[jaydubya]

Perhaps my reasons for using laser sights does not apply to you -- yet. I am seventy-eight years old in pretty good shape. Without my glasses on, however, I cannot ever SEE the iron sights on my handguns, much less use them. I have three handguns equipped with Crimson Trace laser grips, and I can see that red dot without my glasses on just fine. I maintain my proficiency with iron sights (glasses on) as well as lasers weekly, always at 5-10 yards as SD/HD is my sole objective. With either sighting systems, my goal is to put 24 of 25 shots in the nine ring of a silhouette target.

I would not buy a handgun that Crimson Trace did not make grips for.

Cordially, Jack

 

[mustang_steve]

night sights. I prefer having the front sight a different color than the rears, it speeds up the sighting process greatly. Tritum preferred, but I'll take a good glow paint if those are unavailable.

Plus it's better than relying on the spill-off from your flashlight in hope of seeing your iron sights.

laser to me is a nice alternative since it does not require using the sights at all...place dot and shoot....but personally I think that's more work than using night sights.

 

[Shawn.L]

Night sights, whatever style you prefer, but bright

and in a sudden attack in a low light situation you will not be able to draw both a flashlight and a gun, or have time to draw a light first. A light is important and shouldnt be ignored by any stretch. Get a good light (surefire if you can) but know the odds of you using both gun and light in a civilian SD senerio are slim.

mounted lights have their own set of issues.

good quality training is more important than all of the above, invest in some and you will get a clearer picture of your needs and what works and when.

 

[Rexster]

A hand-held light is BEST; everything else pales in comparison. I work night shift big-city police patrol, and consider a good hand-held light to be more important than the handgun. I bring three hand-held lights to work with me: Surefire M3 Millenium, Surefire M2 Centurion, and Surefire 8N, the latter being rechargeable.

That being said, a weapon-mounted light is a good thing. I use a Surefire X200, one of the early ones, before they went to an A and B designation. Now that the X300 is out, the X200 may be out of production; my X200 still performs well, so I have not looked at the newer ones much.

I believe there is no such thing as hand-held light VERSUS weapon-mounted light. There are times that one does NOT want the light and gun to be pointing the same direction at the same time.

Night sights are a mixed blessing. Someone will probably post a rolling eyes smiley in response, but I am going to say it again: Night sights can betray your position to an adversary in the darkness, depending on how your weapon is oriented, and his relative position. I am not saying night sights are bad, because I am not; they can be an great, wonderful asset.

I have used, and really liked, the Heinie Straight 8 set-up.

Another set-up I use and like is a factory tritium front sight, paired with the standard non-tritium SIG rear sight, an old classic by now once well-known as the Von Stavenhagen rear sight.

Two glowing dots in the rear sight, meant to give the shooter a three-dot image, is not my cup of tea, generally, though I once had a Wilson Combat pistol with orange rear dots and a brighter, larger green front dot, that worked well.

I live fine without lasers, and have not looked much into that direction. One thing to keep in mind is that a laser will not allow one to hit a target better than any other system, if the shooter jerks the trigger during the pull. Plenty of folks get a good sight picture with regular sights, then jerk the gun during the trigger pull. A lasered target will be missed by such folks just as surely as the target acquired with iron sights.

One consideration with lasers is multiple shooters on the same side not knowing whose dot is whose, if both/all are aiming at the same target. A family or other type of team should keep that in mind. This factor is the main reason cited by my command staff as the reason officers with my PD are not allowed to use lasers on our weapons.

It is also very important to consider the sight-in distance with lasers. Bullets travel in an arc, but light moves in a virtually straight line. Moreover, "close enough" at 5 to 7 yards may not translate to a good point of aim/impact at 100 yards, with windage or elevation. Don't take a long shot, using a laser, if you have not practiced at that distance with the laser.

 

[Tacbandit]

Quote:
"Don't take a long shot, using a laser, if you have not practiced at that distance with the laser."


+1, Rexster.....
I would say that pretty much goes for any sighting system...Plain sights, night-sights, lasers, or even scopes. The fundamentals are still essential...Laser sights are great for those whose eyes aren't what they use to be...but they definitely aren't a substitute for practice. Sight picture, muzzle control,trigger control, breathing...are only mastered with practice. However, I don't believe that most people who use laser sights expect to hit something over in the next county, just because they have a laser. I like the laser option, in low-light, or any light. It works for a lot of folks.....

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Trijicon RMR miniature holosight for pistols.

 

[M2 Carbine]

Other.

A rail mounted laser/light like a Streamlight TLR-2, IMO, is the best thing going. Having a good hand held light along is also a good idea.

For instance,






I have been interested in gun mounted lasers and laser/lights for some years, since quality lasers, like Crimson Trace have been available.
I practice with lasers and laser/lights about three evenings a week (home range).
I have continuously try out combinations of night sights, lasers, laser/lights and hand held lights.
In every way, for HD in low light or darkness, the gun mounted laser/light beats everything else for speed and accuracy.

BUT... like anything else, there is a wrong way and a right way to use the equipment. And the right way must be learned and practiced to use the equipment effectively.

If you buy a laser, laser/light or hand held light, then put it on the night stand without regular practice and think you are good to go, you are just fooling yourself.

 

[M2 Carbine]

"Don't take a long shot, using a laser, if you have not practiced at that distance with the laser."

Don't take any shot if you don't know what you are doing.



The Crimson Trace lasers make the 2 inch revolvers deadly in low light, even when shooting from odd positions.

 

[okespe04]

Hand held flash light with night sights.

 

[M2 Carbine]

TimeIsRunninOut,
Call Crimson Trace, 800 442 2406, and ask for their FREE DVD. It will give you an idea of what the gun mounted laser is and is not.

 

[Mr.510]

I chose "other". I work swing shift and I'm a night owl - I rarely go to bed before 4:00am. 2/3 of the time that I'm awake it's dark outside. I also have exceptional night vision and have to wear sunglasses in daylight to prevent headaches.

My XD45C has Trijicon yellow/green night sights and a Lasermax guide rod laser. I carry it and a hand held tactical light 24/7. I think I'm going to get a weapon mounted light as well. Maybe a TLR-1. I need a light I can put on my Saiga .308 for bear/cougar defense and the option of snapping it onto my .45 would be nice.

I agree with what some have said regarding the need for a light that's not mounted to the gun. I will always carry a hand held light. I have played with a couple weapon mounted lights and I can see very well in a pitch black warehouse with the light/weapon pointed at the floor. I can see the argument of being surprised and pointing the light (and therefore gun) at something you should not. I do not see this being an issue for me, but then I don't need much light to see well. My wife is totally blind in low light and I think a weapon light would be a really bad idea for her.... and might get me shot!

 

[TimeIsRunninOut]

Thank you for your inputs and advice, I have been looking at the Surefire lights, either a G2 LED or a 6P LED. I also have been looking at the XS 24/7 sights (non big dot) or the Tru-glo TFO red front green back. I like the idea of straight 8's for easier alignment. Is the Von Stavenhagen, a concept of a glowing sight in front and a painted bar in the rear? It would make less to focus upon for night time, I will have to train no mater what when I do install new sights. Thanks again for all the information.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

First recognize that there are two different purposes here:

1. The first purpose is to see your target, if your target happens to be in low light. This is where a flashlight comes in. Lasers and night sights don't help in any way with this.

2. The second purpose is to "target" your target, or sight in correctly on your target, when YOU are in low light (and thus cannot make out your standard sights via silhouette). This is what night sights and/or lasers are for. Either or both. Take your pic. Flashlight doesn't help in any way with this.

I have a home defense pistol (CZ SP-01) that has night sights and a TLR-2 on it. So you've got a light to accomplish purpose #1, and the other two gizmos to accomplish purpose #2.

 

[bluetopper]

In my battles I use Laser sights when I'm on offense in stealth mode wearing my mall ninja outfit.

A flashlight mount when I'm on defense.

 

[XDShooter07]

I'm no expert but IMO just as there is no one gun that works for everyone. There is no one answer to this question that works for everyone. For instance, I live alone, so as far as home defense goes I have my XDM with night sights and a surefire handheld. If I hear someone breaking in my plan is to situate myself against a dark wall in my room with my night sights painted at the door, flashlight with me if I need it.....and not move. Someone who has kids living in the house will have different needs as they may need to move to their kids... Point being though, that's what works for me. What works for you is based on what you may or may not need to do given you experience a home invasion.

As far as self defense goes for carry however. I believe night sights and a laser as well as a small handheld flashlight can fit the bill for 99% of situations. If it's dark the laser gets you on target fast if you're rushed; the sights work if the laser doesn't. If it's daylight and you can't see the laser, the sights still work. You can turn the laser off if you're trying to hide. And, you have the flashlight if you need it.

As far as weapon mounted lights are concerned, I think they have a huge advantage in having a two hand hold on the gun. However, I think they limit your options so I prefer a separate light. I think weapon mounted lights are in their prime for police or military use where they are going to have the weapon pointed regardless, such as tactical teams.

 

[Ringer]

Night Sights - Meprolight/3 dot tritium green green
Flashlight - Handheld Surefire L4

 

[Cliph]

Crimson Trace for home defense.

Tritium for carry. I shoot thr nightstand G19 with CT frequently, but the G26 with nightsights is easier to conceal.

 

[Lonestar49]

I like night sights, Trijicon or Meprolite, but I don't have them on all my guns by any means.

*To me, the single most important thing to take to a low-light gunfight is a good Surefire or other 100+ lumen TAC light. And not mounted on the gun.

**You have to be able to see & identify the target before you should even think about pointing the gun at it.

And one of those lights will blind an opponent in dark conditions to the point he can't open his eyes and look directly at it. They are so bright it hurts!

rc

*, ** That's it in a nutshell

LEO's, etc., who practice such type drills, over and over, finger off trigger - safety-first, can exercise such methods with far more efficiency with a flashlight on the rail of the gun, pointing the way, without, hopefully, knee-jerking a shot when their light, and gun, both point at a surprised individual at the same time and restrain that trigger fingers position, until a positive ID is made or the_need presents itself for a shot/s, whereas, IF one has not practiced being put in front of "an element of surprise" over and over, this is where I fear a flashlight rail mounted gun pointing the way in a novice's hands can lead to an AD which will be seen as a ND if it is not the, or a, BG, but an innocent, be it a drunk, doped-up or even an injured person lost/confused, and older person with Alzheimer's, etc., in someones front or backyard, etc. when one's gun with light mounted both suddenly come in contact and the trigger finger, somehow, worked its way onto the trigger before spotting, let alone, an ID was possible and the shot just_happened by surprise..

Things go bump in the night is a truth. Just ask you heart and memory the last time you got "surprised" with just a flashlight-alone, no gun

OMMV,


Ls

 

[Rexster]

M2 Carbine, of course, you are right; no disagreement on that point. My statement about the laser was made because a laser will make a nice, if large, dot WAY out there, beyond which the shooter may have ever before fired a particular weapon, particularly a handgun. If a shooter does not pause to think about the range, he may be in for a surprise. Something like a .45 ACP has MUCH drop out past 75 yards.
Moreover, a laser may have been dialed in at a typical 15-yard indoor range; a fraction of an inch error at 15 yards could be several inches at long rage.

Don't scoff at defensive shooting 'way out there; the last murder scene I worked involved a bad guy getting out of his vehicle a block away, and lobbing .40 rounds at some people at an outdoor burger stand. The distance was over 70 yards. Two lessons: Know where your gun shoots at longer range, and don't cut in line at a burger joint!

 

[Deanimator]

I like the night sights on my Glock 19. I also have several flashlights.

I will NEVER use a firearm mounted light, since I'd just need another hand held one to go with it, negating its supposed advantage of giving you an "extra" free hand.

I don't point guns at unidentified targets. To use a firearm mounted light, that's EXACTLY what you have to do.

 

[dmazur]

Crimson Trace grips with a hand-held flashlight.

There's lots of different opinions about this, but I want to be able to identify the target first, without necessarily pointing the gun at it.

Also, I don't have a dedicated "home" gun and use the same 1911 for CCW.

I've looked at 1911's with rails, but I just can't quite go there...

 

[chris in va]

Personally I think a handheld flashlight and gun mounted laser would be ideal. Recent report of an older gentleman mistaking his fiancee for an intruder and shooting her in the bedroom doorway. He didn't have a flashlight for identification.

 

[Steve C]

IMO night sights have the best advantage. They are no hinderance in daylight and add no bulk to your pistol. Bringing the gun to normal shooting position brings the slights into line. they are a great aid in low light conditions when shooting at a blacked out or back lit target. There could be times when the cover of darkness gives you an advantage, specially over an adversary that's illuminated partially by another light source.

Lasers require you to "hunt" for the dot, can alert the oponent that they are being targeted, and in foggy or dusty conditions can reveal your location.

Flashlights while useful in finding your way or identifying targets in the dark give away your position and if faced with an armed opponent will likely draw fire. With a detached flashlight you can move the source away from your body or roll it into a darkened room to expose a potential threat without providing a beacon of your location.

As to night sights giving away your position it would be hightly unlikely. If you can see the glow from night sights at anthing beyond perhaps 6' then you could see the glow from a person wrist watch with phosphore hands and have eyes sensitive enough to pick just about anything out in darkness. If using night vision I'm sure that night sights would light up but it the oponent has night vision they already have a great advantage and the glow of night sights would be your least worry.